Questions regarding resto gear in BRF and BIS List

[Jayjayhey]

My guild asked us to present our BiS lists, and this is what I've come up with:

Weapon: Inferno Flame Staff Gruul
Bracers: Squire's Electroplated Bracers Operator Thogar
Ring 1: Spellbound Runic Band of Infinite Preservation Legendary Quest
Ring 2 (no spirit, best stats): Uk'urogg's Corrupted Seal Iron Maidens
Ring 2 (spirit, worse stats): Six-Eyed Band Hans'gar and Franzok
Boots: Iron-Flecked Sandals Trash Loot
Belt: Girdle of Unconquered Glory Hans'gar and Franzok
Trinket 1: Darmac's Unstable Talisman Beastlord Darmac
Trinket 2: Blackiron Micro Crucible Blackhand
Neck (no spirit, best stats): Gruul's Lip Ring - Gruul
Neck (spirit, worse stats): Talisman of the Fomor Kromog
Back (no spirit, best stats): Runefrenzy Greatcloak Kromog
Back (spirit): Flame Infusion Drape Beastlord Darmac
Chest (not tier): Unrendable Wolfhide Robes Beastlord Darmic
Helm (tier): Living Wood Headpiece Kromog
Legs (tier): Living Wood Legguards The Blast Furnace
Gloves (tier): Living Wood Grips Iron Maidens
Shoulders (tier): [Living Wood Spaulders Operator Thogar

A few questions..

1.) Huge question. Why does our spirit gear have our worst stats? Aside from the cape off beast lord, our rings and necks with spirit on them have completely garbage stats like crit and no haste. What do we choose here? Spirit vs a haste/mastery combo on a neck..

and I just double checked, all highmaul gear with spirit (minus the force nova cloak off imperator) has either haste or mastery on it. Why is there a sudden change now in BRF?

For ex, the rings. The ring off Iron Maidens has haste and mastery. The ring off hans'gar and fronz has spirit and ... multistrike. wtf? I know it's not our worst stat but why give us multistrike? the ring off iron maidens looks way more attractive. So I should be hurting because I want the ring with our best stats on it?

2.) Is this list accurate? I just made it up so I'm open to suggestions.

3.) It looks like tier is going to be obtained regardless if using 4 piece or not because of the gear having better stats overall if going for haste build?(which > mastery atm).

[Thalur]

1.) Huge question. Why does our spirit gear have our worst stats? Aside from the cape off beast lord, our rings and necks with spirit on them have completely garbage stats like crit and no haste. What do we choose here? Spirit vs a haste/mastery combo on a neck..

There's a back with haste. Other than that, it doesn't really matter because it's only 2 items (neck, one ring) with very low item budget. Also, multistrike and crit are almost as good as haste and mastery (all those stats are really good, the only stat that is not as good is versatility). It won't make a difference.

Edit: if you really think crit and multistrike are garbage, you have a long way to go learning how resto druids work.

2.) Is this list accurate? I just made it up so I'm open to suggestions.

Looks good. You definitely want to use the spirit items for neck, back and ring. For trinkets it depends; if you have candle, keep it.

3.) It looks like tier is going to be obtained regardless if using 4 piece or not because of the gear having better stats overall if going for haste build?(which > mastery atm).

Yes. However, personally I will pass on all tier gear as long as other classes need it, and claim the non-tier items for myself. Their stats are slightly worse, but overall it's a big gain for the raid to give the tier sets to classes that actually get something from them.

[IndyBart]

For your trinkets, you might check out the Iron Spike Chewtoy. That thing is boss....

[Jayjayhey]

There's a back with haste. Other than that, it doesn't really matter because it's only 2 items (neck, one ring) with very low item budget. Also, multistrike and crit are almost as good as haste and mastery (all those stats are really good, the only stat that is not as good is versatility). It won't make a difference.

Edit: if you really think crit and multistrike are garbage, you have a long way to go learning how resto druids work.



Looks good. You definitely want to use the spirit items for neck, back and ring. For trinkets it depends; if you have candle, keep it.



Yes. However, personally I will pass on all tier gear as long as other classes need it, and claim the non-tier items for myself. Their stats are slightly worse, but overall it's a big gain for the raid to give the tier sets to classes that actually get something from them.

well maybe garbage wasn't the right word, but what I was getting at was that our worst stats are on the items with spirit. Crit is our least favored state compared to haste.

in regards to candle, I would assume priority is..

[H] Blackiron Micro Crucible (Blackhand) > [M] Darmac's Unstable Talisman > Everburning Candle > [H] Darmac's Unstable Talisman?

[Tsilyikes]

Is there a particular reason you're shooting for 0 regen trinkets as bis, one with a MS proc which is not our most desirable stat? honestly you could even get away with mythic kargath neck/ko'ragh helm, small int loss for the stats you really want, especially if you get a socket or WF.

[Ctee]

I justed replied to an identical post.

This is what I came up with...

