Rogue buffs in hot fixes?

[Khebul]

Approximately 2.5% buff for assasination, 3%+ buff for combat rogues on cleave fights and 3% buff for sub.

Also, monks have been nerfed by 5%. Does this counts as a buff?

[Lillemus]

Backstab is 7-9% of total dmg on the average parse, so a small chunk, but a chunk nonetheless. These are very tiny tweaks but I still feel that the fact that we are in fact getting noticed and getting changed is a BIG deal.
In comparison Serpent sting is 10-13% of a surv hunters dmg, so a bigger buff for them - much needed as well though.

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Also, monks have been nerfed by 5%. Does this counts as a buff?

Yes! Yes it does.

[Feali]

They're just saying sorry for the statement about Combo Points. Rrrreeaaaaallllyyyy tiny buffs. And as already stated: pushes the speccs even more into their niches.

[DakonBlackblade]

First, these changes are increadibly small; maybe 2-3% for Sub and Mut on single target? Second, they really seem to be trying to reinforce these niche identities for our specs. Guess we still have to keep switching specs almost every fight.

except Assas and Sub have no niche identity when comparing one to the other...

[Deleted]

Approximately 2.5% buff for assasination, 3%+ buff for combat rogues on cleave fights and 3% buff for sub.

Also, monks have been nerfed by 5%. Does this counts as a buff?

Monks have been nerfed by around 2,5% since the damage buff only applies to about half their actual damage.

I have no friggin clue why in the whole world they could think to buff sub more then ass.

How? why? seriously?

I hate sub with all of my soul and i wish that spec would just perrish into the abyss

[Lillemus]

Monks have been nerfed by around 2,5% since the damage buff only applies to about half their actual damage.

I have no friggin clue why in the whole world they could think to buff sub more then ass.

How? why? seriously?

I hate sub with all of my soul and i wish that spec would just perrish into the abyss

And I hate assassination - Blizzard does not balance around your feelings (thankfully?) . The venom wounds buff will hopefully push Assassination above Sub for cleave fights meaning that Sub = single target - Assassination = cleave - Combat = AoE. This would fit into niches very well, but would overall be quite bad for rogues (having to juggle 3 specs in order to stay viable is, not fun, especially with different weapon load-outs).

[Skarzog]

except Assas and Sub have no niche identity when comparing one to the other...

Maybe its just me, but in my mind Sub is the single target spec and Mut is the 2 target spec; maybe 3 but at this point you start encroaching on Combat's territory. These buffs all seem to reinforce those identities, I don't suddenly think I will be playing Mut on Butcher over Sub or Sub on Twins over Mut.

[shaithis]

Some quick number-crunching:

Subt - 20% to backstab damage gets us somewhere between 1.5% to 2.3% overall damage increase (source - Heroic Butcher logs, with backstab being 7-11% of overall damage done over a few profiles I randomly clicked on). So basically almost nothing, but hey, I'll take it.

Assn - venomous wounds gives about the same damage contribution as backstab does for Subt, so let's say a 2% increase here too. Meh, clearly devs just picked two comparable impact abilities from logs and arbitrarily buffed by 20%, completely disregarding that Assn is so far behind Subt overall.

Combat- for multi-target fights such as Twin Ogron, Blade Flurry is about 15% of total damage, however the buff to it was 35 / 30 = ~16.66%, so once again, about 2-2.3% buff to overall output for multi-target fights only (arguably the only time we should even use combat at present). Once again, devs remain oblivious or are specifically choosing to ignore that the spec as a whole is woefully inadequate at dealing single-target damage.

Also, no AoE buff for Assassination. Considering all the above, well color me surprised.

[Hamel]

Why aren't there any buffs for combat rogues' single target DPS?

[Mac223]

I have no friggin clue why in the whole world they could think to buff sub more then ass.

They were both buffed by 2%. Backstab and Venmous Wounds both account for ~10% of overall damage.

[Slipspace]

They're just saying sorry for the statement about Combo Points. Rrrreeaaaaallllyyyy tiny buffs. And as already stated: pushes the speccs even more into their niches.

I don't know that I buy into all this niche spec idea. It looks to me that sub is the way to go for optimal dps in most situations (single target obviously, two target fights, and fights with 7-8+ adds). Combat is close behind it and assassination is just not as competitive in any situation.

Combat will shine on fights like tectus, probably, when tectus breaks down into his 4 motes and your raid strategy stacks everything. But that's a small portion of the fight, and sub will shine in different areas of the fight. Such as just Tectus himself and when he breaks into two.

So..yeah not buying it.

[daspels]

Its nice to finally see some roguebuffs, even though its not much. But its not really hitting us where we need it. Assa still need a aoe buff and combat lacks ST. Where is the logic? It all seems so random. "We buffed you, now shut up".

[Willoughby]

Combat was already very good at cleave. Wish they'd buff the spec's weaknesses rather than its strengths.

[Deleted]

And I hate assassination - Blizzard does not balance around your feelings (thankfully?) . The venom wounds buff will hopefully push Assassination above Sub for cleave fights meaning that Sub = single target - Assassination = cleave - Combat = AoE. This would fit into niches very well, but would overall be quite bad for rogues (having to juggle 3 specs in order to stay viable is, not fun, especially with different weapon load-outs).

Yeah i get that. Its just that i dont really care if its ass or Combat, i just dont want to play Sub in PvE. To me its allways been a pvp spec with all the going into stealth 24/7 to keep up weakness and the likes. I dont think it really belong in PvE. But thats just me i guess. I allready think ass is above sub ine some cleave fights(twin ogron+venom rush is really nice for ass).

ANd i do think juggleling three specs would be a bit much to ask.

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They were both buffed by 2%. Backstab and Venmous Wounds both account for ~10% of overall damage.

i know it doesnt count for much, but dont forget:
Hemorrhage's damage has increased by 30%.

Hmm. Apprenrly ppl dont really use hemo as Sub atm. I thought you where meant to keep up the hemo buff?

[Thelxi]

Not very impressed, but I'll take it. Venomous wounds lol..

[Regen]

They were both buffed by 2%. Backstab and Venmous Wounds both account for ~10% of overall damage.

But asking for arguments sake, if there's two targets and you maintain rupture on the second, wouldn't that make the buff a decent bit better for 2 target fights?

[Slipspace]

But asking for arguments sake, if there's two targets and you maintain rupture on the second, wouldn't that make the buff a decent bit better for 2 target fights?

For 2 target fights it should put it near sub on two target dps, even 3-4 targets. It's FoK aoe damage that needs to be looked at for assassination.

[Deleted]

First, these changes are increadibly small; maybe 2-3% for Sub and Mut on single target? Second, they really seem to be trying to reinforce these niche identities for our specs. Guess we still have to keep switching specs almost every fight.

If you got two almost complete sets of items that is..

[Lillemus]

For 2 target fights it should put it near sub on two target dps, even 3-4 targets. It's FoK aoe damage that needs to be looked at for assassination.

Twin ogron disagrees with your idea that Sub is ahead of assassination for 2 target fights

[Slipspace]

Twin ogron disagrees with your idea that Sub is ahead of assassination for 2 target fights

Twin ogron isn't always a two target fight, at least playing sub. Assassination just has to have two targets ruptured to get the benefits of two target dps, and sub has to have them ruptured as well as use FoK as a combo point builder when possible, which it can't always do in that fight. It's also just harder and more confusing so that's a big reason why logs are showing assassination as slightly better.