Death Knights use Void magic

[Deleted]

Then why does Valen bother to correct Ner'zhul's terminology? Stating the nature of Narru and how the are not celestial and therefore not called from the Void (the physical space between worlds, in opposite from the Nether - the metaphysical plane that magic travels between worlds and keeps Outland suspended from falling into the Void).

Also if void can be used interchangeably with shadow, why not just call it shadow? I mean when you refer to the game, all magic is broken down into how it was resisted. Shadow and various "void" spells and abilities react as "Shadow Spells," are spell-locked as Shadow Spells, and are resisted with Shadow Resistance... So, by turn, wouldn't it just be better and easier to call it Shadow and just drop "void" entirely? Especially when they spells have nothing to do with the actual Void (the literal SPACE between worlds, which gravity and disintegration spells from Titans would make more sense from than priests and shamans...)

you're mistaking the void for space, the void is not the space between worlds, the space between worlds is the 'Great Dark Beyond'. The void is another dimension (imo the void IS the nether but that's just my speculation). Velen clarified that the Dark Star was not a celestial body, but rather a naaru fallen from grace.

as for why the void is sometimes called shadow? terminology.

[shockzine]

well actually... he may have a point. after reading that page It describes the following relating to necromacy.

-----"When Sylvannas Windrunner committed suicide in Icecrown Citadel, she found herself in the Darkness, which was described as an infinite void where souls are tortured and tormented"

-----"The Val'kyr can reach this dimension and bring back souls from it to the material plane; but the cost of this is to take the place of the returned soul forever"

-----"After the First War, Bishop Seline investigated the dark magic used by the orc necrolytes to raise their deads. Her studies became obsessed as she tried to discover why such energy existed at all and why she began to see the ebb and flow of it in the world around her. She began preaching about the necessity of balance between dark and light, but after her death, her books were locked away in the Kirin Tor's vaults in Dalaran. Her teachings, rediscovered by Forsaken priests during the capture of the Undercity, served as the theological base for the Cult of Forgotten Shadow. "

-----"The dark energy serves as a buffer that prevents the souls of the undead from properly joining their bodies. As a result, their souls are imperfectly attached to them."

-----"One of the counsequences of the involvement of Void in the undead's metaphysics is that they only feel faint sensations of pain or discomfort from most physical stimuli. Also, that's why the Light is so painful to their existence"

-----"The Shadowmoon clan of orcs discovered the Void after the arrival of the Dark Star, but when necromancy was discovered the clan leaders outlawed the Void's power"

-----"Warlocks are magical practitioners that seek to understand darker magics, among other fel-based and destructive spells"

-----"The Void is capable of dominating and enslaving elementals. One way for a shaman to become a dark shaman is to use the Void to control elements"



Judging from this I believe all magic derives from 1 of 7 sources.

arcane- power drawn directly from the twisting nether that is basicly raw energy that can be molded.
Frost- power drawn from the elemental plane of water or invoked from the elements themselves. [my only reasoning from this is jaina calling for her water elemental by saying "Come servant of Neptulon!" in HotS]
Fire- power drawn from the elemental plane of fire or invoked from the elements themselves.
Nature- Power drawn from the life force and energy of the environment or invoked from the elements themselves.
Light(holy)- power drawn from the connections and bonds of goodness that bind all life. used to keep the universe in Order.
Shadow aka Void - power drawn from the void dimention that distorts and severs bonds of goodness. used to bring Chaos to the universe.
Fel (could possibly be merged with shadow due to sargaras being a titan of chaos)- Power drawn from demons or invoked from demons.

through all of this we have the following.

shaman- can invoke the elements through the use of frost[water], fire and nature[earth and wind] elemental contracts. by using shadow magic they can enslave the elements to their will, or even the souls of their ancestors.

druids- they either make themselves closer to nature through shapeshifting or they invoke the power of nature to attack their foes.

Priests, Paladins- use light magic to restore order to their allies or burn their enemies. no matter if the teachers were elune, naruu, ashe'e, the outcome was the same. shadow priests use the void to effect their foes mind and their bodies connection to their soul.

