Class balance in BRF?

[Tobedeleted123]

Come on blizzard, class balance this tier is the worst I've ever seen. Too many cleave fights result in some classes (boomkins lol, press starfall and moon/sunfire and enjoy your 60k) being a MUST. Yeah, try to kill furnace without a boomkin, good luck with that.

Yes, I'm salty.

[Deleted]

We killed furnance without a boomkin...and now?

[Tobedeleted123]

We killed furnance without a boomkin...and now?

Mind linking me some logs? Because, you know, I already killed blackhand on mythic so your opinion isn't valid...

Also, I'm talking hc furnace. Without overgearing it.

I know some guilds will obviously be able to kill it. I'm just saying with a boomkin it has to be so much easier since it does incredible damage on cleave fights. That's what's bothering me.

[jijuiji]

Perhaps if you stopped cleaving and did ST dmg on the high prio adds, you might just kill it

[Tobedeleted123]

Perhaps if you stopped cleaving and did ST dmg on the high prio adds, you might just kill it

lol blast furnace was just an example. My point is, the difference between certain specs and classes is just too high on BRF fights, much higher than it was in previous tiers. Probably due to shitton of cleave fights.

[Deja Thoris]

The ability to pad meters doesn't make a class needed for a fight. As long as high prio adds die the rest is really just fluff. While mega aoe doesn't hurt, its hardly needed or tuned around. I guess being salty is more of a thing than being constructive on these boards.

[godstp]

Come on blizzard, class balance this tier is the worst I've ever seen. Too many cleave fights result in some classes (boomkins lol, press starfall and moon/sunfire and enjoy your 60k) being a MUST. Yeah, try to kill furnace without a boomkin, good luck with that.

Yes, I'm salty.

useless moaning. what makes boomkins so great in furnace? starfal? you want them to destroy everything around mindlessly? that is good right ?
You actually want few super strong geared / heavy burst single target dps . the :cahallenging" part is killing slag elementals on top of primal elementalists , then burn primal elementalists within 30 seconds while shield is down.

How do i know this ? killed it on heroic on 4 toons while gearing up mains (we had 4 groups of 30-ish people made of mains alts and socials).
We cleared 9/10 heroic then collapsed in 2 groups last night for 2 blackhand heroic kills.


Don`t blame the damn class balance for a poor execution !! try harder, look at logs !

[Deleted]

Well every class cant be good at everything. There will always be classes that shines on ST and other classes that shine on cleave.
Trust me, coming straight from WW monk. But for furnace as an exampel, there are moments when ST is important. If you just go pure cleave aoe shitstorm with no prio on special adds you will have a bad time.

[Tobedeleted123]

useless moaning. what makes boomkins so great in furnace? starfal? you want them to destroy everything around mindlessly? that is good right ?
You actually want few super strong geared / heavy burst single target dps . the :cahallenging" part is killing slag elementals on top of primal elementalists , then burn primal elementalists within 30 seconds while shield is down.

How do i know this ? killed it on heroic on 4 toons while gearing up mains (we had 4 groups of 30-ish people made of mains alts and socials).
We cleared 9/10 heroic then collapsed in 2 groups last night for 2 blackhand heroic kills.


Don`t blame the damn class balance for a poor execution !! try harder, look at logs !

Once again, blast furnace was just an example. Stop ignoring the other posts just to make me look bad.

[Deleted]

Well every class cant be good at everything. There will always be classes that shines on ST and other classes that shine on cleave.
Trust me, coming straight from WW monk. But for furnace as an exampel, there are moments when ST is important. If you just go pure cleave aoe shitstorm with no prio on special adds you will have a bad time.

This is absolutely right. The whole point is to defeat the encounter with a team; individuals on that team may be doing rip-roaring damage on the single target priority mobs that isn't reflected in a simple Skada overall damage breakdown, but without them you wouldn't have killed the boss. Is it better to be top of damage on a wipe, or lower down having done your job to complete the kill?

[Deja Thoris]

Once again, blast furnace was just an example. Stop ignoring the other posts just to make me look bad.

Stop making stupid posts then. If you want proper discussion give proper examples instead of dripping emo tears across the world wide web.

