Vulcans versus Jedi

[Merite]

Pretty sure this is the plot of Star Wars VII.

I'd imagine it's far easier to resist a mind trick than it is to trick someone. Also, I'm not sure if the whole 'clouded by the dark side' means that the Jedi were susceptible to 'Jedi mind tricks' from the dark side, seems like something else entirely to me.

As far as the force goes, it just seems intelligence is the primary factor to resistance, so the Vulcans would be immune fairly by default. On the other hand, some Jedis honestly don't seem even remotely intelligent (the prequels are trash), so if we're talking a sly cunning, well spoken, intelligent Vulcan versus an unintelligent Jedi, possibly, you can outthink a fool fairly easily, Jedi or not. However, I'd imagine even the most idiotic of Jedis would be immune to mind tricks from the force, so perhaps the force also might grant them resistance..?

So perhaps Vulcans could trick Jedi, or perhaps neither would win. Don't see Jedis tricking Vulcans. Killing on the other hand..no problem.


Not really super into either, sorry if I butchered some lore or something.

[heroim]

as far as mind melds go likely wouldent have a snow balls chance in hell of working jedi have very strong mental defenses to the point that when luke tried to probe coran horn, who would later become a jedi master, for information about the force vision he had of his wife being kidnapped he was knocked unconscious and thrown across the room and horn doesnt even have the ability to use telekinesis so luke was thrown back by simply taping into horns mind

[Hammerfest]

How about a Jedi's telepathic mental prowess versus a Betazoid or a Talosian?

[Ellixen]

Remember guys, books never happened. So going by what we know from the movies which is only the weak minded are affected by jedi mind tricks... then I see vulcans as having the higher mental discipline. My proof for this is just because you're a jedi doesn't mean you have a strong mind ie. Anakin in the prequel trilogies where as a vulcans are pretty much born with an incredibly strong mind.

[heroim]

Remember guys, books never happened. So going by what we know from the movies which is only the weak minded are affected by jedi mind tricks... then I see vulcans as having the higher mental discipline. My proof for this is just because you're a jedi doesn't mean you have a strong mind ie. Anakin in the prequel trilogies where as a vulcans are pretty much born with an incredibly strong mind.

a jedi could simply influence a volcans biology so that the pong far begins and then all his mental discipline is gone
of a jedi could triger a mental breakdown similer to Bendii Syndrome that causes the volcan to lose controle of his mental abilities resulting in being totaly lost in 1s emotions

[Glazed]

What? Expanded universe is all canon.

Not for the upcoming sequels.
Only canon are the six films released and The Clone Wars animated television show which George Lucas produced.

Speaking of the show, Jedi mind control is actually from canon. A strong willed bounty hunter was controlled by the combined efforts of Anakin, Obi Wan, and Mace Windu into giving up information that was otherwise inextricable.

[Dispersedshadow]

People are still only looking at this from a fighting point of view. all this thread is about is who has more mental discipline.

I think the problem is you haven't really set parameters for what "mental discipline" involves. Does it involve only purely mental actions? — as we've noted, the Mind Meld requires some hand movement and speech, so it's not solely mental. The Jedi have something akin to telekinesis which usually involves gestures as well.

If we are talking purely mental discipline - perhaps the greatest example of that is when certain Jedi meditate in order to transcend their bodily form and become one with The Force.

[Korgoth]

If you chop off a Vulcan's hands he cannot do a mind meld. Jedi win.

Also could the Jedi not just make Jedi Vulcans!

[Dispersedshadow]

Also could the Jedi not just make Jedi Vulcans!

Depends if the **sob** Midi- **George, how could you** -chlorians **sob** are compatible with Vulcan physiology.

[Dhrizzle]

So comparing the two based on mental discipline. I believe that Vulcans are disciplined enough to resist jedi mind games, however I think the Jedi would still fall victim to vulcan mind melds and logic.

Jedi are mystical space ninjas with laser-swords, they are immune to logic.

