Mop wasn't a very good expansion...

[Forsedar]

Lack of interesting raids

I've raided all content on both LFR, Normal and Heroic this expansion (except H ToT, as I had real life things). I can definitely say that this expansion has had a lot of interesting content with great mechanics. There was no lack of anything when it came to raiding.

Lack of creative raid mechanics

Quite a few bosses had great mechanics, like Ambershaper for instance. Tortos was also unique. Lei Shen was pretty unique as well. I think I can go down the list and point out over a dozen bosses with unique mechanics. Thok, Siegecrafter, etc.

• Asian style theme not fitting for the WoW universe

• Why is the 'Asian' theme not fitting? Pandarians existed in WoW lore so it wasn't crazy for them to have their own culture. Most zones have their own themes/styles that are derived from different cultures across the world. Just hit every zone in Azeroth and outlands and you will see all of the cultures.
  

  Major emphasis on panda bears

  I agreed with this before everything fit together at the end. I mean we're conquering a foreign soil, changing the way they think and introducing them to new technologies.
  

  Terrible, complicated gearing system / ilvl system

  I'm not quite sure whats complicated about the gearing system. The higher the number the better? 566 > 553. It was pretty straight forward. I agree it got out of hand but it wasn't confusing.
  

  Instant gratification gear catch up system

  I'm not a fan of catch ups either.
  

  9 months of SoO and counting...

  Eh, I don't really mind right now. I still want more BoA weapons.

[Queen of Hamsters]

This although Cata wasn't all that good. At launch it was decent but felt a bit dull and grindy. I mean I could put effort into raiding and doing instances but not when I know Im gonna get the gear for free anyway if i just wait a few months. I think Wrath before the end of the Ulduar patch was about as close as you can get to the "golden age" of WoW.

In your opinion.

To me, the golden age of WoW = present, when I'm having the most fun. If WoD tops it, it'll be the golden age for me. I loved WOTLK, but it's nowhere close to the golden age of WoW in my book. I have felt like it's been trumped many times over as I've experienced something new, seen new zones, made new progression and so on.

Sure, if one goes purely by subscribers, there's a "golden age" but I've never been one to let what others feel dictate how I feel. Was plenty of complaining going on during WOTLK as well about how bad it was compared to TBC <.<

[jbombard]

For me MoP was probably was better than Cata, but that hurdle was so low you could trip and fall over it. MoP was the xpack that made me lose hope in MMORPGs, Wildstar was the game that rekindled that hope. It feels great to actually have a sense of danger out in the world.

[Deleted]

In your opinion.

To me, the golden age of WoW = NOW, when I'm having the most fun. If WoD tops it, it'll be the golden age for me. I loved WOTLK, but it's nowhere close to the golden age of WoW in my book. I have felt like it's been trumped many times over as I've experienced something new, seen new zones, made new progression and so on.

Nah it's not my opinion, they had the most subscribers then too. Cata and MoP are obviously less popular because they've lost so many players.

It's great that you like it but why did you even start playing it during Wrath or earlier if you thought it was bad? I mean I don't start playing games that suck in my opinion thinking "well, I really hope they make them better in like 3 years". It's not a few minor changes either, MoP is a completely different game.

[Archiul]

Speaking from a PvP perspective, MoP murdered it. Too many changes are not good for PvP because of balance. If you add more, there are more things to balance and more things to screw up. They added too much, couldn't handle those changes when they didn't work. Now they are pruning for WoD but adding new stats that will be very hard to balance just like mastery in Cata (it changed the game drastically for some classes). New abilities, when not added in bulk can be balanced but some mechanics should be available only to some classes and not everyone.

As a pvper, while I realise there were balance issues back in Wotlk but they were never this frustrating and obivious. (shadowmourne dk/warrior was too good. didn't mean they weren't destroyed in higher ratings by a good RMP though) Noone had everything, and some things were just hard to do. Adding more always complicates things in the pvp part of this game, sadly they are not aware of it. While I can only speak for my friends, who are pvpers, they left because of this and that number is not a small number. I'm pretty sure most of the lost subs are from the pvp community, because it shows.

Back in wotlk days (and bc, vanilla) changes weren't this often. We didn't see major changes on a weekly basis and new abilities added mid expansion (surely that explains some things about balance). Sure, there were op things that were left untouched, but it wasn't THAT big of a deal. Frustrating, yes. But definitely not gamebreaking. This aspect of the game needs to come back in my humble opinion.

[Arkuri]

Totally agree. Ilvl does it now so much more efficiently.

I wouldn't go THAT far, but it is an improvement.

It's happened more times than not, I usually just wait to see what the player is going to be playing like, and what data shows.

Item Levels and Achievements don't really tell you anything. Sure, they've done it. Sure they've got that item. Chances are, they did their part. But in several cases. People clearly either bought something, or, got carried. It happens ALOT more then it should.

[Deleted]

It should be noted that they are not simply "pandas," just as murlocs are not "Fish." It is an oversimplification, and usually a tell-tale sign that the person has a bias that is unfounded in reason.

