Biggest step back ever

[lazzy]

I'm going to have to go on and say.

Removing move while casting was the biggest step back in development I've ever seen. I don't have any clue what Blizzard was thinking with this change.

Melee can still train and not ever cast. Hunters can still cast and jump in circles. Casters are Rooted in place can be kicked and silenced and probably get off the least amount of damage in PvP as a result of this.

Not only that but Blizzard gave HUNTERS of all classes the ability that decides whether or not Casters get to DPS on the move in PvE.

What was Blizzard thinking.

[SlippyCheeze]

Is that a serious question? They were thinking "there should be some trade-off to playing a caster, since otherwise you are as mobile as melee, but with faster target switching." Also, they were thinking the same thing as when they gave mages the ability to boost raid-wide healing: "we want more raid utility on this class".

Now, why hunters are exempt from the cost of range in another, more reasonable, question to ask. This, though, is just a stock complaint when you lost an OP aspect of the class. (...and, yes, I say this as a caster.)

[TheWindWalker]

Blizzard doesn't really try to balance in any sort of serious "all should be about equal across an entire raid's worth of bosses" kind of fashion so a few things are going to slip through the cracks. As much as I could catch flak for it, I'll stand by the statement that if Hunters can cast while moving then they should be the lowest DPS class under any circumstance except heavy movement fights by default and all other classes should be buffed if Hunters ever beat them outside of those situations. People bring Hunters for mechanics. They don't need the damage as well. That isn't to say they should do awful damage but rather be the lowest points on the list of available specs.

It's why classes like Warlocks (and Windwalkers specifically in Mists) are in such bad shape and why Ele was poison at the start of the expansion. If you can't bring useful utility as a DPS then you have to bring a lot of damage.

[Traveler Voltin]

do you want melee to become benched again?

hunters are basically range melee. auto attacks and instant cast spells mostly. with like 1 or 2 "casting" abilities.

[evertonbelmontt]

do you want melee to become benched again?

hunters are basically range melee. auto attacks and instant cast spells mostly. with like 1 or 2 "casting" abilities.

What you said:

"hunters are like warriors/rogues/dks/etc, with just a few skills casting and all the rest instant".
It's like giving all these classes above a 40yd range. Balanced, right?

[Blufossa]

I'm going to have to go on and say.

Removing move while casting was the biggest step back in development I've ever seen. I don't have any clue what Blizzard was thinking with this change.

Melee can still train and not ever cast. Hunters can still cast and jump in circles. Casters are Rooted in place can be kicked and silenced and probably get off the least amount of damage in PvP as a result of this.

Not only that but Blizzard gave HUNTERS of all classes the ability that decides whether or not Casters get to DPS on the move in PvE.

What was Blizzard thinking.

Because Hunters are a special physical ranged class, like melee but ranged. They generally aren't magic damage (Survival only has some DoTs).

But yes, I agree the "no moving while casting" for magic DPS and healers is a big pile of dung decision. =/

What you said:

"hunters are like warriors/rogues/dks/etc, with just a few skills casting and all the rest instant".
It's like giving all these classes above a 40yd range. Balanced, right?

With Mages, Locks, and others currently doing pretty decent damage (to hell with simulated shit) in game, I'd say yes, it's fine for now. Not "fair", but they're hopefully working on it.

I'd love to see moving while casting come back.

[melodramocracy]

In pvp terms.. give casters mobility, and you basically nerf melee to the ground. Which leaves you with a choice of either reducing caster output to compensate, or giving melee more gap closers.

Which of these scenarios do you think is better?

[Traveler Voltin]

What you said:

"hunters are like warriors/rogues/dks/etc, with just a few skills casting and all the rest instant".
It's like giving all these classes above a 40yd range. Balanced, right?

it sounds like you dont understand hunters at all.
hunters are nothing like casters.

[The Kao]

Oh well. In PvE you're good. Really, I mean it. I've played casters since forever and it's not much different. You just have to plan ahead a bit. Skillplay.

PvP on the other hand has pretty much died for me. Not that I played it very intensely in WoW to begin with. For me it is just a mini game, best played with melee since forever. But outside of the large cuddleball raid movement that is Ashran I'd rather not go and PvP with a caster today.

[lazzy]

In pvp terms.. give casters mobility, and you basically nerf melee to the ground. Which leaves you with a choice of either reducing caster output to compensate, or giving melee more gap closers.

Which of these scenarios do you think is better?

Well someone with a level 100 ret/feral/warrior I can tell you I've NEVER been more OP vs casters than right now. The only time I've been this powerful was when Druid / warrior was OP in BC/LK.

