Has random tertiary stats + warforged + gem sockets made gearing more involved now?

[Radish Spirit]

No, it has made it more of a timesink through yet another thick layer of RNG.

Timesinks?!

RNG?!

It's almost like you're playing a fucking video game.

[Zergy]

Got a piece with +speed on it, added about half of a % to my move speed. You'd have to get a full set of gear with it for it to actually make a difference.

[Dasani]

Oooor you can get lucky, like me...and get multiple of your BiS items to drop was Warforged WITH a Socket.

*Hugs his Draconian Doomshield*

Well obviously WF + Socket is best, but in a straight comparison of socket vs WF, socket wins. All I was saying.

I see people confused on this topic quite a bit, they have 2 of the same item, one WF, one socketed, and they dont know which they should use. To which I reply, socket is better, unless your a cheap ass and dont wanna gem blues, then use the WF.

[Marxman]

Well obviously WF + Socket is best, but in a straight comparison of socket vs WF, socket wins. All I was saying.

I see people confused on this topic quite a bit, they have 2 of the same item, one WF, one socketed, and they dont know which they should use. To which I reply, socket is better, unless your a cheap ass and dont wanna gem blues, then use the WF.

In most cases the socket is still better even using green gems. That will no longer be the case as we get into higher ilvl where the exponential gear scaling will make WF superior.

[Deleted]

I think the main problem with gear right now is how varied the values of each stat are for each spec. So, so many classes have 2-3 worthless stats that literally ruin a piece of gear. I've been using a 610 for yonks now because of the itemization, because all my 640 CM epics have had trash stats on them. The feeling of 'Oh, a new bit of equipment. Now let's go upgrade this' is nowhere near as bad as 'Oh, 30 extra ilevels; I can finally get rid of my quest green- Oh no, wait. It's shit'.

Bring back Reforging. Bring back Reforging.

[Hey There Guys its Metro]

I would say it has, yes.

[Marxman]

The only reasons reforging was an issue was 1) you had to return to town to do it, and 2) Hit and Expertise caps. 2 is obviously no longer an issue, so why can they not just allow Reforging anywhere with some new UI? Reforging itself was great, it was Hit/Exp that was the actual issue. Now we're left with the most RNG-dependant loot system WoW has ever had... and the 1 thing making RNG not suck, Reforging, is gone now. It's a double RNG whammy that we're all feeling, and the vast majority of us HATE.

[Adoxe]

It made me actually do dungeons for longer than a day. It's a way better system than reforging and upgrading was, glad they chose to do this. Also, while true that HC Warforged is not better than normal with socket unless WF has the socket too, it does not mean that a socket-less normal is worse than socket-less Warforged just because of secondary stats not being your two most important, you need to calculate the stat value and see which one values more.

[Deleted]

Not at all, it's just more RNG. Also, the tertiary stats have turned out to be 100% utterly irrelevant and pointless. Even if a couple of them could be mildly useful if stacked on a lot of slots, there's no way you will ever get more than one or maybe two pieces with the same one.

[fangless]

I don't think it was about "easier". Hit & Expertise were not engaging stats since they were just used to "cap and forget". Especially when you were hit capped, then got a higher ilvl piece with Hit on it. Or when you got that upgrade, but could not use it until you reforged. That was not very fun game play. So they decided to change it.

None of the stat are particularly interesting, to be fair. We may as well just have +dmg, +heal, +tank stats and be done with it.

[Floopa]

tertiary, socket and warforged items are only part of the problem

the major problem is all the suffix gear.

"of the aurora" should be fucking removed

it makes running CMs/grandiose missions relatively pointless if you play certain specs, which isn't fun.

[Deleted]

Gear up quickly and finish the content? "Not enough content Blizzard. Come on. The game has only been out 3 weeks and I'm already done! Slap in the face!"

Gear up slowly with RNG elements? "Booo! Too much like D3. The game has already been out 3 weeks and I'm not even 100% optimally geared yet. Come on. Slap in the face!"

Seriously. Why is this a bad thing?

I am on your side. Even if it is the Dark Side

[ttak82]

Well it is interesting only for Challenge mode sets. Since items scale down to 630, I guess you can keep looking for the stats u want mostly for the CM set. Or Brawlers guild.

[Sorissa]

No. It basically made this World of Diablocraft.

Yeah, it's just content padding, specially the random tertiary/socket/warforged shenanigans.

Think about it like this: you want this chest piece. You run the dungeon until it drops.

Now you want it with a socket, so your chances are even smaller and you have to run said dungeon more times.

I wouldn't mind it as much if it wasn't for the friggin' randomized crafting gear.

OT: Don't think it's very interesting, you still have those two or three stats you want and ignore the others. The only way it has impacted me is that I can do more than one dungeon to get the piece of gear I want.

[Eurhetemec]

Timesinks?!

RNG?!

It's almost like you're playing a fucking video game.

<3<3<3

This.

I generally like the new system, I just feel the odds of getting warforged/socket/tertiary stats are too low when also dealing with the RNG on getting an item that has any value to you.

