[GUIDE] Drunken Savagery: Brewmaster Tanking in [6.2]

[The Madgod]

So for two handing, BA chant, since we can control when it procs? The mastery one can go off while OTing.

If we want to use that logic, BA shouldn't be something we use because in order to control when it procs that means willingly going below 50% health... generally a bad idea to intentionally take damage. That being said at least it would proc when we WOULD take damage and with the new healing paradigm being at 50% health will be more the norm.

I want to say that for tank-swapping fights, BA would be better, but there's the potential argument that it would be more useful to take a crit enchant for easier EB stacking regardless of whether you are tanking or not.

For fights where you are the only tank I believe mastery does win out simply because of how the BA enchant procs (ICD v RPPM).

This would be a good thing to theorycraft a bit more than it has been.

[Totaltotemic]

Well I would love to actually finish Normal Highmaul but we're sitting at Tectus (killed Kargath, Butcher, and Brackenspore already) while the servers die horribly knocking people offline.

Some things I've noted so far that may not be immediately obvious:

Damage is absurdly low in Normal. Bosses were only taking me to like 160% Resolve maximum and a single Disc Priest made it so that I literally never dropped below 100% health on Kargath. This is with 649 ilvl.


Brackenspore's Necrotic Breath healing reduction does not affect Guard, so you can ride the Resolve wave and wait to Guard until halfway through when Resolve spikes up to 150%. This is probably not viable on Mythic, but pretty hilarious on Normal.

Also trash hits way harder than bosses. I have no idea why this happens, maybe they just didn't balance the Normal mode trash properly. 250% Resolve on trash with 160% on bosses is a little stupid.

Killed everything but the last boss because we only had an hour to do Tectus, Twins, and Ko'ragh. Some more stuff:

Tectus positioning is sensitive, he flops around sometimes when you're dealing with the smaller sized ones. Statue makes adds a joke.

Twins is like Monk heaven if you're on Phemos. Provoke him after Quake to make him come to Pol faster, if you roll dead on through a flame wall you get no debuff (has to be like exactly perpendicular). Transcendence in the middle is nice to just reset him back to the middle after the fire is out on all of the edges.

Ko'ragh's fields silence you, so RJW is a worthless talent for the fight since you can't use it while silenced. You also can't place a statue while silenced, so if it dies just run out and back in to grab more adds. Other than that there's almost nothing tanks have to do so it's pretty easy if the rest of your raid can manage the mechanics.

[Deleted]

Can confirm normal bosses hit for nothing; spent an hour or so yesterday attempting to threeman Kargath while the servers seppuku'd themselves. Only time I ran into any real damage was on Twin Ogron where the melee fucked the yell up and I ended up with the full 300% debuff, but even that was a joke with our mastery + serenity.

[Deleted]

i just noticed cata elixirs are even better than mop's..nice scaling (elixir of deep earth gives 268 armor..)

[kofkof]

The Butcher's Saber Lash style thing where he copies his AAs is a special attack and cannot be dodged, so when you're not the one with aggro there's a good 30 second span of time where Mastery and Versatility are the only mitigation going on.

Seems like you can dodge the Heavy Handed attack (if that s what you indeed call Saber Lash) and you've dodged some when i looked at your logs. If you take a look at the link below you can see that you weren't tanking the boss (no melee hits) and dodging the Heavy Handed attacks.

www . warcraftlogs.com/reports/zJjhQTXRw2qa9CV7#fight=5&type=damage-taken&source=7&ability=156138&start=1998632&end=2040619&view=events

I might be wrong and not looking at the right spell but from what i remember during the beta testing you could dodge it too when you were offtanking.

[Totaltotemic]

Seems like you can dodge the Heavy Handed attack (if that s what you indeed call Saber Lash) and you've dodged some when i looked at your logs. If you take a look at the link below you can see that you weren't tanking the boss (no melee hits) and dodging the Heavy Handed attacks.

www . warcraftlogs.com/reports/zJjhQTXRw2qa9CV7#fight=5&type=damage-taken&source=7&ability=156138&start=1998632&end=2040619&view=events

I might be wrong and not looking at the right spell but from what i remember during the beta testing you could dodge it too when you were offtanking.

Yeah my bad, I think I was seeing The Cleaver not be dodged and thought those were the Heavy-Handed attacks. I should have double checked in the logs.