Blood Knights[BE palis]- originally invoked void magic to draw out the power of the light from a naruu and then bent that power to their will. now they use the new sunwell however they no longer need to syphon power from it as they now share a connection with the light.

mages- they draw power of the arcane, and then manipulate that power to take shape through one of the schools of magic. [as listed in dalaran] Abjuration, conjuration, divination, enchantment, illusion, necromancy, transmutation.
- Abjuration is the study of protective magic
- Conjuration is the study of summoning - both creatures and objects
- Divination is the school of magic dedicated to gathering information.
- Enchantment is the process of imbuing an object - or person - with magical power.
- Illusion is the art of deceiving reality itself.
- Necromancy is the study of magic involving the dead
as the twisting nether is pure raw power it can be used as a power source for tapping into the void just as it can be used to summon elementals like a shaman.

warlock- they draw upon the power of the void as well as the arcane to conjure demons, create spells designed to disrupt order and inflict maladies upon their foes.

death knights draw purely upon the cold power of the void to freeze their enemies, raise mindless minions without souls or will, and to manipulate the life force of themselves and others. out of all of the classes DKs and forsaken shadow priests seem to be the only pure source to channel the void as we are literally creatures reborn from it and strive to control that connection. the main difference between us and the forsaken is that they are continuing from where they left off before they died instead of focusing purely on shadow. forsaken shadow priests use themselves as a conduit to channel the void into this dimention and DKs invoke the void to disrupt the normal order of nature. blood drains the enemies lifeforce to sustain themselves, frost syphons all the heat from around them, banishing that heat to the void, and unholy sends a shadowing fragment of a soul trapped in the void into a former shell, then envokes the void to empower that shell. bending that minion to its will...



TLDR: void magic is just another name for shadow magic, not a separate school. naruu go from creatures of light to creatures of the void. if light and shadow are opposites and light and void are opposites, then shadow = void.

[Knslyr]

wall of text

Same type of spells can have different sources.
Like Shamans source of fire magic is divine. Mages source of fire are arcane.
Death Knights source of shadow magic is arcane. Void magic is shadow magic, but from the divine source.

[Deleted]

there is no 'arcane shadow magic'

there also isn't any 'arcane light magic'

shadow/void is divine magic, it comes from the soul just like the light, it's basically 'emotion magic'

shadow = void
sunshine = light

see what I did there?

[Aucald]

I think "void" and "shadow" are pretty much used interchangeably in WoW and DK's do use some shadow techniques and abilities that could reasonably be called "void magic." In some cases it may also be a matter of specialty such as with Shadow Priests, Shadowmages, or Dark Shamans who employ Shadow/Void magic (e.g. Ner'zhul and his Shadowmoon clan in WoD). Death Knights don't specialize in Shadow, per se - but they can certainly use it in its form as Necromancy and offensive applications.

[ThrashMetalFtw]

You previously made a ten page thread with ppl telling you that you are wrong and making fun of your "I have a thoery, so everybody else are wrong and I am god" attitude, and the best thing you could come up with, was to make another thread about the exact same topic (with the exact same result, I might add).

Really?

[Deleted]

I just don't understand why Blizzard would use the word "void" when relating to shadow magic. As far as I know, void means emptiness, an absence of matter, not darkness or shadow.

[Aucald]

I just don't understand why Blizzard would use the word "void" when relating to shadow magic. As far as I know, void means emptiness, an absence of matter, not darkness or shadow.

In the Warcraft universe, the Void is also also place (seemingly comprised almost entirely of Shadow energies) - appearing as either a dark, twisted, or shadowy version of the physical world or an abyssal howling confluence of shadow and negative essence.

[Guyviroth]

I think the OP has a point on DKs using Void magic. It is incredibly long to explain as it essentially goes all the way back to the old Orcish necromancy, and some parts are ambiguous due to lack of lore clarification.

[Quincey]

If the OP is saying I should be able to summon/enslave/have a bitch Voidwalker... I'm kinda okay with that.

If not he is acting a bit of a loon.

Shadow and void magic both being classed as dark doesn't make them both the same thing. If anything I would say Shadow is the 'darker' branch of Arcane. It (the arcane magic) being corrupted by the runes.

[Nights]

can you all please stop feeding troll...

[Guyviroth]

can you all please stop feeding troll...

If the OP was a troll, then fair enough. But he's not. He has a legitimate point; one that I will expand upon with an approx 1000 word report when I have the time. Tomorrow, most probably.

[Albert the fish]

If the OP was a troll, then fair enough. But he's not. He has a legitimate point; one that I will expand upon with an approx 1000 word report when I have the time. Tomorrow, most probably.

You are aware that playable death Knights are 3rd generation and have nothing to do with the first gen death Knights made by Gul'dan, yes?

[NuLogic]

Wasn't the ice that nerzul was sealed in from the twisting nether? Also KT was a necromancer and he used arcane magics too. Blizzard has some explaining to do.

Also death knights use runic power which is from ley lines like arcane but you use runes to get it.

