[GUIDE] Fury of Fistfire: Windwalking in [6.2]

[pandanaconda]

Well, I'd advise a bit differently personnally.
I think haste might be a bit overvalued on sims, but I leave that outside of my reflexion.

Since I still do the occasional BrM tanking in mythics for my guild, I still want my tier pieces to be fit dor that. As BrewMaster, I usually play very greedy (double dps trinkets, usually SDI/Kappacitor). So I'll most likely keep my stuff gemmed for multistrike and run haste enchants, since those are on spec items (rings, neck, so on.)

Overall I really think its less of a concern than you guys thibk it is, and Rait confirmed this to me.


As for CX in ST: some people allways consider ChiBrew for it in shorter fights, for high birst on first ring. I think this is way weaker than we give it credit for. The additionnal Chi on ascension is way more important. It allows us to waste way less combo breaker - without it wéd have to use CX at 4/5 chi and likely have to jab with CB up way more often than we want to.

Some people tried toying with TEB on CX with little success. If you have very low mastery, you'll have some slight TEB downtime (or rather, you won't allways have 10 stacks at the end of one buff). However, delaying it till 10 stacks when you get unluc'y with procs id most likely just gonna be detrimental. What will usually happen is, you'll miss out on TEB buff on one ChiX and a few seconds of autoattacks/afe ticks of ChiWave, and you'll gaine a couple stacks for 3 ChiX's and some more autoattacks. The tradeoff is generally not worth it. The only way to cheat on that is to delay your TEB usage until' the next Spell you cast and delay those if it means no dps loss. For some time, i used my old autoattack timer with CX but I don't when dual wielding.

[Deleted]

multi is gonna pull ahead of haste after the patch this week right?, for chi ex

[Babylonius]

multi is gonna pull ahead of haste after the patch this week right?, for chi ex

No, haste will still be better for CX. Multistrike gets a little closer but Haste is still the go to stat for CX. Haste got quite a bit better for Serenity but Mutistrike is still better for that talent also.

[Deleted]

Just how bad is mastery? Im in the process of gearing my ww alt with baleful items and somehow every piece I get is multi+mastery. Do I upgrade them or is mastery so bad that every other combination without it is better?

[pandanaconda]

Mastery is really bad.

As gear progresses and other stats get diminishing returns, its a bit better for serenity... Yet its still worth half any other stat.
Thats one thing you should never forget in this whole stat discussion is that what's most important here is:
1) Having high weapon damage
2) Not having mastery
Crit, versatility and multistrike are extremely close to each other now, specially once you have 2000+ multistrike. Mastery on thoe other hand is really bad, and the less stuff you have, the worse it compares to the rest. I remember in highmaul simming mastery to be worth one fourth of multistrike.
You'd way rather have crit/haste or versatility/haste than mastery multistrike. Avoid mastery as much as you can.

[Kickbuttmario]

Mastery does go up in value for something like ChiEx since 4chi ChiEx can be pretty much (3-4 stacks of TeB right there ), but regardless, it is the worst stat in the game.

I hope they change it quickly. Perhaps that's what the new class trinkets are for.

[Deleted]

Mastery does go up in value for something like ChiEx since 4chi ChiEx can be pretty much (3-4 stacks of TeB right there ), but regardless, it is the worst stat in the game.

I hope they change it quickly. Perhaps that's what the new class trinkets are for.

Just wearing 4set with the Leg offset(+5ilvl Crit Haste instead of Crit Multi on this slot, Chest offset is Crit Multi instead of Mastery Multi) puts you at >42% Mastery raidbuffed. With that amount of Mastery I already run into the situation where I cap out TeB using it for 100% uptime quite often. Using ChiEx with 2 Chi also feels really weird in a cleave situation, so that really doesn't help. I'd argue that Mastery is even worse for ChiEx, especially in cleave situations. The raidbuff and out base Mastery is enough to have almost 100% uptime on 10 stacks, avoid it like the plague.