Also before anyone asks, no Healing Elixirs and Power Strikes are not optimal, but I preferred the auto-pilot talents while getting a feel for the positioning and damage pattern of each fight because I was in no actual danger of dying.

[Ultramad]

Ya'll gotta get on that heroic train! We walked in last night and basically 3 shot kargath on heroic because lawl easy fight. Butcher was a different story. Our raiders weren't ready for progression obviously and didn't double pot on a lot of the attempts.

Our best heroic attempt on butcher was 5:25 and he was enraged at 15%. Also guard is absurddddddddddddd.

Here's the part that matters though:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...e=damage-taken

Monks are pretty good tanks.

[Deleted]

Ya'll gotta get on that heroic train! We walked in last night and basically 3 shot kargath on heroic because lawl easy fight. Butcher was a different story. Our raiders weren't ready for progression obviously and didn't double pot on a lot of the attempts.

Our best heroic attempt on butcher was 5:25 and he was enraged at 15%. Also guard is absurddddddddddddd.

Here's the part that matters though:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...e=damage-taken

Monks are pretty good tanks.

the irony of a monk named ULTRASMOOTH taking no damage

[BuddhaBear]

Saw almost the exact same thing as Ultramad. Fun times.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...e=damage-taken

Also curious about Healing elixirs vs dampen harm. Looking at some of our longer fights against The Butcher last night, HE was doing over 500k healing. Would i get over 500k dmg reduction from a fight like that? Some of his abilities hit pretty hard, but most of it was just a lot of hard(er) hitting attacks. Even Kargath's Impale is a tick, not a single hit making me think Dampen Harm is a bad talent for that. Thoughts?

[Ultramad]

the irony of a monk named ULTRASMOOTH taking no damage

That's why it was namechanged last week after a CM. The healer said, man ultra, that was smooth. I said, "was it ultrasmooth!?" and then had to name change.

I found dampen harm useless completely on kargath. I thought I would use it and it never went off on impale. We even took 2 stacks at a time and it never worked.

Butcher it would trigger on the second tenderize, but other than that, I didn't see it go off much. I'll have to check back for actual usage numbers later.

[Totaltotemic]

Saw almost the exact same thing as Ultramad. Fun times.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...e=damage-taken

Also curious about Healing elixirs vs dampen harm. Looking at some of our longer fights against The Butcher last night, HE was doing over 500k healing. Would i get over 500k dmg reduction from a fight like that? Some of his abilities hit pretty hard, but most of it was just a lot of hard(er) hitting attacks. Even Kargath's Impale is a tick, not a single hit making me think Dampen Harm is a bad talent for that. Thoughts?

Essentially Dampen Harm gets better the harder you're being hit. Elixirs isn't affected by Resolve, but because Dampen is a 50% damage reduction on attacks that trigger it, something hitting for 40% of your health is twice as good for Dampen as something only hitting for 20% of your health.

Dampen's strength really isn't seen until you get to bosses that put you in realistic danger of dying just from AAs because you take so much damage. On Mythic even AAs will make Dampen pretty useful.

For an attack like Impale though, Elixirs is the only defensive option possible because it auto-triggers. Even if you put Dampen up beforehand, it won't trigger from the ticks.

Brackenspore's Necrotic Breath is actually terrible for both Dampen and HE (being a channeled ability that also reduces healing taken), so Diffuse is basically the only option there.

Tectus is nominally a bunch of small attacks at his hardest hitting part of the fight (the end with the motes), which again favors Healing Elixirs.

Basically anything that's a single boss doing very powerful AAs swings towards Dampen. Anything else generally makes Elixirs useful unless there's a specific attack you're concerned about blocking with Diffuse.

[Feawen]

If we want to use that logic, BA shouldn't be something we use because in order to control when it procs that means willingly going below 50% health... generally a bad idea to intentionally take damage. That being said at least it would proc when we WOULD take damage and with the new healing paradigm being at 50% health will be more the norm.

I want to say that for tank-swapping fights, BA would be better, but there's the potential argument that it would be more useful to take a crit enchant for easier EB stacking regardless of whether you are tanking or not.

For fights where you are the only tank I believe mastery does win out simply because of how the BA enchant procs (ICD v RPPM).

This would be a good thing to theorycraft a bit more than it has been.

Thanks Madgod, once I get rid of my BoA I'll play around with BA and Crit.

