[Balance] Glyphed Celestial Alignment

[perringaiden]

Primarily a lurker and new to Boomer in WoD, so don't kill me.

I've noticed a lot of people who are talking about Celestial Alignment unglyphed, and this seems strange to me as I'd imagined no-one would use it unglyphed.

Reasoning:

* Unglyphed CA is 15 seconds. During this 15s you can cast at most 10 instant cast spells on GCD.
* To get the most out of CA you're casting empowered Starfire's. A reasonable use of:

0.0s: Moonfire(+Sunfire) +1.5s
1.5s: Starsurge +1.5s
3.0s: Starfire +2.5s
5.5s: Starfire +2.5s
8.0s: Starsurge +1.5s
9.5s: Starfire +2.5s
11.0s: Starfire +2.5s
13.5s: Starsurge +1.5s
15.0s: CA fades.

With massive haste/Berserk/HeroLust you're at best going to get 2 more casts out, when the Starfires cap at 1.5s.

So without using it during exactly the right conditions, the glyph doesn't reduce the number of actions you can perform during the CA. What the glyph does give you is a massive boost to movement capability, because you don't have to have 15s of uninterrupted casting to still get the same damage output.

Additionally, if you're going heavy on Starfall, you can actually have the Lunar maximum effect applied to it for longer than 15s simply by not casting the last spell for a bit (up to a minute, but that's probably going to lose DPS after a bit).

So, my question is: What's the benefit of using CA unglyphed ever?

[bmjclark]

Haste reduces the GCD so 1.5 seconds for instant casts isn't going to be accurate. Not to mention if you're a troll your starfire casts will likely be below 2.5 seconds with just berserking, and if you have shards of nothing or the haste trinket from darmoc your starfires can get down below 1.5 second cast time (mine do) without bloodlust, meaning you'll lose a few casts if you take the glyph of celestial alignment. My starfire casts get down to 1.3 seconds with all my trinkets popped, the buff from euphoria and without bloodlust (and i dont have 2 piece tier 17). I just tried it on a target dummy and i got 11 casts off with celestial alignment, without lust and without even having a haste buff. In fairness though, i do have shards of nothing as well as the beast lord trinket, but i don't have the 2 piece tier 17.

On multi target fights the glyph loses even more value because you'll be multi dotting during celestial alignment for the opener.

[GoldenGoat]

The math changes considerably at higher gear levels, particularly at higher haste values or with haste trinket procs/on-uses like Shards of Nothing. During lust I usually see somewhere in the neighborhood of 10-13 casts during CA, which would make the glyph a considerable DPS loss.

I do think the glyph is underrated at very low (630ish) gear levels when your starfires take a day to cast. But even then I simmed about a 300dps difference with/without it, so I'd reckon it's not worth getting used to unless you plan on using it in PvP, which is what it's designed for.

[xtramuscle]

Snip
Additionally, if you're going heavy on Starfall, you can actually have the Lunar maximum effect applied to it for longer than 15s simply by not casting the last spell for a bit (up to a minute, but that's probably going to lose DPS after a bit).

So, my question is: What's the benefit of using CA unglyphed ever?

While this is a nice thought, on a fight you're starfalling this much, say beastlord; you'll want to be doting aswell. Sadly doting counts towards the 8 spells cast. Yeah there may be that time when you have everything dot'd, and starfall running and casting nothing with the glyph (for extra max eclipse damage) might be an increase, but at every other time its an out-right loss

[perringaiden]

My starfire casts get down to 1.3 seconds with all my trinkets popped, the buff from euphoria and without bloodlust (and i dont have 2 piece tier 17). I just tried it on a target dummy and i got 11 casts off with celestial alignment, without lust and without even having a haste buff. In fairness though, i do have shards of nothing as well as the beast lord trinket, but i don't have the 2 piece tier 17.

How often can you stand still and cast 11 times in a row in a normal fight though? And while during lust, I could see it, but in progression fights when you're bouncing off enrage, you're often getting 2-3 casts of CA and the other times you're not in bloodlust.

Maybe its a different gearing style, but everything I read had Mastery and Crit above haste, so I haven't stacked it.

[Deleted]

pls. don't talk about 2.5 casting times or w.e we are in BRF raid. If you talk about PvE you already have 2 set bonus atleast.

I've normally 2.1 point cast time on starfire now with no buffs included.

[Deleted]

If you talk about PvE you already have 2 set bonus atleast.

much unflawed logic. pls.

[bmjclark]

How often can you stand still and cast 11 times in a row in a normal fight though? And while during lust, I could see it, but in progression fights when you're bouncing off enrage, you're often getting 2-3 casts of CA and the other times you're not in bloodlust.

I honestly can't think of a fight where i've gotten 2-3 casts off in CA. I generally get the full amount or damn near it.