If the UK was a US State, it would be the 2nd poorest in the Union

[Wells]

But you did run out, see: fiscal cliff, government shutdown.

Neither the cliff nor the shutdown were caused by a "lack of money". The US literally cannot run out of money.

[Wildtree]

That's a rather naive outlook.... a good chunk of the reason why people go hungry is because in order to make enough food so that they don't and thus bring food prices down farmers would have to be working almost in the red. As it stands we send quite a bit of food around as charity to other countries just so that this doesn't happen.

We throwing food away in unbelievable amounts, every day.
If we'd take as much off from the top to double the money the lowest 50% of the population have, we'd be out of the woods.

[Nekosom]

Social mobility and prosperity are two different things...
the USA's wealth does not go much outside of the top 1%... There's another 4% after that, that has already significantly less than the first 1%..... after that, it becomes dramatic. The top 5% holding 90% of the country's wealth.

The problem is that the higher you go, the more ridiculous it becomes. The top 400 Wealthiest Americans are wealthier than the bottom 50% COMBINED. 400 vs. 150,000,000. You can't get more ludicrous than that. Of course countries like the UK can't measure up, the super-wealthy here skew the numbers so much that of course we'd make other countries look poor. If the US had an income gap comparable with...well, pretty much any other first-world country, or even comparable with our own numbers 50 years ago, then you Brits would have reason to be jealous. But in the current state? Hell no.

[Tierbook]

The problem is that the higher you go, the more ridiculous it becomes. The top 400 Wealthiest Americans are wealthier than the bottom 50% COMBINED. 400 vs. 150,000,000. You can't get more ludicrous than that. Of course countries like the UK can't stand up. If the US had an income gap comparable with...well, pretty much any other first-world country, or even comparable with our own numbers 50 years ago, then you Brits would have reason to be jealous. But in the current state? Hell no.

Actually income inequality has been relatively stagnant since the 20's the top 10% lost a bit in the 70's but other than that.....


Should also be noted that the combined wealth of the top 400 Americans is equal to RUssias GDP.

[Wildtree]

Regarding Food insecurity:

On the opposite end, this is how we live, every day

[Yvaelle]

So you're saying the poor ole' brits have a better life than people in the US just because they don't live in the US? Bad argument

No, GDP PPP is purely a measure of purchasing power parity - by income. Since the US offers the fewest public services, and taxes citizens the least amongst the highly developed nations - it appears higher on GDP: because services provided/taxed for are not factored into the differences in GDP PPP.

If you earn $50,000 in the US, but then need to spend an additional $20,000 covering your Healthcare and Education and etc - because the public services are inadequate - then you effectively earn less than a UK citizen who earns $31,000/year (converted to pounds, but I didn't want to complicate the example). If you just compare income though, the US citizen appears much higher (50k) versus the UK (31k) - but the UK citizen actually has a higher effective income (what economists call Quality of Life)

Hope that helps!

[Wildtree]

Actually income inequality has been relatively stagnant since the 20's the top 10% lost a bit in the 70's but other than that.....
]http://www2.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/power/images/wealth/Wealth_distribution_over_time.gif

I found this


Seems like the top 5% are the only ones who made a shitload of more, while the bottom 50% pretty much are in the hole, for that timeline shown.

[Tierbook]

I kind of wonder how immigrants figure into that.... I mean in that period of time we have had roughly 10 million illegal immigrants and they aren't getting paid much, thus they take over the very bottom and push some other not so rich people in to the next 5th, which pushes more people to the next 5th and on and on.

[Mihalik]

Economic output =/= Quality of life or Human development.

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No, GDP PPP is purely a measure of purchasing power parity - by income. Since the US offers the fewest public services, and taxes citizens the least amongst the highly developed nations - it appears higher on GDP: because services provided/taxed for are not factored into the differences in GDP PPP.

If you earn $50,000 in the US, but then need to spend an additional $20,000 covering your Healthcare and Education and etc - because the public services are inadequate - then you effectively earn less than a UK citizen who earns $31,000/year (converted to pounds, but I didn't want to complicate the example). If you just compare income though, the US citizen appears much higher (50k) versus the UK (31k) - but the UK citizen actually has a higher effective income (what economists call Quality of Life)

Hope that helps!

Somebody who had the patience to break it down.

[Independent voter]

No, GDP PPP is purely a measure of purchasing power parity - by income. Since the US offers the fewest public services, and taxes citizens the least amongst the highly developed nations - it appears higher on GDP: because services provided/taxed for are not factored into the differences in GDP PPP.

