Gunned Down: The Power of the NRA

[Daerio]

In other countries we call it bribes and corruption, in US they branded it legally as "lobbying".

Something we agree on, government is corrupt.

It's why we need the guns.

[THE Bigzoman]

Yeah, I don't know why people don't see the clear and present cultural differences when they think about policy. Put simply, culture matters. There are reasons that the local Silicon Valley culture has churned out staggering amounts of intellectual property and achievement while Mississippi can't seem to get out of its own way, and I don't think state policies have a whole lot to do with it. Imagine how silly someone would sound saying, "well, why doesn't Mississippi just do what the Bay Area is doing, that seems to work?". A lot of these sorts of things are organic, emergent, and hard to predict or replicate.

Maintaining American productivity while providing Swedish egalitarianism, Finnish education, and Danish social cohesion would be pretty sweet! I like that imaginary place! I also don't see a way to magic it into existence.

Too add to this, The collective unity in Europe in a domestic sense is probably because of centuries of having to at least tolerate one another. Most of the time they were fighting other Europeans rather than themselves.

There are exceptions to this tendency throughout europe's history, of course.
I like your contributions to discussions that involve "Europe is awesome, stupid americans!" because you mention what economists say before I have a chance too.

There was a particular post about living standards and productivity in the U.S where you threw in a "oh how the excuses fly" that made me chuckle.

[Deleted]

Something we agree on, government is corrupt.

It's why we need the guns.

Except in this case they did a double bet. They get money from guns sold, people buy them because they are affraid the government is corrupt and might abuse them. One of this might happend in the future (governemnt abusing citizens), the other happens now (politicians getting in bet with NRA and getting a sweet money/campaign deal out of it).

[Spectral]

In other countries we call it bribes and corruption, in US they branded it legally as "lobbying".

That you believe there are nations that are free (or even relatively free) of governmental corruption is so naive that it's almost quaint.

How do you suppose it is that the United States, despite being so very dysfunctional in your eyes, manages to produce more median income than all but a couple oil-producing and banking nations?

[Daelak]

People can't figure out where the NRA "fanaticism" comes from... they point it out pretty clearly in the documentary. It comes from the population. Americans want their guns, and nobody is going to take them. I don't think a poll can be any clearer than that.

So when you start deciding you know what's better for people than they do, tread carefully. They have guns.

Bullshit. That was true in the 50's. Now they are a glorified gun manufacturers' sales pusher.

[Spectral]

Bullshit. That was true in the 50's. Now they are a glorified gun manufacturers' sales pusher.

If you were an organization that promoted gun rights and gun ownership, wouldn't it make sense to promote the interests of gun manufacturers? If not, why not? I would think that there would be so much overlap between the interests of gun owners and gun manufacturers that a lobbying group that serves each individually would be almost indistinguishable from one that serves them both.

[THE Bigzoman]

Bullshit. That was true in the 50's. Now they are a glorified gun manufacturers' sales pusher.

Accessibility of a good that someone believes is his right to own and the ability of firms to produce said good go hand in hand. They aren't mutually exclusive.

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If you were an organization that promoted gun rights and gun ownership, wouldn't it make sense to promote the interests of gun manufacturers? If not, why not? I would think that there would be so much overlap between the interests of gun owners and gun manufacturers that a lobbying group that serves each individually would be almost indistinguishable from one that serves them both.

See what I mean?

[Daelak]

If you were an organization that promoted gun rights and gun ownership, wouldn't it make sense to promote the interests of gun manufacturers? If not, why not? I would think that there would be so much overlap between the interests of gun owners and gun manufacturers that a lobbying group that serves each individually would be almost indistinguishable from one that serves them both.

Of course not, let them have their own trade group. This creates an amalgamation of weird propaganda for certain types of guns and gives credence to the survivalist, apocalypse fringe crowd, ensuring arms sales always be higher than in the absence of a media front group like the NRA

[Deleted]

If you were an organization that promoted gun rights and gun ownership, wouldn't it make sense to promote the interests of gun manufacturers? If not, why not? I would think that there would be so much overlap between the interests of gun owners and gun manufacturers that a lobbying group that serves each individually would be almost indistinguishable from one that serves them both.

Watch the fucking documentary instead of bing a prick. They shifted from being an organistion for the people to being the middle man between politics and gun manufacturers. It amazes me how much of a fucktard you can be. I feel sorry for all the citizens that have to endure and die because pricks like you get to "keep your toys" because of a right that was passed when the only law was the one made by the men holding the biggest rifle/gun.