[Hinalover]

There are no magical numbers.
I believe in his initial sim with the 59% cap, hina used multistrike weapon enchant, meaning at times it capped to 100%. If you don't have frostwolf, you can go up to 65% with multistrike, versatility and crit at about the same value.

um....no. When I was running those tests I was going Crit enchant.

[Xiaojin]

Just how bad is mastery? Im in the process of gearing my ww alt with baleful items and somehow every piece I get is multi+mastery. Do I upgrade them or is mastery so bad that every other combination without it is better?

It's so bad that you need to upgrade to items that are 15-20 item levels higher so that their higher Agi compensates for how bad mastery is. And even then those upgrades are really, really small.

I'm in that exact same situation now: took a break from WoW for months (played Brewmaster before that), came back weeks after HFC launched, had to look for a new guild, in my new guild I'm Windwalker and most of the left-over gear I get (i.e., that none of the rogues or druids want) has Mastery on it. Sure, some of those items are upgrades (about 1% lol) due to the massive item level increase. But my DPS looks really, really bad due to having 1475 Mastery (pre-raid buff) at item level 711. Effectively my damage is as high as someone's who has about 705 item level with barely any mastery on it (basically just mastery from tier).

The worst part of it is that my raid leader tells me not to whine about my gear when he asks me why my DPS is so low.

[pandanaconda]

um....no. When I was running those tests I was going Crit enchant.

My bad. You once commented on those sims saying this was due to weapon procs and stuff, so since the only multistrike proc around is frostwolf on weapon I thought you meant this.
Well anyways, I still think people are overthinking this crit vs ms vs versatility matter.


As for mastery, yes its really bad.

[Killface1]

On a different subject, I have a question and I'm not adept enough at pouring through logs to figure it out.

On mythic council today, every time I'd diffuse the mark, I'd immediately get one back and hear healers bitching about somebody dispelling. I unfortunately was kind of zoning out because its farm, and we ended up wiping for unrelated reasons. Did I just have bad luck, and that every time I DM'd it I'd get one back (and it was healers dispelling), and it was one of those one in a million pulls, or was there some ninja fix to make it so diffuse no longer got rid of the mark and/or began dispelling it to other people? Anybody else notice this, or should I just chalk it up to bad luck? I don't see myself as having dispelled in any of the logs, but I DM'd 4 times and I'm pretty sure I immediately got mark back 4 times. Here are the logs in question if anybody cares to bother looking at them, and anybody reporting similar things would be greatly appreciated since we ended up fvcking up and not killing the boss and it'll be on our plates first thing tomorrow.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...z#type=dispels

I'm Hanbrolo

[Babylonius]

On a different subject, I have a question and I'm not adept enough at pouring through logs to figure it out.

On mythic council today, every time I'd diffuse the mark, I'd immediately get one back and hear healers bitching about somebody dispelling. I unfortunately was kind of zoning out because its farm, and we ended up wiping for unrelated reasons. Did I just have bad luck, and that every time I DM'd it I'd get one back (and it was healers dispelling), and it was one of those one in a million pulls, or was there some ninja fix to make it so diffuse no longer got rid of the mark and/or began dispelling it to other people? Anybody else notice this, or should I just chalk it up to bad luck? I don't see myself as having dispelled in any of the logs, but I DM'd 4 times and I'm pretty sure I immediately got mark back 4 times. Here are the logs in question if anybody cares to bother looking at them, and anybody reporting similar things would be greatly appreciated since we ended up fvcking up and not killing the boss and it'll be on our plates first thing tomorrow.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...z#type=dispels

I'm Hanbrolo

It dispells it w/o jumping to someone else 100% of the time

[Killface1]

It dispells it w/o jumping to someone else 100% of the time

Thanks, you're a saint as per usual.

[Deleted]

On a different subject, I have a question and I'm not adept enough at pouring through logs to figure it out.