Head - Sorka's Nightshade Cowl (Iron Maidens)
Neck - Talisman of the Fomor (Kromog)
Cloak - Barrage Dodger Cloak (Oregorger)
Chest - T17 (Flamebender)
Hands - Cannonball Loader's Grips (Beastlord)
Belt - Girdle of Unconquered Glory (Hanz/Frans)
Pants - T17 (Blast Furnace)
Boots - Treads of the Dark Hunt (Iron Maidens)
Ring - Legendary ring
Ring - Uk'roggs Corrupted Seal (Blackhand)
Trinket - Ironspike Chew Toy (Beastlord)
Trinket - Auto-Repairing Autoclave (Blackhand)
Weapon - Inferno Flame Staff (Gruul)
Shoulder - Flamebender's Shoulderguards (Flamebender)
Wrist - Squire's Electroplated Bracers (Operator)

[Jayjayhey]

Gear with more Int will always be our BiS, regardless of regen. If you're having regen issues, then you can switch, but at the end of the day, the trinket off Blackhand will be BIS due to high Int.

[Tsilyikes]

I'm not sure I agree with that, having more regen on your trinkets will allow you freedom in your stat choices for other accessory items. you could take mythic chewtoy and candle or the autoclave (the latter simply because of the ridiculous amount of static spirit on it) for instance.

[Jayjayhey]

If you need the regen, then go for it. But Intellect is our main stat and is accounted for the most.

Mythic Chewtoy has 251 Int.

Mythic Blackiron Crucible has a whopping 424.

Crucible blows chewtoy out of the water.

[Tsilyikes]

I suppose to each his or her own, but I'd be surprised if your guild awarded those trinkets to you before every caster dps who wanted either of them had one or both. They'd be silly to do so, and passing up chewtoy is a no-no. It has plenty of int and a spirit proc in place of crit.

[Jayjayhey]

I am not exactly sure why you're disagreeing with me that Int is not our best stat, because it is a known fact the Int is more important than any other stat we have.

This is a BiS list. Chewtoy is not our BIS.

[Tsilyikes]

Int is certainly our best stat but... you are aware that if you take all the items you list specifically as BIS you could end up with 145 spirit from gear. You need *some* regen. even with all the spirit items you have listed it's only 499 spirit from gear, and that's mythic gear. You will need regen on the longer encounters such as blast furnace, iron maidens and blackhand, even on heroic.

[Jayjayhey]

I have 120 spirit from gear with 640 hourglass + candle and am healing heroics + mythic highmaul just fine

it's a case by case basis. if you are having mana issues, then swap a piece out or two, but that does not mean those pieces are our BiS. Is chewtoy/auto-repairing autoclave the best regen trinkets out of BRF? yes. are they the BIS trinkets? definitely not.

regen is not a requirement. you don't "need" some regen. if you are having mana issues, then yes, swap out a piece. but regen is not REQUIRED. if it is, chances are you might be overhealing and/or using wrong spells at the wrong time. you may also not be having a high uptime on lifebloom.

remember, this is a start to a new raid as well. once we are all geared in new heroic/mythic gear, chances are you will never have to even use any regen trinket, which makes the higher int ones the choice to use. they will always be BiS.

[nightfalls]

I am not exactly sure why you're disagreeing with me that Int is not our best stat, because it is a known fact the Int is more important than any other stat we have.

This is a BiS list. Chewtoy is not our BIS.

That's an extremely narrow-minded statement. Yes, Int may be worth more than any other stat, but that does not mean its value is infinity versus other stats having zero value.

If you can actually back up that the throughput on your non-regen trinkets is worth more than the throughput + regen combined on a spirit trinket, then maybe you'd have a better argument other than repeating your "... but, more int!"

---

What I have for trinkets:

Autoclave > Ironspike Chew Toy > Elementalist's Shielding Talisman > Darmac's Talisman for progression value which places regen rather high versus high intellect/throughput (more suited for farm).

My current BiS assumes 4 set so I took Unrendable Wolfhide Robes as the off set, I will probably update it to only go for 2 set, which may end up taking the helm from Sorka's Nightshade Cowl instead of the tier helm as well.

[Jayjayhey]

Well, you guys might be having issues with regen, some druids do not.

and it isn't a "narrow-minded" statement at all. Intellect is priority number one. It always has been. If you're not having mana issues, guess what? You go with the Int trinkets.

It's not really rocket science.

[Ctee]

This guy is saying haste > mastery. Is that the case for BRF? It wasn't for HM. I'd rather have my HoTs and directs heal for more. Mastery will always be more mana efficient as well.

[nightfalls]

This guy is saying haste > mastery. Is that the case for BRF? It wasn't for HM. I'd rather have my HoTs and directs heal for more. Mastery will always be more mana efficient as well.

HoTs heal for more with Haste than with Mastery and HoTs get more mana efficiency with Haste than Mastery. So Mastery only benefits direct healing more, and even then the only benefit is from the efficiency side there.

and it isn't a "narrow-minded" statement at all. Intellect is priority number one. It always has been. If you're not having mana issues, guess what? You go with the Int trinkets.

Or you heal a bit harder, or you do harder fights. Remember that I said progression value, obviously for farm and for 3 minute fights if you feel like padding/ranking you can put all burst throughput gear on for absolutely no reason other than flexing the epeen.

I'm well aware of the throughput vs. regen balance, and my opinion, shared by most, is that for druids this tier heavily leans on regen for the really hard fights. If you'd like to give a coherent reason with spreadsheets and/or logs as evidence, then why not, go for it.

[Jayjayhey]

So with your logic, during progression I should spam heals because I have available mana, regardless of people's HP.

This is why I don't post on forums lol.

[Ctee]

Not sure if you know what Harmony states.

[Jayjayhey]

There was a haste buff recently that made Haste the better stat than Mastery. They are still close, but Haste wins. It is the better stat right now.