Infracted

[btorz]

Watch the fucking documentary instead of bing a prick. They shifted from being an organistion for the people to being the middle man between politics and gun manufacturers. It amazes me how much of a fucktard you can be. I feel sorry for all the citizens that have to endure and die because pricks like you get to "keep your toys" because of a right that was passed when the only law was the one made by the men holding the biggest rifle/gun.

you don't live in america, no one cares that you're getting mad.

[THE Bigzoman]

Watch the fucking documentary instead of bing a prick. They shifted from being an organistion for the people to being the middle man between politics and gun manufacturers. It amazes me how much of a fucktard you can be. I feel sorry for all the citizens that have to endure and die because pricks like you get to "keep your toys" because of a right that was passed when the only law was the one made by the men holding the biggest rifle/gun.

Didn't take long for you to self-destruct eh?

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Of course not, let them have their own trade group. This creates an amalgamation of weird propaganda for certain types of guns and gives credence to the survivalist, apocalypse fringe crowd, ensuring arms sales always be higher than in the absence of a media front group like the NRA

You're avoiding his question.

[Sunseeker]

Watch the fucking documentary instead of bing a prick. They shifted from being an organistion for the people to being the middle man between politics and gun manufacturers. It amazes me how much of a fucktard you can be. I feel sorry for all the citizens that have to endure and die because pricks like you get to "keep your toys" because of a right that was passed when the only law was the one made by the men holding the biggest rifle/gun.

Calling everyone you disagree with a 'prick' doesn't help your argument.

[THE Bigzoman]

I'd rather lobbies didn't decide anything and instead of spending their dollars to influence congress, spent their dollars educating people in an unbiased manner so that they may better decide on issues and what to ask their congresspeople for. Then again, I doubt anyone would invest significant resources in such an organization just to have them educate people in a way that stands a real risk of educating them away from the desired outcome.

That's counterintuitive for a lobby group though. If they spent time educating people on their issue so they could make informed decisons, then they would have to present the opposition in a non-biased way.

I do see what you're saying though, and think that this would make society all the better and more able to think critically.

We can dream.

[Fincayra]

The point of the second amendment was for the people to defend itself if they ever had to overthrow the government. It was not a "we're men, we get guns" amendment.

If you seriously think that we won't need guns when the revolution comes, you got another thing coming.

[THE Bigzoman]

The point of the second amendment was for the people to defend itself if they ever had to overthrow the government. It was not a "we're men, we get guns" amendment.

If you seriously think that we won't need guns when the revolution comes, you got another thing coming.

What are the chances of civil unrest even reaching that point and becoming so lopp sided between the people and trynarry, much less a munity being successful?

[Zathrendar]

ITT: more whining about guns and the NRA.

Sadly idiots like these have already managed to get any means of reasonable self-defence in Europe outlawed, forcing us to rely on our even more useless police forces. I hope Americans have the common sense to ignore these imbeciles.

[Nadiru]

In other countries we call it bribes and corruption, in US they branded it legally as "lobbying".

Other countries have lobbyists, don't kid yourself. If the US has it worse than Europe, it's because there's more worth in lobbying an American Congressman than their French or Swiss or yes, Romanian counterparts.

[Dispraise]

Nobody is going to stop me from dual-wielding luparas. Nobody.

But seriously, don't we have a shitty megathread for this crap?

The second amendment ran its course. Time for change.

You can have your change, when you pry it from my cold dead hands.

[RicardoZ]

Isn't it amazing the way people like powerful lobbies that represent their interests and dislike powerful lobbies that represent other people's interests? It's almost like the problem isn't powerful lobbies, but merely that they disagree with you.

Everybody is willing to give at least one powerful special interest lobby a pass because everybody has at least one issue that's like a bee in their bonnet and they want to see it eliminated, criminalized, preserved, promoted, otherwise no matter what.

[Nadiru]

Everybody is willing to give at least one powerful special interest lobby a pass because everybody has at least one issue that's like a bee in their bonnet and they want to see it eliminated, criminalized, preserved, promoted, otherwise no matter what.

Thus legitimizing the concept of lobbying as a whole, because nobody wants to see their pet issue's lobby go away. Also, unfortunately, legitimizing emotional politics.