[Prot] WoD/Legion Alpha Discussion

[celinamuna]

Same as me, except I prefer Holy Ritual over Pure of Heart. It's the regular talents I'm having a hard time picking what works better, though.

In the first tier both Holy Shield and Consecrated Hammer feel extremely helpful, And in the last one the increased damage on SotR from Warrior of Light makes me debate between Righteous Protector and Seraphim.

I can't seem to find any videos or discussions about prot pvp outside of early beta, though. When I'm playing I sometimes melt through whoever I'm attacking, sometimes I stick to a healer and watch him easily heal through whatever I throw at him. I'm not sure whether we do have a place in arenas right now.

http://www.wowhead.com/talent-calc/p...rotection/MT5z

Imo

[Valenhil]

http://www.wowhead.com/talent-calc/p...rotection/MT5z

Imo

I find Bastion of Light's 3min CD very hard to buy, though I guess I can never underestimate the need to burst someone down.

Knight Templar over Hand of the Protector feels weird, though. Hand is still useful when someone else is being targeted, which is a lot.

Judgement of Light should be the default choice, with Consecrated Ground limited to when no one else has a snare, right? As it's a pretty poor one.

Edit: Guys, guys, I gotta vent about this.

So I opened another ticket two days ago about my inability to train Knights, and a GM came to talk to me today. Asked me to log out for 10 minutes and he'd solve it, never mind the fact that the previous response said they couldn't do anything.

So I did, and as I came back the reply said there was nothing wrong and it was probably an issue with my UI caused by an Addon. So he had placed me right in front of the NPC and I could go ahead and train them.

And my character was in front of the NPC who trains Squires.

Another two day wait ahead of me.

[cyas]

Last I checked crit was pretty poor defensively and haste was still top.

The weights are Verse ~ Haste > Mastery > Crit for survival

Haste > Crit > Mastery ~ Verse for Damage.

Unless something changed in the last week I'm not aware of.

I also got these from icy veins. Dont know. I mained a BloodDK since Wrath - and icy veins was not always the best source for (can only speak for blooddk) this spec.
Genereally I feel little weird bout stacking Versatility. Mastery got really low atm. Is this really the way to go?
Want to play max surv until I'm 845. atm i'm at 836

[Deleted]

I'd recommend going for any plate pieces that dont have crit on them, and it will be alright.

[Rynzler88]

I also got these from icy veins. Dont know. I mained a BloodDK since Wrath - and icy veins was not always the best source for (can only speak for blooddk) this spec.
Genereally I feel little weird bout stacking Versatility. Mastery got really low atm. Is this really the way to go?
Want to play max surv until I'm 845. atm i'm at 836

I tried Vers and didn't like it.

Haste has been and probably will be our best stat unless Bliz buffs our mastery or other stats out the roof.

Lower GCDs typically mean more AM uptime which will beat any passive Dmg reduction provided from Vers.

- - - Updated - - -

I have been feeling extremely spiky compared to my fellow warrior tank and brewmaster when we were doing mythics. I would like to understand what I am doing wrong if possible, could anyone help me ? The warrior and I are doing this as off speccs while the brew master is mainspecc

Warrior will innately feel better than Paladin just because they are the new 6.1 Brewmaster monk. Anytime you can generate consistent absorb sheilds like that you will be top dog.

Paladins can only compete with warriors in terms of having more personal CDs for when their AM buttons are down or in the warrior's case, when their IP shield gets chewed through.

Brewmaster is really good in 5 mans because they can lock down packs well with their aoe stun and stagger the upfront dmg extremely well.

When it comes to raid utility though, they come up short.

Paladins will feel a little spikes at times just because people are used to having 80-90% uptime on SoTR from WoD. The new model doesn't allow this right now so it causes the player to have to think and plan out their resources carefully in higher level play.

As others have said I would recommend watching videos on every dungeon encounter (including trash) to get familiar with what to expect.

After that the best way to stop the spikes is to weave in your shorter personal CDs in areas where SoTR is down. Ardent defender and Eye of Tyr are your friends. They have short CDs. Use them.

Save your trinkets, GoTAK and LOH for the really bad moments. If you happen to dip low use Light of the Protector. This ability is extremely good right now. Use it when you are below 50% health. And I don't think it needs to be said but make sure cons and bh are up close to 100 percent.

[Deleted]

Is Avenging wrath worth using in a defensive manner?

[Tarwth]

Is Avenging wrath worth using in a defensive manner?

I think so. The 30% increased healing from AW is definitely noticeable. And on trash especially, the added DPS does a lot for shortening the period of high incoming damage (by killing the sources ). But I don't typically save it for use as a defensive manner. I tend to pop it for DPS on pull and cooldown for bosses dps and only use it defensively on trash packs.

[Pu3Ho]

Let me be more clear. In high level Mythics, outside of Shield or Guardian (and ofc Final Stand), you cannot tank certain bosses. Druids and warriors can but not protection paladins. You'll need to kite or you will just die.

? Maybe you are just bad like 99% of this thread? i completed 7/10 Mythics(+7-9) on beta as P-pally and literally had no problems in tanking any bosses there, in fact some trash was much tougher shiet.....

[celinamuna]

This right here is why I dislike when all the math is done "behind the scenes" and no actual numbers or simulations are provided. Without the underlying math/simulations, you can both say whatever you want. You might even both be right, but under different parameters. None of us have any way of evaluating either statement except to decide which skilled player we want to believe.

And yeah I know I should probably just do the math myself but I'm lacking the time - and even the state of the public sim is rather opaque at best.

