Expansion #6, Instead of a new Class...

[shoc]

I know the topic has been beaten to death, but I feel like it's a good discussion to have when considering the options for the next expansion. WoD had the model updates, which are great, but come the next expansion people are going to start wanting something fresh and new. Usually, this comes in the form of a new race, or a new class, but honestly I think any new class that Blizzard adds to the game is going to feel forced and there aren't any real good candidates for a new race, other than Ogres for the Horde and Arrakoa for the Alliance.

That's why I am suggesting that for the 6th WoW expansion, Blizzard introduces a 4th specialization to each class, excluding Druids because they are already special snowflakes. We are already seeing Blizzard push the boundaries of some specializations when you look at what is planned for the Warrior for WoD, they are getting a Gladiator stance that will allow them to viably sword and board DPS. I say, take it one step further, and implement it all as a new, 4th spec.

An point to note is that with WoD implementing the new armor system, where the primary stats change based on your specialization, this means that no matter what primary stat the fourth spec uses, there will be no change in gear competitiveness compared to pre-4th spec.

Here are my suggestions:

Warrior - Gladiator: Sword and Board DPS, based on the Gladiator Stance introduced in Warlords of Draenor. Damage is based on a modified Protection rotation, with Shield Block being replaced by Shield Charge.

Hunter - Primal: Dual Wield Melee DPS, based on Rexxar and the Warcraft RPG Beastmasters, are fighters who battle in close quarters alongside their animal companions. As ranged weapons are not equipped, Primal Hunters gain a set of melee abilities, while retaining the ability to tame and make use of exotic pets.

Druid - N/A

Rogue - Ranger: Ranged DPS, based on the Warcraft RPG Rangers and Sentinels, are stealthy fighters who wait in the shadow for the perfect moment to fire an arrow into their enemies heart. Still capable of stealth, but incapable of using their melee attacks, Rangers gain a set of ranged abilities but still retain their core themes, such as poisoning their arrows and firing incapacitating shots.

Warlock - Demon Hunter: Tank, based on the Glyph of Demon Hunting, which grants Warlocks with the ability Dark Apotheosis, which allows Warlocks to tank. The usual Dark Apotheosis abilities and rotations remain, but gain a set of defensive and threat increasing abilities as well as proper taunts.

Shaman - Geomancy: Tank, based on the Earth elemental which acts as a tank, utilizes earth based abilities, such as Rockbiter weapon to increase threat. Geomancers gain a set of defensive abilities and taunts in order to effectively tank.

Mage - Abjuration: Damage mitigation Healer, based on the Warcraft description of Abjuration "Abjuration is the study of protective magic and one of the most important schools for a young mage to study." Mages apply wards and shields on their allies in order to prevent damage, as well as weaving time to undo damage done to their targets.

Priest - Inquisitor: Melee DPS, based on the Scarlet Inquisitors, these priests twist the holy light to torment its foes, using melee weapons to attack the flesh and holy magic to destroy the mind, Inquisitors gain a set of holy based melee abilities, while continuing to use existing abilities such as Smite.

Paladin - Exorcist: Ranged DPS, based on goold old Shockadins. Not much explaining to do here, holy shock, denounce, judgement, offensive word of glory, hammer of wrath, the abilities are already here, simply create beneficial masteries and make small modifications to make a functioning rotation.

Death Knight - Necromancer: Ranged DPS, based on the Necromancers of the Scourge. These death knights seek to enhance their domination over lesser undead, and master the dark art of necromancy. While continuing to use existing DK abilities such as Frost Fever/Blood Plague, death coil, death and decay, and army of the dead, Necromancers choose from an array of undead minions to summon, such as Abominations, Bone Golems and Crypt Fiends. Instead of melee attacks, they channel their dark magic through staves.

Monk - Firedancer: Ranged DPS, based on the celestial Chi-ji. Those who learn the fighting style and teachings of the Red Crane become Firedancers, Monks who can channel powerful fire based attacks from a distance. Abilities include spells such as Firestorm, Blazing Song and Crane Rush.