It seems shadow can come from different sources just like fire comes from both arcane and elementals(which are like divine biengs explains why dark shamans would use void too).

arcane + bad intentions = shadow
arcane + bad demon intentions = fel(shadow)
divine/spiritual + bad = void(shadow)

[Solonar]

they are pulling from the void it is the basis from where the spells come from.

No, they use plain old Arcane. Necromancy is considered a dark and forbidden magic. Necromancy is a school of Arcane (others are Evocation, Conjuration, Abjuration, Transmutation, Enchantment and Divination). Arcane is used to mimic or duplicate other forms of magic (such as Fire, Frost, Shadow, Lightning, Fel). The old 1st Gen Death Knights may have used a semblance of void magic because they were Warlocks or Necrolytes but those are the likes of Teron Gorfiend, Ragnok Bloodreaver, but even then they commonly used a negative form of Arcane.

The 2nd Gen DKs are the ones following a similar path like Arthas, warriors (or commonly Paladins) who lost all faith or go so far in their faith that they become the very thing they tried to oppose. Or they picked up a vampiric runeblade from a slain 2nd Gen Death Knight. These Knights, when they used magic, used Arcane magic. Shadow and Necromancy are commonly classified as Arcane. (Shadow can also be Divine in nature - see Loa/Cult of the Forgotten Shadow).

The Death Knights we play are the 3rd Generation. Risen "heroes" who are given a runeblade upon which they inscribe runes. Inscription is yet again ARCANE. The non-canon WoW RPG has two classes, the Inscriber and Dark Inscriber. Both of these use runes that are Arcane in nature. The 3rd Gen DK functions as a warrior-dark inscriber hybrid.

I think the only person who needs to do some comprehensive reading and proper research, instead of trying to make two or three lines of text sound like a fact, is you.

[nonameelf]

Not all shadow magic is void magic.
Not all dark magic is void magic.

There's nothing to indicate that death knights use void magic. Go run Shadowmoon Burial Grounds and look at all the void magic in there, death knights really don't have anything like that stuff.

[Aquamonkey]

No, they use plain old Arcane. Necromancy is considered a dark and forbidden magic. Necromancy is a school of Arcane (others are Evocation, Conjuration, Abjuration, Transmutation, Enchantment and Divination). Arcane is used to mimic or duplicate other forms of magic (such as Fire, Frost, Shadow, Lightning, Fel). The old 1st Gen Death Knights may have used a semblance of void magic because they were Warlocks or Necrolytes but those are the likes of Teron Gorfiend, Ragnok Bloodreaver, but even then they commonly used a negative form of Arcane.

The 2nd Gen DKs are the ones following a similar path like Arthas, warriors (or commonly Paladins) who lost all faith or go so far in their faith that they become the very thing they tried to oppose. Or they picked up a vampiric runeblade from a slain 2nd Gen Death Knight. These Knights, when they used magic, used Arcane magic. Shadow and Necromancy are commonly classified as Arcane. (Shadow can also be Divine in nature - see Loa/Cult of the Forgotten Shadow).

The Death Knights we play are the 3rd Generation. Risen "heroes" who are given a runeblade upon which they inscribe runes. Inscription is yet again ARCANE. The non-canon WoW RPG has two classes, the Inscriber and Dark Inscriber. Both of these use runes that are Arcane in nature. The 3rd Gen DK functions as a warrior-dark inscriber hybrid.

I think the only person who needs to do some comprehensive reading and proper research, instead of trying to make two or three lines of text sound like a fact, is you.

You're confusing the arts with the energy. Arcane is both an art-form and an energy (and also a broad category to differentiate from Divine). If you read the Schools of Arcane Magic it's talking about the arts/studies/processes. They can be achieved through different types of energy, not just arcane.

"All schools of magic can be combined to create formidable spells that utilize multiple sources of power. Some of these potent spells are discussed later in this series of books, but beware, combining multiple types of magic can be extremely dangerous - especially for beginners."

Necromancy can be achieved through arcane energy, fel energy, void energy, troll juju, etc. Just like enchanting and any of the other arts can be performed with various energies.

What I'm trying to ask is, Enchanting is called a School of the Arcane in this book, does this mean Enchanting is not a School of Fel? Items can be enchanted w/ Fel energy, so can Enchanters be those who use Fel energy to enchant stuff?
Enchanting probably uses several magical disciplines. Didn't we have shadow enchants at one point? (DaveKosak)

[Agent]

Bump updated the original post

[Throren]

Why would you bump this? Let the thread die already!

[Musta]

SOOO.... that means we shadow priest are completely fucked up? #void tendrils #void entropy