I have zero problems destroying a caster and limit them to do just about nothing.

Even before I never had a problem being "kited" by casters. Freedom/dispel as a ret is more than enough, Shift on druid is more than enough and double Charge / leap on my warrior was more than enough to stick.

Also do DK's not have a freedom / Grip / slow / ranged DMG? I think they do because I played one at 90.

I'm not a pro but as a 2k+ arena player I think I had a pretty Okay time sticking to casters.

The mobility wasn't the problem it was the "Instant" let me repeat that "Instant" dmg they could put out not the HARD CAST.

[evertonbelmontt]

it sounds like you dont understand hunters at all.
hunters are nothing like casters.

It seems you have a serious reading problem.

And just to add to it, when you realize what I said, try and respond to this:
What disadvantage does hunters have in PVP? They can't be locked, nor trained (you must really suck as a hunter to get trained), CC is on par with everyone else, utility also. Damage... yeah, damage is there. It may sound "ok" in PVE, but PVP is another story.

[cFortyfive]

It's why classes like Warlocks (and Windwalkers specifically in Mists) are in such bad shape and why Ele was poison at the start of the expansion. If you can't bring useful utility as a DPS then you have to bring a lot of damage.

I agree that hunter shouldn't be tuned to be the highest dps given their mobility. Can't really agree with windwalker being in super terrible shape though.

I'd love to see moving while casting come back.

While it definitely might make a come back given the constant qq it really doesn't fit into their approach to balancing the game.

Which leaves you with a choice of either reducing caster output to compensate, or giving melee more gap closers.

That's the actual problem - you never really could compensate in terms of output. You'd never get people to agree that range comes at a damage disadvantage.

[Traveler Voltin]

It seems you have a serious reading problem.

And just to add to it, when you realize what I said, try and respond to this:
What disadvantage does hunters have in PVP? They can't be locked, nor trained (you must really suck as a hunter to get trained), CC is on par with everyone else, utility also. Damage... yeah, damage is there. It may sound "ok" in PVE, but PVP is another story.

I am talking about PvE here not PvP.

[bowchikabow]

True, there should be some trade off... that trade off shouldn't be "if you stop you can cast, but if you cast, melee can train you.. so you won't be casting" is not even close to ok.

Frost mage was gutted hardcore... It did need some pruning, but not the massive nerf bat it took.. Fire is so cast heavy it is still useless in arena or serious pvp.. Arcane is so mana intensive that it is not practical to use outside of super short burst gameplay. I focus on mages because I play one. I wish they would stop swinging the pendelum sooooo heavily.


And to the poster above me... if your gripe is with pve.. then you are a moron. It's true.

Highmaul has not proven to be caster-hating material. Sure, there is a lot of movement, and sure, hunters are doing beastly amounts of damage.. but that is something they know needs to be tuned down.. casters overall (since when you eliminate hunters, the delta across caster classes is NOT overly wide) are not in a bad place. I think you just need to take some time and learn the more details aspects about playing your class/role.

But hey, you're payin to play.

[Deleted]

But yes, I agree the "no moving while casting" for magic DPS and healers is a big pile of dung decision. =/.

I'd love to see moving while casting come back

then pray tell why should anyone play melee?.

[Socialhealer]

as an ele with zero mobility i chose the easier route, refuse to pvp.

sorry but standing still, or using everything in your arsenal to attempt to kite something that just won't be kited, then dying to someone just smashing abilities you have no way to stopping but they can stop half of yours isn't fun anymore.

[Teebu]

What I dislike is that everyone and their dog has an interrupt/silence yet almost nobody has a disarm, if any after the squish. You can silence a caster during burst, but you can't do shit against melee when they do it. Other than CC of course, but that applies to casters as well, so not a fair comparison.

That's my only gripe with PvP at the moment. For PvE I prefer it this way, much easier to spot who is good with say, Ice Floes on a Mage.

[Deleted]

Boss moves or uses PBAOE and Melee do no dmg for a few seconds.

Casters can keep casting for most of the fight except when they get targetted by an ability.

Everyone is saying that so far most fights favor ranged dps due to high movement or other mechanics, so I don't get why every ranged dps suddenly has to complain about the lack of moving while casting.

[meheez]

hunter master class

[bowchikabow]

Unknown Healer... every boss that silences, forces short movements in 30sec windows, and interrupts... DOESN'T affect melee.. it affects casters and healers... I am sorry, but did thokk affect melee for ENTIRE PHASES? no. Did unstable magic in ICC affect melee? nope.. Do melee have to stop moving before beginning to attack (and I don't mean just auto attack either)? no. You can't compare the two in that way.