If they were kangaroos teaching ancient maori box in ancient Melbourne, would you correct people they are not kangaroos but in fact kangaroen?

They are pandas, bipedal and intelligent, but still pandas. Pandas (sorry pandaren) in Draenor are like Mickey Mouse in Gotham.

[Queen of Hamsters]

Nah it's not my opinion, they had the most subscribers then too. Cata and MoP are obviously less popular because they've lost so many players.

It's great that you like it but why did you even start playing it during Wrath or earlier if you thought it was bad? I mean I don't start playing games that suck in my opinion thinking "well, I really hope they make them better in like 3 years". It's not a few minor changes either, MoP is a completely different game.

Again, numbers don't change how the individual feels. EVERYTHING with a lifespan, has the same existential curve as WoW has had. Or do you really like an artist because it has 1 million more views than another artist, instead of basing your opinion on what YOU feel?

Going by numbers, there's a "golden age". Going by what the individual thinks, there will always be different opinions on when the golden age was to them. Objectively, WoW was the most successful at a certain point. Doesn't mean it's bad now all of a sudden for a fact, since that's ALSO on a personal level and people just like to assume that people unsubbing do so for reasons that fit the complainers own opinion.

And I'm not sure what you mean with the "Why did you even start playing it during Wrath"-part...are you suggesting that not hailing something as "the best ever" must mean that I didn't LIKE it?

I've loved this game since I began playing...and no, MoP is not a completely different game to me. Changes have been made, but it still feels VERY much like World of Warcraft when I login.

- - - Updated - - -

If they were kangaroos teaching ancient box in ancient Melbourne, would you correct people they are not kangaroos but in fact kangaroen?

They are pandas, bipedal and intelligent, but still pandas. Pandas (sorry pandaren) in Draenor are like Mickey Mouse in Gotham.

Yeah, because the Warcraft universe has always been dark and gloomy with no fun in it...

They're no worse than gnomes really, plenty of people find gnomes too silly for comfort.

[Tech Priest Bojangles]

I didn't think it was too bad. The primary reason I believe people wrinkle their noses at it is the overall theme.

To me personally, I loved the theme. I really like feudal china/asia. I thought the architecture was beautiful, MSV/ToES/ToT Art was amazing. I think Blizzard did a fantastic job at making MoP look great but no matter how pretty it was they could never make it feel right. MoP should have been some standalone game they made on the side, never a part of WoW. I hate these pandas with a passion and I wish they would have at least went the Tuskarr route by making them NPCs only. I know Pandaren have been part of the lore for a long time but they should have been one of the many parts of wow lore that will never see the light of day. Samwise is on the permanent shitlist for making such eyesores.

[Deleted]

Again, numbers don't change how the individual feels. EVERYTHING with a lifespan, has the same existential curve as WoW has had. Or do you really like an artist because it has 1 million more views than another artist, instead of basing your opinion on what YOU feel?

Going by numbers, there's a "golden age". Going by what the individual thinks, there will always be different opinions on when the golden age was to them.

And I'm not sure what you mean with the "Why did you even start playing it during Wrath"-part...are you suggesting that not hailing something as "the best ever" must mean that I didn't LIKE it?

I've loved this game since I began playing...and no, MoP is not a completely different game to me. Changes have been made, but it still feels VERY much like World of Warcraft when I login.

Well it feels more like "Panda: Island Adventure" to me.. it's not really WoW. Besides there is nothing to do even if I would get past the Asian theme. I play MMOs because they're supposed to be social, I don't play them to solo or play with a bunch of people who almost never even say a word and might just as well be NPCs..

[CheeseSandwich]

I wouldn't go THAT far, but it is an improvement.

It's happened more times than not, I usually just wait to see what the player is going to be playing like, and what data shows.

Item Levels and Achievements don't really tell you anything. Sure, they've done it. Sure they've got that item. Chances are, they did their part. But in several cases. People clearly either bought something, or, got carried. It happens ALOT more then it should.

Yeah I'm not really a fan of it, to many ways to cheat the system to make it seem like your ilvl is higher than it really is, bypassing a lot of constraints put in place.

But having said that, as higher ilvl usually means more power, and more power in WoW generally trumps other things, an Ilvl is set for pugs as a power threshold to ensure a certain level of overgearing.

All gearscore and ilvl did, really, was kill the phrase "LFM for XXX, come to north bank for inspection", and ilvl was necessary for xrealm grouping to happen with automation.

[Queen of Hamsters]

Well it feels more like "Panda: Island Adventure" to me.. it's not really WoW. Besides there is nothing to do even if I would get past the Asian theme. I play MMOs because they're supposed to be social, I don't play them to solo or play with a bunch of people who almost never even say a word and might just as well be NPCs..

Again, your opinions, if it's not WoW to you then that's fine. It's very much still World of Warcraft for a fact though, despite you and others not liking the direction it has taken in theme for one expansion. It's like saying that the darker themes of Harry Potter didn't make the books feel like Harry Potter, when it was the very CREATOR of the story that decided what direction the story would move in. The creators of WoW are bringing the game in different directions and some people like it, others don't. Doesn't change what the game is called and what you do in it in terms of gameplay.