[Deleted]

So I got to clear full normal and Kargath HC now. Monks feels really strong, way stronger then my warrior co-tank. The only boss that can hit somewhat hard is imperator. Really, the only difficulty stepup in there was Imperator. Kargath HC is much easyer then Imperator on normal.
Logs for the night if someone is interrested:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/pXkBA1yb68GmQHWK

By the way, what do you guys feel about our t30 talents?

[Quotey]

I'm raiding on my warrior currently, in heroic and even on the butcher the BA enchant only had a 16% uptime. You simply don't go under 50% enough in heroic. Mythic could be a different story.

[Totaltotemic]

So I got to clear full normal and Kargath HC now. Monks feels really strong, way stronger then my warrior co-tank. The only boss that can hit somewhat hard is imperator. Really, the only difficulty stepup in there was Imperator. Kargath HC is much easyer then Imperator on normal.
Logs for the night if someone is interrested:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/pXkBA1yb68GmQHWK

By the way, what do you guys feel about our t30 talents?

I think Chi Wave is a garbage spell. It sims nicely and all, but look here: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ability=132463

6.5k healing on yourself across an entire fight. Granted, I don't think you were self-using it for the first hit, but even if you were using it on the enemy this shows how little it actually bounces back to you instead of someone else. If you cycle through each fight, you were only getting about 20% of the bounces regardless of the fight. Hell, on your Tectus kill it healed your co-tank more than you, and you get Resolve from it.

It just looks like they completely broke the spell. Meanwhile, I used Chi Burst 3 times in a 3 minute fight and did this: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ability=130654

It's just so much more healing not because Chi Burst intrinsically heals for more, but because it's the only one of the three spells that you can actually force onto yourself 100% of the time to benefit from Resolve.

[Deleted]

I think Chi Wave is a garbage spell. It sims nicely and all, but look here: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ability=132463

6.5k healing on yourself across an entire fight. Granted, I don't think you were self-using it for the first hit, but even if you were using it on the enemy this shows how little it actually bounces back to you instead of someone else. If you cycle through each fight, you were only getting about 20% of the bounces regardless of the fight. Hell, on your Tectus kill it healed your co-tank more than you, and you get Resolve from it.

It just looks like they completely broke the spell. Meanwhile, I used Chi Burst 3 times in a 3 minute fight and did this: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ability=130654

It's just so much more healing not because Chi Burst intrinsically heals for more, but because it's the only one of the three spells that you can actually force onto yourself 100% of the time to benefit from Resolve.

Yeah, I have pretty much permanently been using Chi Burst this expansion, just switched to Chi wave for this raid to test it out. I guess its back to burst then, thanks.

[keqe]

I think Chi Wave is a garbage spell. It sims nicely and all, but look here: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ability=132463

6.5k healing on yourself across an entire fight. Granted, I don't think you were self-using it for the first hit, but even if you were using it on the enemy this shows how little it actually bounces back to you instead of someone else. If you cycle through each fight, you were only getting about 20% of the bounces regardless of the fight. Hell, on your Tectus kill it healed your co-tank more than you, and you get Resolve from it.

It just looks like they completely broke the spell. Meanwhile, I used Chi Burst 3 times in a 3 minute fight and did this: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ability=130654

It's just so much more healing not because Chi Burst intrinsically heals for more, but because it's the only one of the three spells that you can actually force onto yourself 100% of the time to benefit from Resolve.

It is bugged atm and doesn't bounce AT ALL. That is why it seems to suck (even more?)

[Totaltotemic]

It is bugged atm and doesn't bounce AT ALL. That is why it seems to suck (even more?)

Hm is it just not bouncing to enemies? Because it looks here like it was bouncing to the target and then to a friendly at the very least. That's pretty terrible if true, it was already kind of iffy before that.

[jijuiji]

Oh my god new content!! <3 Downed 3 bosses on HC but omg its fun. Phemos (I think thats his name) is wonderful as a monk tank. Zen Med Whirlwinds then move back for cleave DPS and teleport to stack for roar + taunt. LOVE HIGHMAUL

[Deleted]

It's so sad it's near funny, now we have 2/3 talents of one row completely bugged into unusability.
Chi wave doesn't bounce off players anymore (did bofore maintanence), and zen sphere doesn't detonate half of the time.
Really sucks.