I'm not sure what you're talking about in context of "math is done behind the scenes". While that's generally the case for some classes (cough dks) all of the public sims are the latest that I have. As for simulations, I do post them, but seein g how mmo-c doesn't provide a nice and easy format for hosting html files, i'm unable to really post my 17 MB reports anywhere (Except for the Screenshots and periodically updated Excel) that i do.

[Pu3Ho]

Yeah, try again on 12 on a boss with tyrannical.

Well, is there actually any reason to go anything beyond 10?.... Also, druid will too die like a shiet after mastery nerf(maybe not) imo.

[Deleted]

Same reason as CM record times much below the gold requirement: for the sake of doing it. Most people won't bother going beyond the loot cap, but some will push to the limits and for those tank choice will become highly relevant. Not so much for normal players.

[Won7on]

The damage from Tyr's Enforcer won't count for Bulwark of Order right?

Also, anyone got any Legendaries yet?

- - - Updated - - -

Is Avenging wrath worth using in a defensive manner?

The increased healing on LotP is quite noticeable. 0.35 * 1.2 * 1.35 = 0.567, that's 56.7% of your missing health before we even add Vers. I don't save it as a defensive CD, but if I'm saving it for a boss, and I need it for the healing on trash, I'll just pop it.

[Valenhil]

The damage from Tyr's Enforcer won't count for Bulwark of Order right?

It does, in fact.

[Won7on]

It does, in fact.

Wow, I can hardly believe it. I figured Tyr's Enforcer and Avenger's Shield were different spells, but I guess Blizzard was kind enough to consider that in this instance.

P.S. What about the HoT from Light of the Titans, will it be buffed by Consecration?

[Deleted]

Can any1 aid me with some trinket questions

Currently I have

2x 835 10XX STR / 8XX haste trinkets
825 Horn of Valor
825 Shivermaw Jawbone ( Sta trinket)

Ilvl 841 atm

Currently using the 2x Haste trinkets for mythics and using Horn of Valor and 1 haste for quick heroic runs.

Any suggestions from you guys? Feels like the stamina trinket doesnt seem worth it all that much and I kinda need the haste as I am around 18-20% with those 2x haste trinkets due to some poor optimized items

[Guzrud]

Can any1 aid me with some trinket questions

Currently I have

2x 835 10XX STR / 8XX haste trinkets
825 Horn of Valor
825 Shivermaw Jawbone ( Sta trinket)

Ilvl 841 atm

Currently using the 2x Haste trinkets for mythics and using Horn of Valor and 1 haste for quick heroic runs.

Any suggestions from you guys? Feels like the stamina trinket doesnt seem worth it all that much and I kinda need the haste as I am around 18-20% with those 2x haste trinkets due to some poor optimized items

Honestly it really wont matter much. I think far to often we take a gearing/itemization mindset a little to far becaseu we are all dorks myself included =P You could honestly run however you wanted. I personally would be using Horn of Valor and One of the Haste trinkets if this is your group to choose from. I am currently 850 IL and have done about 20 mythic dungeon runs with a mixed bag of trinkets Including all of these and the counterweight and my personal opinion......really very minimal difference in the play. I do prefer the Horn due to the lust/sera/pot/aw/BoL burst at the start I am able to break 600-700k dps burst when everything goes really well and that is with Wod Flask/food/pots. Once you have the gold traits that matter your survial is in a ridiculously crazy level at this point and I would fully expect us to be nerfed. I have had to solo some bosses on Mythic after my group died with 12-15 million health on the boss and managed to finish it without even using all of my CDs. Once you really get in tune with how to use SotR as a survival tool instead of trying to maximize your uptime you are damn near unkillable in most circumstances in Mythic Dungeons. I am sure at Mythic + levels things will be harder but right now I am basically invincible in the current 5 man landscape while being able to do damage on par with most dps. classes. One of the really nice things about Horn is it lines up with AW/Serpa every time and can let you do some really silly burst on big pulls. I have routinely broken 1 million dps on large pulls when I just go crazy with all of my dps CDs. My prefered Tanking Trinket setup currently is the counterwieght and the horn for dps reasons. If you were not as geared as I am you could maybe try some different trinkets but honestly with the lack of good tank Trinkets the BoA trinket is crazy good for survival early especially if you are in a dungeon with demons. Vers + 1 million absorb every 60 seconds is pretty OP on demons. There is a haste armor trinket from VH that looks like it might be pretty nice but with the current landscape of trinkets I will be going full Haste/Ver on gear with as much dps as I can get from my trinkets.

[PizzaSHARK]

What's the consensus on Blessed Hammer? As cool as it is to pretend you're playing Diablo 2 again, it just seems to be flatly inferior to either other choice once you learn Consecration. Holy Shield seems best for mass AOE and is probably better for end-game tanking, while Consecrated Hammer seems best for soloing and PvP. Is there ever a point to using Blessed Hammer once you have Consecration? 15% off of only autoattacks isn't generally that much, and it doesn't help anyone but you... at least there'd be some extra use for it if it also reduced the damage done to non-tank party members.

[celinamuna]

It does, in fact.

do you have a source on that ?

[Gallahadd]

What's the consensus on Blessed Hammer?

It's kinda broken. Does VERY high damage due to hitting 2/3 times per cast, and due to hitting so often has close to 100% uptime on the 15% melee damage reduction.

I'm not a huge fan of the spell (was always a Smiteadin in D2), but it seems like the best choice for any fight that isn't 100% spell damage based.

[Angusmcdowel]

How much are we valuing Strength right now? Is it worth going for one of the unique-equipped Strength gems, or just stick with Haste gems?