[Fang7986]

What? Expanded universe is all canon.

no it's not they announced that when the announced ep 7,8 and 9

[Fullmetal89]

no it's not they announced that when the announced ep 7,8 and 9

Which was bullshit because George Lucas had stated in the past that the expanded universe was canon as far as he was concerned. Then once they sold to Disney, they seem to forget all that.

[OrcsRLame]

Depends if the **sob** Midi- **George, how could you** -chlorians **sob** are compatible with Vulcan physiology.

Midi-chlorians have almost nothing to do with the Force. Every living being has them, but even if they didn't that just means that the Vulcans wouldn't be able to hear the will of the Force. So basically, they wouldn't get crazy visions or be able to see the future like Anakin. It's not like they're a big deal, or even all that useful.

People need to pay more attention to Qui-Gon.

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Which was bullshit because George Lucas had stated in the past that the expanded universe was canon as far as he was concerned. Then once they sold to Disney, they seem to forget all that.

Lucas stated the opposite of that twice, many years ago. He said his Star Wars is a different universe from the books/games/everything else, and that he's never in his life read even a single Star Wars book. The expanded universe has been non-canon since like 2004.

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People are still only looking at this from a fighting point of view. all this thread is about is who has more mental discipline.

You should make that more clear in your opening post then. I'd recommend providing more details, like which characters you're comparing specifically.

If you're comparing random Vulcan A to random Jedi B, I'd go with the Vulcan for having stronger will. If we're going with EU Sidious vs anyone, he mind controls their whole race, and the Federation for shits and giggles.

[Deleted]

Jedi Would win.

Stupid Vulcans could not even stop there planet being destroyed by a time travelling mad man and some red liquid. (IE Kill him in the current time line, problem ceases to exists, "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few")


Also, the Jedi Have Lightsabers that go "Woom Voom Hoom"

[Combatbutler]

So comparing the two based on mental discipline. I believe that Vulcans are disciplined enough to resist jedi mind games, however I think the Jedi would still fall victim to vulcan mind melds and logic.

Just to remind people that this is about mental discipline and not fighting prowess.

I'd say they cancel each other out, it is unlikely for a mind meld to work against the Jedi's will and equally unlikely for a mind trick to work on a vulcan.

[Angella]

So comparing the two based on mental discipline. I believe that Vulcans are disciplined enough to resist jedi mind games, however I think the Jedi would still fall victim to vulcan mind melds and logic.

Irrelevant. Vulcans can't pick people up with their minds and throw them across a room. Also light sabers.

[Fullmetal89]

Lucas stated the opposite of that twice, many years ago. He said his Star Wars is a different universe from the books/games/everything else, and that he's never in his life read even a single Star Wars book. The expanded universe has been non-canon since like 2004.

Lucasfilms considers primary canon to be only the nine live action movies, Star Wars: The Clone Wars, and Star Wars Rebels, since George Lucas worked on them directly.^[13]The Holocron is an internal database maintained by Lucas Licensing for the express purpose of trying to maintain continuity within all licensed products.^[14] The Holocron was originally sorted into four levels of canon, reflecting LFL's canon and continuity policies: G, C, S, and N. A fifth level, T, was recently instituted and comprises the CGI series Star Wars: The Clone Wars and the currently untitled live action Star Wars television series which has yet to begin any form of production. See the article on Star Wars canon for greater detail.