Any feedback is appreciated. I know plate wearing necromancers seems kind of weird, but I think it could be pretty cool. Other than that I think it all feels pretty dang solid. Crossposted here.

[prwraith]

Hey these actually make some good sense. Noice.

+1

I like how they're all radical departures from the original 3

[Nemesiz]

The hunter one sounds a tad bland, like an enhancement shammy without spells, but with pets.

But it was a good read, I respect the effort put into this.

[SinAscendant]

If only this wouldn't make balancing the game a whole fuckton harder and be 3x as much dev time as a new class (9 specs = 3 new classes)

[Sesto]

I don't think "Ranger" is a good idea for the Rogues. Especially considering what you described is basically the Survival spec for Hunters.

The rest is pretty good, though. Especially liked the Necromancer spec for Death Knights. I wish Blizzard would have done that originally, instead of having 3 melee specs.

[Skeppio]

Sounds pretty cool (I'd be very happy to see tank Warlocks), and you've put a good amount of thought into it on the summaries alone. Nice work!

Also, Abjuration Mages sound kinda like how healing works on Malkorok. That'd be a pretty neat way to make them distinct healers from the rest.

[Highlight]

Not really much to add, but this is the first fouth spec suggestions that I've actually been okay with.

[shoc]

The hunter one sounds a tad bland, like an enhancement shammy without spells, but with pets.

But it was a good read, I respect the effort put into this.

I think with maintaining the ability to use traps and gadgets, Primal Hunters could be pretty neat. Also I think a lot of people would appreciate a Rexxar playstyle, something that I think was highly sought since WC3.

I don't think "Ranger" is a good idea for the Rogues. Especially considering what you described is basically the Survival spec for Hunters.

The rest is pretty good, though. Especially liked the Necromancer spec for Death Knights. I wish Blizzard would have done that originally, instead of having 3 melee specs.

I always considered Survival Hunters to be gadget users like Batman (maybe Green Arrow). Things like explosive shots and bola launchers. While my vision of rangers would be stealthy archers, perfect for Rogues, as they can make use of all of their poisons, sap from 40 yards, ambush shot, headshots, kidney shot, arrow to the knee, just Rogue style ranged abilities.

Besides, who doesn't want to sneak around with a bow, I played a Skyrim character like that and it was the most fun I've ever had.

[Saltysquidoon]

Death Knight - Necromancer: Ranged DPS, based on the Necromancers of the Scourge. These death knights seek to enhance their domination over lesser undead, and master the dark art of necromancy. While continuing to use existing DK abilities such as Frost Fever/Blood Plague, death coil, death and decay, and army of the dead, Necromancers choose from an array of undead minions to summon, such as Abominations, Bone Golems and Crypt Fiends. Instead of melee attacks, they channel their dark magic through staves.

Unholy the spec grew out of a proposed necromancer class then proposed necromancy tree for DKs. I agree that right now unholy is the weakest dk spec thematically right now and Blizz should do something about giving them more of a focus on summons (wild imps style passive summons, or a talent like the droods would be inline with Blizz' ability bloat fixation).
Having two trees that are essentially the same thing (unholy and necro) would be really redundant, a lot of work and I think you'd get a better result with less investment just by thematically strengthening unholy.

Also your mage idea is a disc priest and your primal hunter would make BM's only standout feature redundant (although it sounds fun). Other then the fact this would obviously never happen as this would be more work on the whole then making a new class a dropping this much content at once would be bad for business, I think you have a lot of inter and inner class redundancies in your proposed specs.

I do like you've picked up some of blizz's aborted ideas (like shammy tanks or melee hunters) and rewoven them in though.

[Musta]

With all due respect: no more bloating please, its already terrible.

[Therougetitan]

No, increasing the amount of specs will not make the classes more unique. It will actually homogenize them, because you can only have so many unique abilities to add and as expansions have gone on this has been evident. Regardless, here's my opinion on each spec.

Cons: Gladiator doesn't seem like enough to warrant a spec, Ranger is basically a survival hunter in theme. Firedancer doesn't seem like it would work since the crane stance is now a fistweaving stance for Mistweavers. Adjuration just seem like disc priests. Inquistor is just a monk essentially.

