Classmate killed a women and only got 10 days in jail.

[PBitt]

Um, he has to live with himself, that's a pretty rough punishment right there, if he wasn't drinking or anything like that and this was an accident.

[nextormento]

I would argue that a normal person goes through training on fatigue self-assessment. In fact I would say the majority of people train daily for years.

Fair enough.

If you fell asleep at the wheel, you were tired. What the fuck are you on about with fatigue assessment.

I'm coming from the angle that some amount of people are incapable to know how tired they are before entering a vehicle. Or, perhaps closer to my own experience, get tired during the driving experience. It's not uncommon for people to realize mid-travel that they are too tired to continue, thus they pull over and take a nap at a gas station or w/e.
That you'll be able to arrive to destination in one go is not a binary assessment: because driving is tiring in itself. And the awareness needed to realize you are indeed lulling down comes only with experience.

[Goradan]

So last year a classmate of mine fell asleep while driving and ended up killing a pedestrian.

Today he was told he only had to serve 10 days of a 90 day sentence, 5 years probation, 300 hours of community service, and license suspension for a year. I'm pretty sure they dropped the charge from vehicular homicide to something lesser as well.

I feel bad for both sides and my classmate is a nice guy but is that really it? Just fishing for other opinions on this.

If that is the case, then I feel for you. That is tragic

[draganid]

Would also teach him how to sell drugs and break into a car.

Assuming he could survive prison, it's basically graduate school for felons.

pretty much this. most normal people would feel like fucking garbage for the rest of their lives if they killed someone like that, pretty good odds he wont do it again.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

The man should have got at least 10 years. Killing someone is not something light.

[Kanegasi]

He should've put the pedestrian in a chokehold instead. There's no punishment for that.

[Zoranon]

Reading threads like this one should be mandatory for history students when witch trials are learned, to show the mentality that lead to them is still very common in the society.

[Deleted]

Seems kinda fucked up. He should of got like 3 years in jail (prison?).

Because everybody knows prison should be about retribution rather than rehabilitation right?

[GennGreymane]

Depending on jurisdiction honestly. In A state like NY (just where I live, some other states use it too) where its based on the MPC you have

Article 2: general principles of liability

section 2.01: Requirement of voluntary act; omission as basis of liability; possession as an act.
sub 2: the following are not voluntary acts within the meaning of this section

a: reflex or convulsion;
b: bodily movement during unconsciousness or sleep;
c: Conduct during hypnosis or resulting from hypnotic suggestion
d: a bodily movement that otherwise is not a product of the effort or determination of the actor, either conscious or habitual.

b and d are on the drivers side, of course this also depends on where this happened, many states (I think most) do not word for word use the MPC. Its just the MODEL penal code.


There are a few exceptions. If the driver was prone to randomly falling asleep on a regular basis, then the driver here is guilty of some crime depending on the other factors (likely just vehicular manslaughter or possibly manslaughter) An easier example would be someone who is prone to seizures getting in a car with out taking their medication, having a seizure, and hitting someone, it is a conscious disregard of a risk which would make the driver in that case reckless which could easily get someone convicted of manslaughter

[poser765]

I would argue that a normal person goes through training on fatigue self-assessment. In fact I would say the majority of people train daily for years.

And you would be wrong.

Normal people definitely know when they are sleepy. That's not hard. That's almost instinctual. What's not as apparent is fatigue assessment. I can assure you, fatigue assessment is not as simple as thinking you feel sleepy. Most people are not educated on the topic enough to know when they are actually fatigued and the associated risks associated with that condition.

I'll go back to my earlier comment that seems to have been ignored by most. Your body can be incredibly fatigued. To counter that you drink something with a shit ton of caffeine. After words you don't FEEL fatigued, but the reality is you ARE. You are still subject to the symptoms of fatigue...slow reaction times, poor judgement, inability to focus, etc. So you can self assess and conclude you are fit to carry out what ever activity you are screening for, but in reality you are not.

And going back to your original point, I undergo specific fatigue assessment and management training a LOT. Like yearly with home study modules quarterly and not on a volunteer basis...but as regulated by the government to my employer. So I think you are wrong...as does the US Department of Transportation.

[GennGreymane]

You also could apply the reasonable person standard (to see if negligent or reckless in this case) The driver in this case would be compared to everyone else (at least according to a jury, or judge if so chosen) To say this person was at least negligent then you must see how long it was since they had last slept, what they did that day, etc and if a reasonable person would have done the same, if yes then he was not negligent. If no then he was negligent. Although the average person does not give a shit so this would be hard to prove

I cannot see this as reckless unless there was a known impairment that required some therapy or medication to treat, that in this case was not taken.

[Eon Drache]

Would teach him to pull over when he's tired....or not get on the road at all.

Idk where you come from but doing that here costs you a job or more depending where he was going. To a friends? Sure. To start work? Way to fuck your life up. The kid was a nice guy according to the OP. Sucks, but not worth fucking your own life up. Harsh world.

[Reeve]

Seems like a reasonable thing to me. I means sucks for the person that was killed, but unless the perp has a history of this sort of thong, it sounds like it was both involuntary, and the sort of mistake that almost anyone could make. He's still getting tons of probation, community service, a license suspension, and the knowledge that he killed someone haunting him forever.

[poser765]

Seems like a reasonable thing to me. I means sucks for the person that was killed, but unless the perp has a history of this sort of thong, it sounds like it was both involuntary, and the sort of mistake that almost anyone could make. He's still getting tons of probation, community service, a license suspension, and the knowledge that he killed someone haunting him forever.

Exactly. And anything more slips the surely bonds of justice, and dances with vengeance on laughter silvered wings.

[Graeham]

I don't think anyone just passes clean the fuck out while at the wheel. You feel yourself getting tired then make the decision that you'll be okay and continue driving.

It could be linked to a medical condition that the guy wasn't aware of, even then though I think there should be a harsher sentence involved.

[jkbostic]

While I haven't read through all the pages, this sounds like the results of a criminal trial. It sounds like there wasn't any criminal intent and the accident was just that - accidental.

The driver can still be held accountable in a civil trial by the victim/victim's family for monetary compensation and losses.

[petej0]

The man should have got at least 10 years. Killing someone is not something light.

Nobody is saying that it is something "light". All this says is that this kid didnt deserve to sit in a prison because of a mistake. This isnt a bad person, it isnt like he robbed this person and shot them.

It simply isnt worth putting this kid in prison. His conscience about killing a person is more then enough punishment then prison could be.

[Ayla]

I dont understand how anyone can fall asleep at the wheel unless they have medical issues or are too fatigued to drive at all. Never once in my life have I fallen asleep at my desk/chair, anything other than when I intentionally lay down to get rest. But, I realize that I am not normal. Too many people scream for jail when its not needed. A licence suspension is more than enough.

[petej0]

I dont understand how anyone can fall asleep at the wheel unless they have medical issues or are too fatigued to drive at all. Never once in my life have I fallen asleep at my desk/chair, anything other than when I intentionally lay down to get rest. But, I realize that I am not normal. Too many people scream for jail when its not needed. A licence suspension is more than enough.

If you are sufficiently tired you can easily fall asleep sitting in a chair. In fact for some people and under certain road conditions you can get highway hypnosis despite being well rested. Which I think is what happened to truck drivers especially the one that hit Tracy Morgan.

[Deleted]

Accidents happen, falling asleep at the wheels isn't something you can easily predict. It sucks for the victim and her family but I don't think he should be punished for this. He's already got the trauma.