How can anything be unnatural?

[Omgodzilla]

Yeah, I know its not a very original thread but I just feel like making it for some reason. Seriously, if we are products of nature then why shouldn't everything we create also be considered a product of nature? Why is a termite colony natural but a human city unnatural? Why is it natural for a Chimpanzee to crack a nut with a rock but unnatural for humans to convert huge areas of land into agricultural sites for mass scale food production?

Why is it unnatural to send a rocket into space or to synthesize new chemical compounds? I often hear people say that these things are unnatural because they don't happen by themselves in nature. But doesn't the fact that all of these things are happening because of us prove that they ARE indeed happening in nature? We humans are a part of nature. We don't exist outside of it. Nature created us, therefore, nature also created every invention that has or ever will be produced by our species.

I mean if you think about it, isn't calling something unnatural synonymous with calling it impossible? If the laws of nature permit its existence then isn't it automatically natural?

[Aeula]

I see it as natural means nature-made (Humans, trees, organic life forms) whereas unnatural means man-made (electronics, Synthetic, something not made by nature itself).
Unnatural to me doesn't necexerally mean something that shouldn't be, nature gave us the tools to do all we do and have done afterall, it just means something a human has built with their own hands and not on instinct.
Albeit I do hate it when people misuse the word unnatural to describe something they find abhorrent.

[Hey There Guys its Metro]

Something that wouldn't happen given its due course of nature is "unnatural."

This is predicated on assuming the innovations we have developed as Human beings are not the typical course of nature, but that is just a notion created by other humans.
It can be said that way, but I agree, it can be considered a contradiction as well.
Regardless, I would say things like deforesting an entire county is unnatural.
Getting plastic implants into your ass cheeks is unnatural.
Drilling miles into the sea floor and causing a flood of oil into the ocean is unnatural.
These things would never happen if we didn't seek more than we deserve as a species.

[Ossandran]

nat·u·ral

existing in or caused by nature; not made or caused by humankind.

un·nat·u·ral

contrary to the ordinary course of nature; abnormal

Nature is something humans observe or take part in. We aren't nature because we're top of the food chain and say so.

It's only a concept, why does it matter? You can always have your own subjective meanings of whichever words you choose.

Albeit I do hate it when people misuse the word unnatural to describe something they find abhorrent.

Probably because they find that word abhorrent.

[Revi]

It's just a word that means not caused/made by humans. In most ways it's used politically it holds absolutely no meaning though - unnatural is not inherently good or bad, it just is.

[Omgodzilla]

Something that wouldn't happen given its due course of nature is "unnatural."

This is predicated on assuming the innovations we have developed as Human beings are not the typical course of nature, but that is just a notion created by other humans.
It can be said that way, but I agree, it can be considered a contradiction as well.
Regardless, I would say things like deforesting an entire county is unnatural.
Getting plastic implants into your ass cheeks is unnatural.
Drilling miles into the sea floor and causing a flood of oil into the ocean is unnatural.
These things would never happen if we didn't seek more than we deserve as a species.

But these things are happening because WE are causing them. The only reason we're able to do that is because of our intelligence. The only reason we have this level of intelligence is because of evolution. The only reason evolution exists is because the laws of the universe allow and demand its existence. The bottom line is that nature gave us the intelligence that we use to create these things. Therefore nature is also responsible for the creation of all these things you think are unnatural. Nature created humans. But you're saying that humans can create unnatural things. How can nature create something that leads to unnatural creations?

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nat·u·ral

existing in or caused by nature; not made or caused by humankind.

un·nat·u·ral

contrary to the ordinary course of nature; abnormal

Nature is something humans observe or take part in. We aren't nature because we're top of the food chain and say so.

It's only a concept, why does it matter? You can always have your own subjective meanings of whichever words you choose.




Probably because they find that word abhorrent.

Yeah but its a stupid definition. It implies that humans somehow exist outside of nature.

[Revi]

But these things are happening because WE are causing them. The only reason we're able to do that is because of our intelligence. The only reason we have this level of intelligence is because of evolution. The only reason evolution exists is because the laws of the universe allow and demand its existence. The bottom line is that nature gave us the intelligence that we use to create these things. Therefore nature is also responsible for the creation of all these things you think are unnatural. Nature created humans. But you're saying that humans can create unnatural things. How can nature create something that leads of unnatural things?