If you earn $50,000 in the US, but then need to spend an additional $20,000 covering your Healthcare and Education and etc - because the public services are inadequate - then you effectively earn less than a UK citizen who earns $31,000/year (converted to pounds, but I didn't want to complicate the example). If you just compare income though, the US citizen appears much higher (50k) versus the UK (31k) - but the UK citizen actually has a higher effective income (what economists call Quality of Life)

Hope that helps!

The US has cheap food and housing for the most part. I wonder if that's figured in. Fuel for autos too and other cheap things.

How often are you sick really? You eat all the time.

[Wildtree]

I kind of wonder how immigrants figure into that.... I mean in that period of time we have had roughly 10 million illegal immigrants and they aren't getting paid much, thus they take over the very bottom and push some other not so rich people in to the next 5th, which pushes more people to the next 5th and on and on.

good question..
without these immigrants it would be rather worse imo.

[Tierbook]

Economic output =/= Quality of life or Human development.

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Somebody who had the patience to break it down.

According to the HDI the US is ranked 5th and the UK 14th

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good question..
without these immigrants it would be rather worse imo.

How do you figure that? GDP would be more or less where it still is just fewer people being paid as low of wages as they are.

[Wildtree]

The US has cheap food and housing for the most part. I wonder if that's figured in. Fuel for autos too and other cheap things.

others have that too... commonly known as welfare benefits

How often are you sick really? You eat all the time.

You as in individually, or general?
Generally people are just getting sick. It's human nature.... And that natural aspect is the number 1 reason for bankruptcies in the US.
Those that don't get sick and never face high medical bills all their lives, are anecdotal exceptions. And exceptions don't invalidate the rules.

If you haven't had any high medical bills right now, keep praying that it stays that way. It can happen faster than you'd like to think.

[Deleted]

Is this even a secret? The US has extreme economic freedom compared to pretty much all european countries, however they lack a lot of the government benefits that we do. Nothing strange really, if you were to calculate the government benefits into the GDP the UK may rank a little higher.

[Deleted]

The US has cheap food and housing for the most part. I wonder if that's figured in. Fuel for autos too and other cheap things.

How often are you sick really? You eat all the time.

You should be lucky food, housing is cheap, because otherwise you'd have no money left to live on as an average American.

Then again don't you need like one medium disease/illness to completely ruin your finances in the USA?

[Amerrol]

All I got out of this post is that America is the greatest country in the universe. 'Murica!

[Wildtree]

According to the HDI the US is ranked 5th and the UK 14th

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How do you figure that? GDP would be more or less where it still is just fewer people being paid as low of wages as they are.

I use a scenario where wages would not dramatically increase. That means how more Americans would have to do the jobs. Which shifts the scale further away from the super rich.

All in all, and on a second thought, the illegals have no negative impact. The govt makes money off them as they cause on expenses.
There's a surplus year after year from unclaimed paid taxes. That stereotype under the radar totally illegally working immigrant is a small minority. Most pay taxes, yet instead of us, they don't file for a tax return.

[Independent voter]

others have that too... commonly known as welfare benefits
.

Yes, we have welfare and food stamps on top of that.

Typical Joe who makes too much money for government assistance of any kind goes to the supermarket and compared to other countries, it's like everything is on sale.

Cheap cost of living is a huge social benefit that helps the poor the most. How often do you go to the doctor? I hardly ever go.

[Grummgug]

No, GDP PPP is purely a measure of purchasing power parity - by income. Since the US offers the fewest public services, and taxes citizens the least amongst the highly developed nations - it appears higher on GDP: because services provided/taxed for are not factored into the differences in GDP PPP.

If you earn $50,000 in the US, but then need to spend an additional $20,000 covering your Healthcare and Education and etc - because the public services are inadequate - then you effectively earn less than a UK citizen who earns $31,000/year (converted to pounds, but I didn't want to complicate the example). If you just compare income though, the US citizen appears much higher (50k) versus the UK (31k) - but the UK citizen actually has a higher effective income (what economists call Quality of Life)

Hope that helps!

But you control more of your own money in the US. A 24 year old with no medical care needs will control more of their income in America, and can invest more of it, save it, and then build wealth more easily.

[Templar 331]

Actually they do, welfare will bankrupt the usa.

Funny how Wall Street almost causes a global financial meltdown, but welfare is what's going to cause us to fail.

On topic: Apples to oranges.