Which Spec Deserves a Revamp? - Warlock Edition

[Rarespawn2012]

I don't think an overhaul is required, however the vl 90 and lvl 100 talents need to eb redone entirely. I think making doomguard and infernal perma pets should be a lvl 90 and something that amps up burning embers a lvl 100 choice.(Sort of have that now but the dps loss\ makes it meh)
As for demonology, I'd play more of that if the reward for lvl 100 was making metamorphosis a permanent transformation, make it coincide with grimoire of sacrifice or something.

[Deleted]

I'd be very happy if affliction was revamped or reverted back to an older model.

A more objective improvement would be replacing the lvl 90 and 100 talent rows though, since they impact everyone and are pretty disgustingly bad.

Destruction could use Fel Flame and ROF back, though it's pretty functional as is.
Demonology I think could use it's AOE looking at, it feels far too un-intuitive, which is possibly worse than just being straight up bad.

[Deleted]

Affliction without snapshots isn't affliction. Remove snapshots -> revamp spec.

[Deleted]

Affliction needs a revamp. Snapshotting was what made the spec engaging. Now that it's gone I would be surprised if Affliction is not the most braindead spec in the game right now.

Demonology's AoE is strange. You have massive burst AoE but then... what...?

Destruction plays terribly without something to cast on the move. Getting AoE up and running without RoF is also a major pain in the arse.

[Jessicka]

I'd be very happy if affliction was revamped or reverted back to an older model.

I'd be happy to go back to the Cataclysm model. Maybe if they'd had more imagination then SB Vs Malefic Grasp could have been a talent option. Regardless, the spec needs to go back to its roots as a 'slow build, strong noticable execute' spec instead of the current 'front loaded but with an unnoticable "execute" that just happens because nostalgia' model.

I kinda like the Shards as a Haunt resource model generally, but there must be some space between the current iteration and the popular Cataclysm model.

[Santoisms]

Hello!

I'm making one of these for every class, and am going to pit the winners in an ultimate thread afterwards, to see what spec is the most popular pick for an update or change.

So which of the Warlock specs do you think needs or deserves a revamp? It could be because it lacks flavor and fun, the rotation is messed up or boring, or simply that the spec just doesn't fit the image of what you want it to be.

Keep in mind that 'weak' or underperforming specs isn't what I'm looking for, that's a balance and tuning issue. This is about the feel of the spec.

What do you think?

I wouldn't necessarily say "Revamp", but they do have a few things per spec that need to be changed.

Affliction: Nightfall needs to be fixed, either put a cap on how many Corruptions can proc a free Shard, as well as a higher chance to proc single target.

Demonology: I suspect Demo to get tuned down for Blackrock Foundry. BRF gear is all Haste and Mastery and that really benefits Demo as well as Affliction, the Demonbolt time reduced as well as Imp Swarm, using perhaps a cycle of Demonbolts in between every Dark Soul.

Destruction: Same as Affliction, they need to change Rain of Fire to not give you Embers on single target but it needs to trigger Embers on AoE so it doesn't become a useless spell.

I like the changes so far for 6.1, bringing the other pet talents in line of Supremacy, as well as the Level 100 talents becoming a bit more in line, however, I stil suspect them to tune Demo down a bit.

[Deleted]

I just want them to remove the Soul Shard cost on Soul Swap for Affliction and fix Rain of Fire for Destruction.

[Santoisms]

I just want them to remove the Soul Shard cost on Soul Swap for Affliction and fix Rain of Fire for Destruction.

Either remove the cost of Soul Swap, put a charge system on it, or give us more baseline shards, but I've been saying that since beta.

[Mekkle]

ALL of them need it in my opinion, they all just don't feel right. especially demo.

[Deleted]

I'd be happy to go back to the Cataclysm model. Maybe if they'd had more imagination then SB Vs Malefic Grasp could have been a talent option. Regardless, the spec needs to go back to its roots as a 'slow build, strong noticable execute' spec instead of the current 'front loaded but with an unnoticable "execute" that just happens because nostalgia' model.

I kinda like the Shards as a Haunt resource model generally, but there must be some space between the current iteration and the popular Cataclysm model.

Pretty close to my views on it, not a fan of affliction turning into a burst spec with faulty resource generation hindering it's sustained and our execute phase going from the most interesting one in the game to an invisible, flat damage boost at the end (or a glass half empty man would say, reduction for the first 75%) is depressing.

Shards I'm torn on. They were the one silver lining to the revamp since they were utterly useless in Cata, but the more I look at them, the more they seem to be destruction's resource model done worse. Get one on a kill, spend one during procs for a damage boost, but infuriatingly random. I'm sure something could be done with them, but the current incarnation certainly isn't enough to make me think the revamp did anything good.

I just want them to remove the Soul Shard cost on Soul Swap for Affliction and fix Rain of Fire for Destruction.

I'd rather Soul Swap went back to a cooldown. Without a SS cost it starts eclipsing everything else once you hit enough targets. One of the few things I liked about WOD's affliction changes was that it at least brought hardcasting back and got rid of SS, even if I think that making it a trap button is a horrible way of killing it.

[Deleted]

Affliction needs a revamp. Snapshotting was what made the spec engaging. Now that it's gone I would be surprised if Affliction is not the most braindead spec in the game right now.

Demonology's AoE is strange. You have massive burst AoE but then... what...?

Destruction plays terribly without something to cast on the move. Getting AoE up and running without RoF is also a major pain in the arse.

Basically 100% what this guy said^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[Deleted]

I don't think we need a revamp but lots of undo.