[Deleted]

Wasn't this change just to keep things interesting after you've been farming a place for a couple of months?

[Pengalor]

Seriously. Why is this a bad thing?

Because it's way overcomplicated and there's nowhere near enough information or tools in-game to be able to properly hash out which stats you want most. You have to go to outside sources or sims to figure it out and I'm pretty sure Blizzard doesn't want to have their largely casual audience having to figure out simcraft. The whole point of the 'attunements' for each spec were to make it easier to figure out which stat you want but when you have all these secondary stats AND you add in WF and sockets too it the water gets muddied very quickly. I think if they had kept sockets static and stuck with only WF and tertiary stats it would have been a lot better, that takes away a lot of the confusion. Trying to decide whether a WF piece with bad secondary stats is better than a non-WF with a socket, good secondaries, and a tertiary is just too much of a pain in the ass and takes away from the feeling of getting an upgrade.

[Deleted]

Because it's way overcomplicated and there's nowhere near enough information or tools in-game to be able to properly hash out which stats you want most. You have to go to outside sources or sims to figure it out and I'm pretty sure Blizzard doesn't want to have their largely casual audience having to figure out simcraft. The whole point of the 'attunements' for each spec were to make it easier to figure out which stat you want but when you have all these secondary stats AND you add in WF and sockets too it the water gets muddied very quickly. I think if they had kept sockets static and stuck with only WF and tertiary stats it would have been a lot better, that takes away a lot of the confusion. Trying to decide whether a WF piece with bad secondary stats is better than a non-WF with a socket, good secondaries, and a tertiary is just too much of a pain in the ass and takes away from the feeling of getting an upgrade.

What exactly do WF and sockets add that is not already clear? One adds more of the same on item, so nothing new, and one adds the ability to add more of 1 thing to the item. To me that seems perfectly fine and exactly as they said... just bonus, nothing complicated. Before you had to calculate and compare 2 items with sockets AND reforge in mind, now its just socket... tertiary stats are quite minor... but guess speed can be very useful for more dps time in situations with running out of stuff etc

I dont see how it is overcomplicated, since you never had tools in game that would show you what stats you want the most... you went to 3rd party sites to check and then to mr.robot because you had to balance hit and expertise with all sockets and enchants in mind... so actually getting one new item potentially meant changing sockets and reforging on ALL items you had.
And somehow this system where there is nothing to juggle, if you have socket, you just put in your best 2ndary stat and call it a day... or if you get WF, its just more of the same... no wasted stats on it possible that would make you reforge and resocket everything... you just compare them 1on1... is overcomplicated and worse... wtf really?

If you know your preferred stats (and you should easily know it), there is nothing to worry about, its pretty straightforward! I am a ret paly, i know i want mastery for 2ndary and other one is not that important, as they are all close. And for different 2ndaries, or wf with non-optimal ones... you just compare those 2 items... not whole gear set with all potential reforges and resockets lol

To me thats much better, as i know my stats and dont have to ask mr.robot if maybe this new piece of gear with "bad" 2ndaries might become better if i reforge and everything, i know immediately what option is better and its done deal, can equip right there on the spot

If you didnt know values of your stats, before you must have had a nightmare then, if now is the problem... because of reforging and everything

[Deleted]

This system suffers from the same issues that D3 originally suffered from (And still does to some extent). Layers upon layers of RNG, plus some stats being so much better for you than others.

In D3, gearing looked something like this:

Is it high enough ilvl? Yes/no.
Does it have your main stat? Yes/no.
Does it have Crit chance + crit damage + haste? Yes/no.
If yes to all of the above, did it roll well enough? Yes/no.
If no to ANY of the above, the item is worthless.

Now, in D3, you can at least grind for a long time, and it is basically the game. So with enough time, you get the good gear, and you get upgrades every now and then. Great.

In WoW? You are locked behind a weekly reset. This means that the boss has to drop gear for your class (Cloth, leather, mail, plate), then it has to roll the two correct stats, then it has to roll with a socket + warforged. Layers upon layers of RNG.

If you ask me, they should add in reforging, where you can either change one stat to another of your preference (Then you just need to hit one of the stats you want), or you can add a socket or warforged or tertiary stat (If it rolled both of the stats you need). This would remove one layer of the RNG, and ultimately make it less frustrating to see gear without both of your useful stats, or never seeing any sockets / warforged gear with both the stats you need.

Also, loot distribution is going to be a pain. One guy gets a nice piece of gear one week, and is the most valuable player on your raid team for that kind of loot. Next week it drops again with sockets and warforged, but since he already got one without it, you have to either give it to the less valuable player, or give him another piece just for the bonus rolled stuff. Sucks either way.

[Fahrenheit]

Leech is LOL worthy. I mean, if you have a few pieces with it and in full epics maybe it won't make you laugh, but now? My half of 1% damage done is just silly. If you pull 20k DPS on a boss bask in the glory that is 100 HPS.