[Deleted]

Mind linking me some logs? Because, you know, I already killed blackhand on mythic so your opinion isn't valid...

Also, I'm talking hc furnace. Without overgearing it.

I know some guilds will obviously be able to kill it. I'm just saying with a boomkin it has to be so much easier since it does incredible damage on cleave fights. That's what's bothering me.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/9WzBCrjdnYhtm4wQ

I'll have to excuse myself, we had an boomkin, but when you look at the dmg of it, its far away from what you define boomkin for this fight. ( apart from if the owl played good or bad; i just wanted to state that its no problem without one)

[Notdev]

The only fight where Boomkin could be seen as OP and might be almost a 'must' on mythic is Kromag, breaking the prisons out. Maybe cleaning up Beastlord's spears.

There are plenty of classes with high powered aoe/cleave. Might not be easy as pressing starfall, but still.

Only tough DPS checks on Blast Furnace are single target ones. Boomkin numbers probably look a lot better because of all the incidental cleaving they do on phase 2-3 on slag elementals, which is 100% useless damage on phase 3.

Looking at the #1 boomkin on WCL, 52% of his damage is done to Slag Elementals (wasted damage in p3) and Security Guards (lowest priority kill target). He was near the bottom on all high priority targets (elementalists, boss in p3, foreman) except the Bellows Operator(s). Its really just padding. They're only OP on spread out multi target (Kromag prisons, spears on Beastlord) as I'm pretty sure Enhance, Demo, Fire, and maybe more are better on stacked aoe.

[Deleted]

Moonkins are best at aoe fights when mobs are not stacked, becasue Starfall has 40 yard range, but it has no burst dmg. I play moonkin myself and I m pissed that 3 fights out of 10 are with aoe on spread targets.

Warcaft logs are generally useless on aoe fights, guy who will be left to aoe all the time will be higher on dps obviously.

[Aktec]

I get that every class will have their niche, something they do very slightly better than others making them the best at the fight but boomkins have such a huge advantage over other classes atm in their niche (spread out aoe) that its getting ridiculous. On Kromag's top logs you have to scroll down to 124 to find the top non-boomy log and out of the top 200, 196 are boomkins thats 98% Come on thats just wrong.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/rankings/7#boss=1713

[Deleted]

Imagine playing a feral on that fight :/

[Gnomorepuns]

Once again, blast furnace was just an example. Stop ignoring the other posts just to make me look bad.

He's right sephrie, stop being ignorant. If you know the mechanics of BF, which seems like you don't, then you would understand that a boomkin's dps is a good majority of fluff on that fight. Alls that really matters is the slag damage in terms of DPS. Its LITERALLY like spine of deathwing all over again. As an arcane mage I could get top dps on that fight or BF if I really wanted to by going fire, but I go arcane for strictly the slag and caster dmg. Derps abound these days...

[Thursley]

I get that every class will have their niche, something they do very slightly better than others making them the best at the fight but boomkins have such a huge advantage over other classes atm in their niche (spread out aoe) that its getting ridiculous. On Kromag's top logs you have to scroll down to 124 to find the top non-boomy log and out of the top 200, 196 are boomkins thats 98% Come on thats just wrong.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/rankings/7#boss=1713

You're conflating DPS with class balance. If all you look at are WCL ranks then sure, it looks lopsided, but that's a fundamentally flawed approach. Yes, being far and away the most effective at spread AOE is helpful on more fights than usual in BRF, and it's good to have in a raid group, but the only real reason you're complaining is because that happens to also be the one thing you can easily measure, with DPS meters. Plenty of other classes do plenty of other things just as well (and just as important) as moonkin's AOE, they just don't show up so boldly on WCL. All those things are just as much a part of class balance as damage done.

[Floopa]

sub rogues are actually probably the strongest spec on blast furnace.

you don't need aoe damage on blast furnace, you need ST dmg.

[Sinetha]

This. Big dick dps =/= effective damage. Single target damage on slag elementals and elementalists is the most important part of the fight. For the cleave fights this tier I would recommend putting your recount on boss damage/important targets.