What does the American dream mean to you?

[Reeve]

So in reality it should be called the "Danish Dream"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_mobility

It can be both the American and Danish Dreams. Countries can share dreams man. It's the Tel'aran'ahiod of the global community.

[Catta]

It can be both the American and Danish Dreams. Countries can share dreams man. It's the Tel'aran'ahiod of the global community.

No. Is our dream. OUR! WE NO SHARE!

[glo]

Haha, health insurance, that's rich! Please don't remind me that my HMO is jumping from $180 to $550 a month because of Obamacare in January. Capitalism is awesome!

[Reeve]

No. Is our dream. OUR! WE NO SHARE!

Fine, you can have the dream, but you'll have to start making everyone buy single family homes with white picket fences, 2.4 children, and a dog.

[Garnier Fructis]

To me, it's all bullshit.

I'm tired of seeing people vote against their own interest for policies that will never benefit them because they're under the delusion that one day they'll be a millionaire too, and then those policies will help them.

Most people are not willing to put in the sheer amount of work and sacrifice needed for a chance to succeed, and the sooner they wake up to this fact the sooner we'll start moving in the right direction as a country.

[Sam the Wiser]

Indoor plumbing, let me tell you OP I cry every night to be thankful for this.

[Conspicuous Cultist]

Having a platform to become a self-made man in, despite against all odds.

Haha, health insurance, that's rich! Please don't remind me that my HMO is jumping from $180 to $550 a month because of Obamacare in January. Capitalism is awesome!

Yeah, having to buy health insurance must make those people that own health insurance firms wet their panties.

Can you imagine if the mayor of Nottingham mandated all peasants must buy at least two m&m cookies from you, the baker or face a fine? That'd be a dream come to true.

[Sledfang]

I own a home... but I do not see that as the "American Dream"... my parents own a home as well... We are immigrants from Russia... I think most people have their own version of the "American Dream".

Owning a home certainly is a part of the American Dream. However it is extremely easy to "own" a home and have very little of the total equity (%). Anybody who owns a reasonably nice home and also has a majority of the equity is most likely in the American Dream realm.

[Catta]

It really is all about your mentality.

Only if you live in a vacuum.

[Conspicuous Cultist]

I understand where you are coming from... but "self-made man" is a misnomer... you rely on markets, roads, systems built by a community.

This is where the conservative/liberal worldviews collide. When you have a platform, as you mentioned, that automatically means you area not "self-made" but rather, propped up by society, and taking advantage of it.

It is much, much harder to become a "self made man" in Africa where there is no running water, plumbing, police, or electricity...

That's a more nuanced way of putting it. Of course, chances are your condom factory won't be confiscated by a evangelist Nigerian warlord in the U.S.

Or you won't need to move your rum company to Bermuda because Obama is confiscating all the businesses for himself.

It's definitely a lot more encouraged in the U.S., for sure.

[Deleted]

Driving a corvette in the desert

[Pengekaer]

So in reality it should be called the "Danish Dream"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_mobility

Yes, why would the Danish Dream be different, in its core elements, than the American? To own a good home, get the desired job/education, founding a family and stuff like that are, I take it, universal wishes... at least for most people.

But I am, frankly, somewhat weary of Scandinavians (danes, swedes, norwegians alike) that constantly (or at least whenever the chance bids itself) praise and brag about the vaunted welfare system with equal possibilities for all..
I would like to make it very clear that I believe, unlike what many danes are postulating, that the state-funded education and health-care (which in many cases is 2nd grade) is made possibly not because we have the recipe for moral superiority or are somehow 'more caring for each other'.
No, actually the systems in Scandinavia are, if you ask me, a product of societies that have (at least heretofore) been extremely homogeneous - almost like a monocultural society. There are only (max.) 300 kilometers from the western to the eastern border and 300 from the northern border to the southern and all danes share the same cultural heritage and moral values (seriously, who the hell doesn't know HC Andersen, Grundtvig etc. and their moral codices, at least on some very basic level?). We are, in short, a very invariant population and this results in a high degree of trust internally in the country, simply because most people are on the level with each other. This homogeneity (and the 'trust' that I believe to be a derivative of it) has been extremely important in generating the necessary amount of trust in the population (and trust towards the state) to ensure that people willingly pay + 50 % of their income as taxes and VAT. All the welfare, social security, state-funded education etc. are all funded by, let's call a turd a turd, exorbitant taxes.