I think you're confusing the word and the idea that something is "outside of nature" somehow. The word does not mean that.. I guess there's not really any English word that does.

All things made off or contained in physical things are natural in the sense you're talking about.. But again, that's not what the word refers to.

[Garnier Fructis]

[Omgodzilla]

I think you're confusing the word and the idea that someone is "outside of nature" somehow. The word does not mean that.. I guess there's not really any English word that does.

All things made off or contained in physical things are natural in the sense you're talking about.. But again, that's not what the word refers to.

Which is what I don't understand. It makes no sense to define it that way.

[Revi]

Which is what I don't understand. It makes no sense to define it that way.

Well, no I agree, and I think it's why a lot of people use it "wrong". It would be weird to have a word for what you're describing though, because it could be applies to literally everything, so it doesn't carry any information.. Or it would just be another word for "existing/non-existent".

[Ossandran]

Yeah but its a stupid definition. It implies that humans somehow exist outside of nature.

We can exist outside of nature. Like I said, it's only a concept. Nature isn't some greater power, it's just a thing that happens. The laws of nature are the laws of what happens inside of nature and humans can take part in it. Hell, we even become it when we die but we do exist outside of it.

[Slicer299]

Because nature will achieve a balance 99% of the time. Humans mostly live in concentrated areas that can't be supported by the resources around them. Like I live in Las Vegas, humans are not meant to live in the desert, especially in such high numbers. That's why the entire southwest has been facing a water shortage for decades. But you'll never find bugs, animals, plants, etc, in nature living in an environment like that where there is not enough food and water to support them. Or they evolve to adapt to the environment around them.

[Revi]

We can exist outside of nature. Like I said, it's only a concept. Nature isn't some greater power, it's just a thing that happens. The laws of nature are the laws of what happens inside of nature and humans can take part in it. Hell, we even become it when we die but we do exist outside of it.

nature


noun na·ture \ˈnā-chər\
: the physical world and everything in it (such as plants, animals, mountains, oceans, stars, etc.) that is not made by people

: the natural forces that control what happens in the world

: the way that a person or animal behaves : the character or personality of a person or animal

6. the external world in its entirety

[Omgodzilla]

We can exist outside of nature. Like I said, it's only a concept. Nature isn't some greater power, it's just a thing that happens. The laws of nature are the laws of what happens inside of nature and humans can take part in it. Hell, we even become it when we die but we do exist outside of it.

The laws of nature are the laws of the universe. How is it possible to exist outside of it?

[dextersmith]

Mice with chip implants and Splenda are unnatural.

[Omgodzilla]

Because nature will achieve a balance 99% of the time. Humans mostly live in concentrated areas that can't be supported by the resources around them. Like I live in Las Vegas, humans are not meant to live in the desert, especially in such high numbers. That's why the entire southwest has been facing a water shortage for decades. But you'll never find bugs, animals, plants, etc, in nature living in an environment like that where there is not enough food and water to support them. Or they evolve to adapt to the environment around them.

We're meant to live anywhere we can survive. Just because we use technology to survive in these environments doesn't mean that us living there is any less natural.

[Ossandran]

nature


noun na·ture \ˈnā-chər\
: the physical world and everything in it (such as plants, animals, mountains, oceans, stars, etc.) that is not made by people

: the natural forces that control what happens in the world

: the way that a person or animal behaves : the character or personality of a person or animal

6. the external world in its entirety

Okay? The third one is in a whole other context by the way.

I hate to break it to you, but people make people as well.

We observe it and we can take part in it, but we exist outside of it.

[Omgodzilla]

Mice with chip implants and Splenda are unnatural.

If it was unnatural, then the laws of nature wouldn't allow its existence in the first place. Everything requires a trigger or some physical mechanism to allow its creation. Just because we are exploiting the laws of nature to create new physical mechanisms that lead to new creations doesn't mean that these creations are unnatural. They wouldn't exist without our intelligence but our intelligence also wouldn't exist without natural selection.

[Deleted]

I have alway to laugh, when people say "natural [chemical name]", like seriously. Human IS a part of nature and everything human does aswell. It's like saying sticks apes often use to get insects out of trees are unnatural, since they created are tools.

[Revi]

Okay? The third one is in a whole other context by the way.

I hate to break it to you, but people make people as well.

We observe it and we can take part in it, but we exist outside of it.

Unless you're choosing a really, really narrow definition of it, we don't live outside of nature..