Does it still feel like an accomplishment to down bosses this late ?

[Tennis]

I'm looking at some of the guilds that have been downing bosses on my server and their ilevels are so high.
Killing Siegecrafter with 582ilevel and Garrosh with 584 ilevel.

Are these fights even comparable to what they were when earlier guilds killed them? The output and health differences seem immense and the fights seem to be completely different. You no longer have to play at a extremely high level and do everything right. You can bring more healers, not worry about optimizing dps etc.

For me it just wouldn't feel like a big accomplishment. Especially if you're a guild that has raided from the very first week. It's more like you bashed your head against bosses till they fell over as opposed to winning through skill.

[jsz]

It's still an accomplishment if it's been the same ~10 or ~25 working on the tier since the beginning, or since they started as a group. Not every group starts a tier on the night it comes out. Things happen, groups form late or have to recover from big roster issues.

[Notdev]

Killed H Garrosh a month and a half ago and it still felt great, especially as a 6 hour/week guild. We worked at it for a while, worked through huge turnover for our last 2-3 roster spots, and finally killed it.

However soon after our guild fell apart. Burnt out too many long time raiders, so they took "breaks".

[Sinndra]

context is key, did you literally just start the raid within say the last 3-4 weeks? if so then yes, it still feels like an accomplishment.

only after having 6-8 months of gear farming, and valor farming to upgrade your gear to 4/4 on as many pieces as possible for your ENTIRE raid, effectively nerfing the content slowly over time thru gear progression does the accomplishment start to diminish.

but then the "feeling of accomplishment" is subjective. some people that have spent months trying, even if they start to outgear the encounters, might still feel accomplished because they spent the time trying.

you dont think spending time to get to and down the last boss months after others is an accomplishment, its your subjective feeling that not everyone is going to share.

[Wilderness]

Of course its an accomplishment to those people. If they didn't want to do it, they wouldn't have been working on it until it died. Maybe they started late. Maybe they raid very few hours a week. Maybe they just aren't as good as those who killed it months ago. Does it really matter? Gear always makes bosses easier and everyone beyond the first few guilds to kill a boss pretty much has better gear than those who killed it before them, and possibly had nerfs to the boss or the overall raid as well. The entire premise of raiding is that it gets easier throughout the lifespan of a tier. The top guilds kill it in last tier's gear. The better guilds kill it with a little more gear. Those behind them take a little longer and get more geared first. At some point there's usually a few nerfs to specific bosses or the raid as a whole. More guilds kill things. New tier is released, cycle starts over.

Your entire question seems mostly aimed as a dig at people who are still raiding or making progress, that you are looking down at them and wondering why they even bother. People who care about kill dates and rankings know where to find them, and those that don't will continue working through raids at the pace that they are able to. Caring that someone else needed another 20 ilvls to kill something just seems sad.

[Deleted]

Killing Paragons 25H at 576 in 190~ wipes felt good, killing Garrosh 10H in 15 at 583 was a let down.

[Tennis]

Your entire question seems mostly aimed as a dig at people who are still raiding or making progress, that you are looking down at them and wondering why they even bother. People who care about kill dates and rankings know where to find them, and those that don't will continue working through raids at the pace that they are able to. Caring that someone else needed another 20 ilvls to kill something just seems sad.

Not so. I started raiding late this expac and it's nowhere near as fun as previous tiers in terms of difficulty or accomplishment. Guild 8 healed Iron Jug for example, many people died yet we somehow kill it. Same with some of the other bosses where it seems like a totally different fight than many of the guide videos.

[Sesshou]

I'm looking at some of the guilds that have been downing bosses on my server and their ilevels are so high.
Killing Siegecrafter with 582ilevel and Garrosh with 584 ilevel.

Are these fights even comparable to what they were when earlier guilds killed them? The output and health differences seem immense and the fights seem to be completely different. You no longer have to play at a extremely high level and do everything right. You can bring more healers, not worry about optimizing dps etc.

For me it just wouldn't feel like a big accomplishment. Especially if you're a guild that has raided from the very first week. It's more like you bashed your head against bosses till they fell over as opposed to winning through skill.