However, I believe the Scandinavian models are being dismantled in front of our very eyes these years; as we joined the European Union, we gave up - to a very large extent - our rights to conduct our own immigration policies and thus migrants from all ever Europa (and Arabia) are now seeking their fortunes here (some come to work, some certainly have not come to work...).
In short, Denmark, and Scandinavia at large, will not be monocultures for much longer (Sweden is no longer a monoculture), but instead multicultural societies. And I doubt the Scandinavian welfare models will endure in our countries that are about to become diverse, because we will not for much longer share a common, cultural heritage and common democratic values. Welfare societies are fragile because they are so expensive to run and require such a high degree of trust and cooperation. Considering that multicultural societies are frequently experiencing cultural tension between population groups, I believe the Scandinavian model will soon be a thing of the past. The directives from Brüssel are certainly not helping either.
The result is already clear imo; welfare-state cuts have become common while a still larger percentage lives on welfare, and inequality is on the rise.
Danes, Swedes and Norwegians are free to brag all they wish about their (our) model xD. But I bet it will be hollowed out from here-on. One piece at a time. Day by day...
Whether this is a good or bad thing, time will tell. I am a bit pessimistic about it, though, I will admit that.
I made this long post, mostly aimed at danes tbh, merely because I wish they would reflect a little more about what the welfare-state is a product of and where it is headed instead of just, whenever the bloody chance bids itself, sing about it on internet-forums.
Peace and love <3!

[Spectral]

To me the idea of the American Dream (while not exclusively belonging to America) is the idea that anyone, through hard work, can be better off than their parents were.

Which, of course, is still broadly true across the majority of first-world countries, at least if we count technological gains as making us "better off". Since I do count that (it seems obvious to me that I can have nicer things for the same amount of money now relative to a generation ago) I'm pretty optimistic about this trend continuing going forward.

I will say that it's not quite true that "anyone" can improve their lot in life though - some people are simply unintelligent and their employment prospects are limited by it.

[Pengekaer]

Driving a corvette in the desert

Sounds like fun. I always wanted to see Grand Canyon and the Barringer Crater and stuff. I imagine a Corvette would be the right vessel for the tour.

[Pengekaer]

Just like the "German dream", the "Polish dream" the "Mexican dream" the "Brazilian dream" the "Ethiopian dream"

But not the Soviet-dream.

[Deleted]

As a non American it is a smart way to brainwash your citizens in believing they are superior in running a country...I can only hope people are less retarded then 50 years ago and are aware that plenty of other countries/zones/areas/places/whatever...have a better way of dealing with some stuff. US is lacking 2 of the biggest things I think a country/(etc..) should have and that's a decent educational and social security.

[Spectral]

US is lacking 2 of the biggest things I think a country/(etc..) should have and that's a decent educational...

American universities make up almost the entirety of every top university list worldwide (source). The only nation that can remotely claim to provide as good of university educations is the UK, everyone else has university systems that are grossly inferior, much smaller in scope, and don't provide near the research opportunities. Random public universities in the United States that you've likely never heard of top the most prestigious in other countries, and these are entirely accessible to local residents.

If you're going to talk shit, at least pick better things to target.

[Eurydemus]

There should've been options that aren't materialistic. My votes would've been for:

- Economic mobility
- Functioning social safety net
- Access to quality education at reasonable prices (or for free)

[Deleted]

There is no one definition of the American Dream. What Does the American Dream mean to you?

The idiotic idea that you dont solve your society's incredible inequality because some day you may yourself be rich.....so pretty much idiocy, but thats not just limited to America, the UK has a depressing amount of it also.

[The Casualty]

But not the Soviet-dream.

Not dying in a gulag?