Tbf, anyone thinking that MoP was all about Pandaren, can't have experienced much of it. The first patch was a lot with factions and learning the history of the Pandaren and other friendly races, after that it was about war coming to the shores of Pandaria, a new enemy with trolls and Mogu and dinosaurs and after that Garrosh being a bastard.

I'm having tons to do and I play with people, hardly ever pugs. There's stuff for soloing and pugging, but to me the most worthwhile content is in proper raiding and for that I want a proper guild with people I enjoy being around. WoW is as social as the individual makes it really in my experience as a shy and introvert person in general.

[timmytompadderham]

ToT rivaled Ulduar in quality and as a whole the expansion had very challenging encounters in t14 and 15 if you did them at appropriate/below appropriate ilvls. Further refined the raiding structure to include another large subset of people with flexible mode. Some of the best raid encounters to date including Lei Shen, Seigecrafter Blackfuse and Spirit Kings/Elegon/Will of the Emperor.

Yep, gonna chalk this one up as a loss folks...

[Queen of Hamsters]

ToT rivaled Ulduar in quality and as a whole the expansion had very challenging encounters in t14 and 15 if you did them at appropriate/below appropriate ilvls. Further refined the raiding structure to include another large subset of people with flexible mode. Some of the best raid encounters to date including Lei Shen, Seigecrafter Blackfuse and Spirit Kings/Elegon/Will of the Emperor.

Yep, gonna chalk this one up as a loss folks...

Not to mention the tons of stuff to do outside of raiding, regardless of whether or not individuals find those things to be of interest or not.

As someone taking part in most everything the game offers (but staying a way from pug content as much as I can), MoP has offered me the most stuff to do outside of raiding of all expansions I've experienced.

I even remember 5.3 fondly, loved seeing all the activity in Northern Barrens and seeing people go after the elites! Lots of fun in the chat apart from when trolls came online and people grouping up to help one another.

[Kathranis]

Should've made this a poll. I've found that, apart from an initially overwhelming number of daily quests and the valor gear locked behind reputations, people have been extremely positive about this expansion as a whole. The only notable complaint left is about the lack of new content during the wait for the next expansion, which is nothing new.

I, for one, loved it, in part because I've personally had more time and opportunities to do the content. This is the first expansion where I've done all the raids, killed all the rares, maxed all the reputations, etc., and I thoroughly enjoyed pretty much every part of it, from Jade Forest to the Siege of Orgrimmar.

[timmytompadderham]

Not to mention the tons of stuff to do outside of raiding, regardless of whether or not individuals find those things to be of interest or not.

As someone taking part in most everything the game offers (but staying a way from pug content as much as I can), MoP has offered me the most stuff to do outside of raiding of all expansions I've experienced.

I would give them an A for effort on trying to expand the game outside of raids and rated pvp. There's a bit for fun little stuff for everyone. I'm really sad the Brawlers guild won't be coming back (so far i guess). Challenge modes for those into more serious 5man, close -knit groups. Not sure how I feel on pet battles. I just started them and leveling is just a nuisance atm.

Obviously lessons learned in dailies and Timeless Isle system needed some fine tuning, but WoD should build from some of these things.

[Arkuri]

Yeah I'm not really a fan of it, to many ways to cheat the system to make it seem like your ilvl is higher than it really is, bypassing a lot of constraints put in place.

But having said that, as higher ilvl usually means more power, and more power in WoW generally trumps other things, an Ilvl is set for pugs as a power threshold to ensure a certain level of overgearing.

All gearscore and ilvl did, really, was kill the phrase "LFM for XXX, come to north bank for inspection", and ilvl was necessary for xrealm grouping to happen with automation.

When I was playing... Pretty sure I was the only person who would set up pugs with "If you know the fight, feel free to come along. If not, you're getting kicked, because it will be obvious if you don't. Takes 2 minutes to watch a Youtube video of the fight while numlock flying."

[wych]

I enjoyed MoP, but so much focus on raiding, and the current model of LFR/Flex means that players burn through content WAY too fast.

[Grumar]

I'll put it this way MoP is the only expansion that has made me take huge breaks from wow, and even had me considering canceling my subscription, in other words I hated it. Too many dailies in start of expansion, pvp (what i do most) just being garbage due to every class being a self healer and having too many CC's. PvE i get to wait 45mins to get into a fail group of LFR because i made the mistake of wanting to be dps. I will say when i raided with my guild that was fun content but that was only 3 nights a week and i play wow a lot more than three nights a week....

[Einsz]

MoP was ok till SoO, the boss mechanics are just annoying, boring and I have had that "cba" feeling since the start of it. Timeless Isle is horrible not fun at all, feels like everyone is running around like headless chicken trying to get auto attack on the rares. And the worst part that content has been out for 9 months with nothing on horizon for half more year.
Past SoO MoP was okish had some fun playing it but nothing really special.