Felflame & RoF in destro. The capacity to heal pet. The instant incinerate proc when hit (can't remember the name)

Potent SoC & bring back dot snapshotting in affli.

Bring back potent aoe also in demonology and for the love of God let's have a female metamorphosis form.

MF that is useful
KjC that is useful
Demonic portal that is useful
Healthstone that is useful

Nice to have back but let's not dream too much with the ability pruning designers:
drain mana
Searing pain
Glyph of tanking in demonology
And much more

I must say WoD is truly the first time since I play WoW that I find Warlock uninspiring, bland, maimed and boring.

[Itisamuh]

I don't think a full on revamp is necessary, but I'd rather destro had a little more mobility, and giving fel flame back to all specs wouldn't hurt.

[Grizelda]

Shards I'm torn on. They were the one silver lining to the revamp since they were utterly useless in Cata, but the more I look at them, the more they seem to be destruction's resource model done worse. Get one on a kill, spend one during procs for a damage boost, but infuriatingly random. I'm sure something could be done with them, but the current incarnation certainly isn't enough to make me think the revamp did anything good.

Might as well make it 10 or 20 ticks of channeled DS per shard.

[Jessicka]

Pretty close to my views on it, not a fan of affliction turning into a burst spec with faulty resource generation hindering it's sustained and our execute phase going from the most interesting one in the game to an invisible, flat damage boost at the end (or a glass half empty man would say, reduction for the first 75%) is depressing.

Shards I'm torn on. They were the one silver lining to the revamp since they were utterly useless in Cata, but the more I look at them, the more they seem to be destruction's resource model done worse. Get one on a kill, spend one during procs for a damage boost, but infuriatingly random. I'm sure something could be done with them, but the current incarnation certainly isn't enough to make me think the revamp did anything good.

When you're not completely starved, as is currently the case - especially with SB: Haunt which is the current major issue here - I actually like the mechanic of weaving them in and around DoT durations, using downtime to refresh DoTs and 'sufficient' timers across all three to pop Haunt and channel over that. Didn't feel like Destruction in the slightest (if any model is "Destruction done worse" it has to be Demonbolt, which does Destruction without the flexibility or extra tools of Havoc and Shadowburn); and I was fine with that playstyle, although I guess you could argue it was "Shadow Priest/Insanity done worse" :P

Even having Drain Soul to switch to in the execute meant Haunt had 100% up time, and you had extra Shards to burn, so the execute was a little different - it could have been more different like the old cast-time -> drain contrast, or SPriests Shadow Word: Death, sure - but it was a different feel and that could have been built on with the extra resources spent on something more than Haunt.

I'd rather Soul Swap went back to a cooldown. Without a SS cost it starts eclipsing everything else once you hit enough targets. One of the few things I liked about WOD's affliction changes was that it at least brought hardcasting back and got rid of SS, even if I think that making it a trap button is a horrible way of killing it.

As I suggested in the other thread, free to use for a quick switch and a Shard cost if you want to throw out some additional multidotting after the first target. I think that would achieve the same effect of reducing spam swapping, while keeping it useful for when it's really needed. The Cataclysm model was good, certainly not overpowered, but there is room for improvement on that for sure.

[Pungchow]

destro is fine but the shard building on afflic sucks , and demo has been made unfun by just spaming demo bolts and then out of demo form. But with the higher gear level most are fine now if you enchant right. Only thing in need of a fix is rain of fire , mobility

[Kanariya]

Affliction needs a revamp, and by revamp I mean reversion to pre-5.0. Aff was the saving grace of Cata for me, it was the best spec in the entire game and the most engaging and fun to play. It sucks so terribly now.

[Phoenexis]

I'd be happy to go back to the Cataclysm model.

Who wouldn't? It doesn't make sense apart from Demonology to turn warlocks into a bursty class with little mobility and relatively bad sustained damage. Blizzard's literally made a 180 turn when it comes to warlock design concepts.

As for Soul Shards and warlock resources in general, I think it was great having a resource that was strictly for utility. You don't really feel rewarded when you spend an Ember to heal up or a shard to rez your pet/get a speed boost. You feel penalized because you're behind on precious resources which are essential to your damage. That's bad design because in most cases what you get in terms of utility comes at the cost of losing lots of damage. It also means you can't be as creative and smart managing your utility spells based around resources because in 90% of cases it's just better to use Haunt/Chaos Bolt/Soulburn.

[uhhwateva]

Everyone ITT says Affliction needs a revamp but I disagree. Sure, I miss snapshotting and Pandemic thresholds, but I still love the spec. Single target; it's very straight forward and monotonous, yes... but multi-dotting with SB:H is pretty fun and I love the feeling of juggling all the DoTs and keeping optimal up-time on everything, it's a very engaging spec IMO.

[Jessicka]

Who wouldn't? It doesn't make sense apart from Demonology to turn warlocks into a bursty class with little mobility and relatively bad sustained damage. Blizzard's literally made a 180 turn when it comes to warlock design concepts.

As for Soul Shards and warlock resources in general, I think it was great having a resource that was strictly for utility. You don't really feel rewarded when you spend an Ember to heal up or a shard to rez your pet/get a speed boost. You feel penalized because you're behind on precious resources which are essential to your damage. That's bad design because in most cases what you get in terms of utility comes at the cost of losing lots of damage. It also means you can't be as creative and smart managing your utility spells based around resources because in 90% of cases it's just better to use Haunt/Chaos Bolt/Soulburn.

Soul Shards as a finite utility resource was a nice idea, and interesting in PvP. It was basically redundant in PvE though, and that was a real problem.