Going from 10man HC to 25man HC

[Deleted]

So after my guild downed Garrosh 10 Heroic for the first time, our 2 main tanks unsubscribed until WoD. However I still feel like farming the raid a few times and recently got to try-out for 25man guild that has Garrosh on farm status.

I pretty much know the 10man fights in and out and even managed to get some decent rankings, however I am VERY uncertain in 25man since it's the first time for me ever raiding that size. Consequently my dps sucked compared to 10 man since I am very much trying to play safe and not die.

So my question is : Is any of you playing a rogue and have experience in both 10 and 25 man? Which boss fights differ a lot from 10man and which are pretty much the same? Any special tasks rogue can fulfill in 25man?

Thanks in advance!

[Leih]

I have played my rogue in both sizes and, honestly, for the most part 25-man is even easier on an individual level, as a melee DPS at least. Every fight is much the same as 10-man from your perspective, except there are even more raid CDs to go around. You shouldn't need to do much different to your 10-man clears. The only real exceptions I can think of are the likes of Paragons, where there's more people in melee and so less space, meaning slightly more attention to be paid for mechanics like Xaril's explosions and Hisek's Aims. If you're used to being the only melee and not having to move out, that's something that will change in 25s.

Beyond that, there's really nothing much different, especially by today's standards of gear and DPS. Norushen has a slightly more complicated rotation if you want everyone taking portals and Siegecrafter needs a few people on the belt instead of just 1-2 (although it's a smaller percentage of your overall raid group, so in some ways it's easier too) but since most 10-man groups use the old 25-man strat of killing mines since the 10-man nerfs hit, chances are it's gonna be the same strat there too.

[Deleted]

Hey. As far as i am aware the fights arent too different in 25man vs 10man. A few differences i can think of are :

Immerseus is different in the way adds are tanked so you can spread out alot more and you will be assigned an area of adds just smash them in.

Protectors is the same.

Nourushen is the same.

Sha depends on the tactic. Most guilds who are farming 14/14 are probably stacking now anyway so not too much is different just more prisons which you should only really be assigned to the back 2 anyway.

Galakras more adds whoo BF cleave.

Iron Jug single target your ass off.

Shamans there is the spread tactic and stack version. Spread tactic is really easy for us just avoid the foul stream cloak is your friend. The stack version is a bit sketchy but if you stick on kadris you will be fine as long as you keep your eye out for where stream is

Nazgrim 3 adds rather than 2. Most should be tanked on top of the boss for cleave but you might be assigned to shaman stunning to prevent the totem drop but tbh anyone can do this without spending our precious cps.

Malk a shit ton of more puddles to soak but still only 1 in melee. Considering there is alot more people to soak the balls you will most likely only be soaking a small quadrant rather than the majority of the zone. You wont be stacking either the tank should be solo tanking the cleave. Just drop smoke bomb when advised.

Spoils. Pretty much the same fight. Only differences would be in the way you do it.

Thok 12 people in either groups on opposite sides on a healing rain. Just listen to Cds and drop them when needed. Kill the jailor and let the ranged dps the boss. You can go on it when it goes by but be careful it has known to do a phantom cleave onto you even if you are no where close to the boss but in proximity of someone who is chomped.

Siege you will prob be assigned to every other belt unless they have hunter/monk group soloing it. Considering that tactics vary just make sure if you have mines fixated on you GTFO because if you get hit and knock up the rest of melee you will cause a chain reaction and maybe a wipe.

Paragons order should be the same its what ever your guild choses. But you will be asked to soak every aim. Feint is enough you dont need elusiveness. Glyph cloak is good for it too as if atleast 40% of you raid can solo soak aim you should have it up for every aim. You wont need to cloak them early but about 3/4 stacks in i would recommend it. Watch your catalysts just make sure you are well away from everyone you will have less room than 10man. Firery edge is everywhere and its gonna be hell in melee. Make sure you pop cloak and feint for it. Try and get inbetween the lines if you can but its difficult just be at max melee range during it for more room.

Garrosh. You might be asked to do engineer if so you can stay up there if you want just cloak the iron star impact. If you are going back down just make sure you dont aggro the wolfrider otherwise it wont get hit by the iron star. In 25man im sure most guilds just kite the little sha adds so dont worry about them just stay in melee and dps the boss. Its pretty simple for us tbh with cloak we are in melee most of the time. In my guild when we do the serpent celestial phase i get assigned to a group of adds to dps. Most classes have better stuff than us for AoE interupting so we are just there to do dmg. If you can get it try and save KS for them. Otherwise single interupt and pop racial if you have one that works for it. You might be asked to soak 4th malice. Just spam feint and cloak on the second tick of malice drop a smoke bomb and keep feinting. We have a monk kiting the iron star but if you are take BoS and a priest will help you with feathers.

I think that should be everything. Dont be too scared in 25man if anything you will be safer with more healers. If in doubt feint.

[Deleted]

Wow,thanks a ton to both of you for the fast and insightful answers! Feeling a lot more confident with these in mind.

[Deleted]

Wow,thanks a ton to both of you for the fast and insightful answers! Feeling a lot more confident with these in mind.

Np. I have never done 10man but this is pretty much all i can think of which will help you out thats relevant rather than writing a guide which you know anyway. Love 25man i have only ever raided that format. Hope it helps.

[Sturmgewehr86]

I have killed him in both 10/25 man ,don't wanna start a pissing contest but 25 man is a lot easier.As for engineers i always found stupid sending rogues there ranged do just fine that job.However i do kite the Iron star in both 10 and 25 man with bos(u dont need feathers, the speed is more than enough).For the fight itself MC's are just vaporized in 25 man due to the cleaving ,if u kill the adds from empowered WW then i'll admit it is harder to coordinate that in 25 man than in 10 but with the tactic we use the offtank just kites them making everything trivial (cos under the boss yolo during empowered WW)

[Deleted]

Gotta agree with Sturmgewehr. Except for Klaxxis, everything is easier in 25 man. So don't worry about changing over.

[Sesshou]

Gotta agree with Sturmgewehr. Except for Klaxxis, everything is easier in 25 man. So don't worry about changing over.

Maybe now for him as a rogue because with the extra ilvls the extra damage things do in 25m is kind of irrelevant. Overall, no. You can run more healers to raiders and allow for less dps per dps in 10m to meet enrages (exception being really early 10m garrosh kills, though I'll admit 10m garrosh specifically probably was just harder anyway) in addition to just having more space to deal with every spread out mechanic. Now I realize the first two likely have to do with them not assuming you have an optimal comp with all the buffs and cooldowns so they're intentionally more lenient, but that still just translates into easier because nothing is stopping you from bringing in a completely min/maxed group.