• G (George Lucas) canon is absolute canon. This category includes the final releases of the six films, the novelizations of the films, the radio dramas based on the films, the film scripts, and any material found in any other source (published or not) that comes directly from George Lucas himself. G canon outranks all other forms of canon.
• T (Television) canon, which currently comprises Star Wars: The Clone Wars and Star Wars Rebels. This level of canon is considered to take precedence over C canon (see below), possibly due to the fact that George Lucas is directly involved with these shows as executive producer, and in the case of The Clone Wars is also on the writing team. This level does not include any series before and including the Genndy Tartakovsky Clone Warsseries.
• C (continuity) canon refers to the main body of EU work, and is the next most authoritative level of canon. All material published under the Star Wars label that doesn't fall into either G, T, L, S, or N canon is C canon and is considered authoritative as long as it isn't contradicted by G or T canon.
• L (Legends) canon^[2] refers to any EU stories set after Return of the Jedi. These works were C canon until Disney announced that sequels would be made. They are now their own level with the same authority as S canon, and reprints will have a 'Legends' banner. Versions of characters and events from this level may show up in the primary storyline freely, making that specific element (not the whole story) C canon or higher.
• S (secondary) canon refers to older, less accurate, or less coherent EU works, which are immediately overwritten by anything in the main continuity of G and C canon, but are fully canon whenever they do not contradict something of higher canon. For example, this includes the popular Star Tours attraction, the MMORPG game Star Wars Galaxies, and certain elements of a few N-canon stories.
• N continuity material is also known as "non-canon" or "non-continuity" material. Lego Star Wars, "what-if" stories (such as those published under the Infinities label) and anything else that cannot at all fit into continuity is placed into this category. N canon is the only level that is truly non-canon.
• D (Detours) canon refers to the canon of the animated parody television series Star Wars Detours. Despite being completely distinguishable from N canon, it is still completely non-canon. D canon is typically also classified separate from the other forms of canon

From Wikipedia, it use to be considered canon as long as it didn't contradict GL's main works.

[Puupi]

I can't believe people actually discuss this or give it a thought...

[Gheld]

All the Star Wars fans seem to be forgetting something (which is official canon as of the publican of Star Wars Episode I) The force is just a bunch of microbes inside the Jedi's blood. In the Star Trek universe they have biofilters which can detect and remove unknown alien microbes. So Vulcans have access to the necessary technology to stop the force.

The end.

EDIT: Good ole Gene Roddenbury knew to pass on the reins when his shit started getting stale. George Lucas, however, wouldn't give up, and just made star wars stupider and stupider as the prequel trilogy went on. When I look at a star wars fan, I see Bambi begging his slain mother to wake up.

[OrcsRLame]

From Wikipedia, it use to be considered canon as long as it didn't contradict GL's main works.

I'm aware of the different levels of canon. Just because George Lucas's company recognized them, doesn't mean that he did. Lucas is the most hands off writer I've ever seen. He doesn't give a shit and probably doesn't even know about the various levels of canon. He just payed a guy to manage all that crap.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wa...tar_Wars_canon

"There are two worlds here," explained Lucas. "There’s my world, which is the movies, and there’s this other world that has been created, which I say is the parallel universe—the licensing world of the books, games and comic books. They don’t intrude on my world, which is a select period of time, [but] they do intrude in between the movies. I don’t get too involved in the parallel universe."

"STARLOG: "The Star Wars Universe is so large and diverse. Do you ever find yourself confused by the subsidiary material that's in the novels, comics, and other offshoots?"

LUCAS: "I don't read that stuff. I haven't read any of the novels. I don't know anything about that world. That's a different world than my world. But I do try to keep it consistent. The way I do it now is they have a Star Wars Encyclopedia. So if I come up with a name or something else, I look it up and see if it has already been used. When I said [other people] could make their own Star Wars stories, we decided that, like Star Trek, we would have two universes: My universe and then this other one. They try to make their universe as consistent with mine as possible, but obviously they get enthusiastic and want to go off in other directions.""

What his company says and what he says are totally different.

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All the Star Wars fans seem to be forgetting something (which is official canon as of the publican of Star Wars Episode I) The force is just a bunch of microbes inside the Jedi's blood. In the Star Trek universe they have biofilters which can detect and remove unknown alien microbes. So Vulcans have access to the necessary technology to stop the force.

The end.

EDIT: Good ole Gene Roddenbury knew to pass on the reins when his shit started getting stale. George Lucas, however, wouldn't give up, and just made star wars stupider and stupider as the prequel trilogy went on. When I look at a star wars fan, I see Bambi begging his slain mother to wake up.

That's not true. Listen to what Qui-Gon says instead of making things up. The Midi-Chlorians are not the Force, they do not create the Force, they are not a Jedi's connection to the Force. They tell us the will of the Force. That is their function. That is why Anakin has visions, because his Midi-Chlorian count is stupid high he hears the will of the Force in the form of visions of the future.

The Force is still an energy field that surrounds us, penetrates us and binds the galaxy together.