Nope. It only feels like an accomplishment if you do it with only 1 maybe 2 weeks of heroic drops tops. After that the output and health differences are immense and the fights are completely different. You no longer have to play at an extremely high level and do everything right.

I'm sure you know what I mean. You're in one of those top 5 guilds right?

[Socialhealer]

can't see how killed it 7.5 months ago, we often have joke nights where people troll and play like crap kill hc paragons with 13 ppl alive 3 minutes before berserk, happens in every guild i've been in, the easier the content gets via gear and upgrades the less the challenge, therefore the less effort people put into it and take raiding less seriously.

of course theres nights where is all 1 shots, feels good but also bad there was no challenge, might as well be 25 bots =/

[Deleted]

@OP: So you killed every boss HC six month ago and now you cry cause other people do it now?
Yeah, sorry the only problem here lies within YOU.

[schwarzkopf]

Absolutely - 3 Garrosh 10N kills down, and yes ... it is awesome still.

[Socialhealer]

@OP: So you killed every boss HC six month ago and now you cry cause other people do it now?
Yeah, sorry the only problem here lies within YOU.

problem basically lies at blizzards feet, it's most likely OP did kill it 6 months ago as you said, and is bored, wants a challenge again in raiding, which should be available if blizzard delivered their content with any reasonable rate, instead they fucked up and now there's nothing good to raid=/

[Lady Dragonheart]

I downed Garrosh on LFR for the first time the other day.

For me that was an accomplishment.
Granted, I have satellite and am only able to play on my days off, at night, when there's no bad weather.

I was still psyched, regardless.

[Deleted]

Eh, our first kill of Malk last night felt like an accomplishment - not because I think it makes us anywhere close to as skilled as the people who were downing him months ago and 15 ilvls below us, but because at our skill level he was a challenge, and after 50 or so wipes we finally got him down. And, frankly, because I've managed to hold a raid team together through over a year of the same content, and as far as I can tell, they're still enjoying themselves.

[omnivores]

Not everybody plays this game pretending to be world first contenders. Some groups don't make "progress" until after nerfs or until after sufficient headbashing and working on improving themselves. Doesn't diminish the accomplishment at all. Feels like a bigger accomplishment than already being god-like at the game and smashing everything the first week it drops. We're working harder for it :P, although admittedly less efficiently.

[Socialhealer]

We're working harder for it :P, although admittedly less efficiently.

bullshit, the effort that goes into world first races is insane, smashing your face against a boss you are mechanically perfecting but due to the sheer lack of gear hitting berserk timer and wiping over and over, i cannot see how just playing badly with 4/4 gear is more effort.

[Deleted]

That's a very subjective question. For some it will be, for others it won't.

Personally, my old raid group came back at the beginning of June to clear the raid before WoD. First Garrosh kill two weeks ago at an average ilvl of around 580, and knowing how the fight was early in the tier with less gear it didn't feel like an accomplishment. That's my own view from usually clearing tiers early in their cycle at low gear levels.

For others, it absolutely would be and there's nothing wrong with that either (goes for all difficulty levels). Different people have different goals. Who are you to belittle them?

[Nobleshield]

Anything that you accomplish as a team is an accomplishment, no matter if you did it the first week or the week before Warlords. There's no reason to discredit it because it's with X ilevel instead of Y ilevel. Hell some people consider it an accomplishment to "finish" the expansion in LFR, or Flex, to say nothing of Normal or Heroic. It's still an accomplishment to them​.

[Deja Thoris]

Its all subjective.

We've got guilds on our server at 584 battling with Garrosh still. While they may have lost people to the attendance boss I admire their tenacity. To a lot of people that fight is still hard at 584. Our guild killed him at 576 which is fantastic in comparison. Then you compare us to top guilds and we look shit :P
I don't care, I love the group of people I play with and I think we play at or about the same skill level and we're stoked when we kill new stuff. We don't sit there thinking "bummer, elitist joe killed it 6 months ago, darn, I really craved his approval"

[MrExcelion]

I don't play to compete with other guilds, just having fun with my raid team. Certainly feels rewarding to down a new boss