Pros: Demon hunter/Earth shaman tanking sounds good with enough to warrant their own spec and have long been desired. Necromancer sounds like it has potential with its pet and ranged theme. Exorcist sounds good, a ranged holy damage spec never really has been a thing outside of healing.

[Deleted]

I agree with them for the most part. Rogue is the only thing I'm abit meh on.. 4 damage specs sounds pretty bad. I'd much rather an evasion based tank for them.

[shoc]

Unholy the spec grew out of a proposed necromancer class then proposed necromancy tree for DKs. I agree that right now unholy is the weakest dk spec thematically right now and Blizz should do something about giving them more of a focus on summons (wild imps style passive summons, or a talent like the droods would be inline with Blizz' ability bloat fixation).
Having two trees that are essentially the same thing (unholy and necro) would be really redundant, a lot of work and I think you'd get a better result with less investment just by thematically strengthening unholy.

Also your mage idea is a disc priest and your primal hunter would make BM's only standout feature redundant (although it sounds fun). Other then the fact this would obviously never happen as this would be more work on the whole then making a new class a dropping this much content at once would be bad for business, I think you have a lot of inter and inner class redundancies in your proposed specs.

I do like you've picked up some of blizz's aborted ideas (like shammy tanks or melee hunters) and rewoven them in though.

Yeah, I feel like Unholy was supposed to be the Melee Necromancer, but instead just turned into disease + zombie. I think the Necromancer spec would be stronger if it was more thematically bone themed, like summon skeletons and shooting bone spikes like those annoying casters in Scholo.

And Abjuration Mage would need some work to differentiate itself from Disc Priest, but you could say the same for Holy Priests and Holy Paladins, and I feel like Beastmaster and Primal could both exist alongside each other as they fill different niches, those players who want pet based gameplay, melee vs ranged.

I'll disagree that adding a 4th spec to each class is more work than creating a whole new class, as in this case most of the existing abilities still apply. When creating a new class altogether, you need to consider baseline abilities, class and spec themes, ability synergies, gearing balances, while a 4th spec is something we are already seeing being phased in, take the Gladiator Stance for an example.

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No, increasing the amount of specs will not make the classes more unique. It will actually homogenize them, because you can only have so many unique abilities to add and as expansions have gone on this has been evident. Regardless, here's my opinion on each spec.

Cons: Gladiator doesn't seem like enough to warrant a spec, Ranger is basically a survival hunter in theme. Firedancer doesn't seem like it would work since the crane stance is now a fistweaving stance for Mistweavers. Adjuration just seem like disc priests. Inquistor is just a monk essentially.

Pros: Demon hunter/Earth shaman tanking sounds good with enough to warrant their own spec and have long been desired. Necromancer sounds like it has potential with its pet and ranged theme. Exorcist sounds good, a ranged holy damage spec never really has been a thing outside of healing.

Thanks for your criticism,

To me, I think that Assassination/Combat/Subtlety are not very unique thematically, and Gladiator to Protection is a large enough gap that would warrant it's own spec. I feel that the Red Crane as a theme has huge potential as fire based damage for monks, moreso than for fistweaving for mistweavers. I guess my OCD is calling Black Ox = Tank, White Tiger = Melee, Jade Serpent = Healer, Red Crane = ???, and Adjuration as a Mage spec has some opportunities for interesting healing mechanics, such as cauterizing allies, iceblocking allies (divine intervention 2.0), different shields for different kinds of incoming damage, etc. Inquisitor I haven't really given much thought, but I think stabbing people in the name of the light can be made unique as well.

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I agree with them for the most part. Rogue is the only thing I'm abit meh on.. 4 damage specs sounds pretty bad. I'd much rather an evasion based tank for them.

My other option for Rogue was Warden, Maiev style parry/avoidance tank, but I found Ranger to be a little more interesting, and sticking closer to the Assassin archetype than a tank would.

[Saltysquidoon]

And Abjuration Mage would need some work to differentiate itself from Disc Priest, but you could say the same for Holy Priests and Holy Paladins, and I feel like Beastmaster and Primal could both exist alongside each other as they fill different niches, those players who want pet based gameplay, melee vs ranged.