On mythic council today, every time I'd diffuse the mark, I'd immediately get one back and hear healers bitching about somebody dispelling. I unfortunately was kind of zoning out because its farm, and we ended up wiping for unrelated reasons. Did I just have bad luck, and that every time I DM'd it I'd get one back (and it was healers dispelling), and it was one of those one in a million pulls, or was there some ninja fix to make it so diffuse no longer got rid of the mark and/or began dispelling it to other people? Anybody else notice this, or should I just chalk it up to bad luck? I don't see myself as having dispelled in any of the logs, but I DM'd 4 times and I'm pretty sure I immediately got mark back 4 times. Here are the logs in question if anybody cares to bother looking at them, and anybody reporting similar things would be greatly appreciated since we ended up fvcking up and not killing the boss and it'll be on our plates first thing tomorrow.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...z#type=dispels

I'm Hanbrolo

Looking at your logs, you dispelled yourself with diffuse magic at 0:54.189, then at 0:54.623 Msp dispels Maghna which made it jump to 3 new players including you.
Then at 6:16.977 you diffused, then at 6:17.548 Kermit dispelled Tanynn and it jumped to 3 players including you.

[Oziemaster]

I just got Heroic Censer, have Heroic Soul Capacitor, Class trinket, and Normal Blademaster. Which trinket should I be using on fights like Archi, Xhul, Tyrant, Council? I've been using Soul Capacitor on Tyrant and Council and taking Blademaster on Xhul and Archimonde. Should I be replacing Blademaster with the Heroic Censer? And possibly taking out Soul Capacitor for Censer for more overall DPS on Tyrant and Council since my spirit eruptions won't be as good with ChiEx?

[Babylonius]

I just got Heroic Censer, have Heroic Soul Capacitor, Class trinket, and Normal Blademaster. Which trinket should I be using on fights like Archi, Xhul, Tyrant, Council? I've been using Soul Capacitor on Tyrant and Council and taking Blademaster on Xhul and Archimonde. Should I be replacing Blademaster with the Heroic Censer? And possibly taking out Soul Capacitor for Censer for more overall DPS on Tyrant and Council since my spirit eruptions won't be as good with ChiEx?

Use Soul Cap on single target like Zakuun and Reaver. Use Mirror on any fight you're comfortable with making sure the boss will be within the blade storms for the whole time. Use Crenser on anything else.

[Accendor]

I just checked the Noxic calculations for 6.2.2 -> http://www.noxxic.com/wow/dps-rankings#705,real,1

Is windwalker still THAT bad?

[Hinalover]

I just checked the Noxic calculations for 6.2.2 -> http://www.noxxic.com/wow/dps-rankings#705,real,1

Is windwalker still THAT bad?

....NO!!! They base their calculations from SimC and they must have pulled from prior to us devs moving things to build 6.2.2-1 (which is still in the process). To get a better idea of our single target, SimC's raid listing has been updated:

http://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/Raid_T18M.html

Also I really don't like Noxic's calculations

[Kickbuttmario]

Use Soul Cap on single target like Zakuun and Reaver. Use Mirror on any fight you're comfortable with making sure the boss will be within the blade storms for the whole time. Use Crenser on anything else.

I would recommend using Censer on most fights instead of Soul Cap. It's not that Soul cap is weak, I remember having an attempt on Zakuun doing 100k dps but I had 7 procs of the trinket very early. Its purely an RNG trinket. Use it for fun and for farm. Progression, I would never recommend it. Either Mirror or MC will do best.

[Imbalanced]

I would recommend using Censer on most fights instead of Soul Cap. It's not that Soul cap is weak, I remember having an attempt on Zakuun doing 100k dps but I had 7 procs of the trinket very early. Its purely an RNG trinket. Use it for fun and for farm. Progression, I would never recommend it. Either Mirror or MC will do best.

So you are saying a 1ppm trinket is more rng than another 1ppm trinket? Amazing