I'll disagree that adding a 4th spec to each class is more work than creating a whole new class, as in this case most of the existing abilities still apply. When creating a new class altogether, you need to consider baseline abilities, class and spec themes, ability synergies, gearing balances, while a 4th spec is something we are already seeing being phased in, take the Gladiator Stance for an example.

I still feel that making an existing spec more fun would be a better result then making a new spec with lots of crossover, but that's a subjective thing so meh YMMV.

Holy priests and holy pallies both have the word holy in their names and they both focus on direct healing as opposed to hots or absorbs other then that they play very differently.

4th spec isn't being phased in droods have always had 4 specs since vanilla they just cleaved feral in half there was almost no work to do and glad stance is not really anything close to a new spec (Edit; as it stands with blizz proposed way of implementing it, a dps sword and board style certainly has enough thematic and mechanical room to be a spec) it's just a damage bump so you can quest like dps a with a sword and board.
I mean look at the hunter spec; If you go the lazy way and just rename skills and give them a new icon (arcane shot is now arcane slash) you have a reskinned bm which isn't a big enough difference to warrant being a new spec. If you do it the 'right way' by giving them new abilities (which you would certainly have to do with the tank shaman for example) then making 10 specs with new abilities is going to be more work then a new class with 3 specs.

[Dellis0991]

shoc these spec ideas makes sense I especially like the Hunter's spec give me back raptor strike and mongoose and I will be a happy boy

[rcshaggy]

I would actually want to see the Demon Hunter class on its own.
Other than that I do like your ideas for the specs Shoc.

[Deleted]

Expansion #6 will be return to Northend, but in a different timeline. It will remove all abilities except auto attack and the only feature will be a pet stable where you can customise your battle pets with new skins and hats purchasable through Blizzard store.

[Mormolyce]

Not to piss on parades, but IMO Blizzard regrets having three specs, if they had it over again there'd probably be fewer rather than more.

Death Knight - Necromancer: Ranged DPS, based on the Necromancers of the Scourge. These death knights seek to enhance their domination over lesser undead, and master the dark art of necromancy. While continuing to use existing DK abilities such as Frost Fever/Blood Plague, death coil, death and decay, and army of the dead, Necromancers choose from an array of undead minions to summon, such as Abominations, Bone Golems and Crypt Fiends. Instead of melee attacks, they channel their dark magic through staves.

Or like, the original Death Knights, who were ranged casters equivalent to Human Mages.

Always thought they missed an opportunity by having no ranged DK spec.

[deviantcultist]

Priest - Inquisitor: Melee DPS, based on the Scarlet Inquisitors, these priests twist the holy light to torment its foes, using melee weapons to attack the flesh and holy magic to destroy the mind, Inquisitors gain a set of holy based melee abilities, while continuing to use existing abilities such as Smite.

Melee DPS for Priests is a bad idea imo. Lorewise, Priest do not need to twist the Light to bend it into offense and the Light cannot be used to destroy a mind, as that is a Shadow role.

Therefore, an Inquisitor themed Holy Ranged DPS sounds neat.

[Rilas13]

First I do like the idea, I have heard it before. In the past I have seen a Priest holy damage spec just at range instead of Melee. Admittedly melee makes more sense if they are going to add something just to give more variety. I do like the idea of a lot of it just based on I don't want any more classes introduced but I have wanted a Ranger class that is pet-less since launch. I am not sure why Hunter didn't already have this spec but oh well.

Despite my opinion that this would be a fun way to add to the game I am worried that these changes would only further the homogenization of the classes. I have thought Locks & Shaman's would be good tanks for awhile, Mage's logical step would be to add a heal type and having a second class based on these support heals would be awesome(Disc Priest filling a specific roll compared to the rest of the heals out there).

Again I like these ideas quite a bit, and if they could be implemented without too much overlap then I am on board. Definitely do all of these changes before thinking about adding another class. But if the option is to not add anything it might be better for the game. Which is probably why blizz isn't adding anything for 6.0. If the remaining playerbase demands something new for 7.0 though then yes bring it on.