Post-Patch MoC Performance

[Deleted]

I don't know, you can't entirely judge whether it's good or not just by looking at HPS done. Keeping close to 100% uptime of both Germination rejuvs and LB on two tanks throughout a fight or phase with lots of tank damage will help tank healing a LOT. I often outheal our guild hpala by doing this (and he's pretty much rank <50 on every single BRF heroic fight. I consider myself mostly a tank healer, so I feel like MOC won't fit my playstyle at all, unless it's really needed, like on certain mythic fights where mana is a big problem (I doubt it).

Germination is useless talent. "pro druids" told us to get it just because they told us to do it. Currently, MoC is lovely, so many free regrowths. 3 seconds of additional overheal and Reju (germ) is rarely used (moar overheal). I have better healing with MoC than Germination.

Germination is great for tank healing. In terms of pure HPS it might not be as good as MOC or RG but eg. if you are lacking tank healing and you are still saying "germination is useless talent", consider yourself a bad resto druid for not knowing the pros and cons of your talents.

[Klu]

I really enjoyed MOC. I put out more HPS than our disc priest on Gruul and Oreg Heroic. I normally play Boomkin so can't say how it felt, but I wasn't really ever fond of Germ.

Either way, MOC just seems like a more "fun" playstyle since there's a proc element to it.

[Deleted]

Yeah, it's quite fun. I tried it on H Gruul. Numbers are the same as when I go Germination, but it's pretty cool to be able to spam RG for a bit and not care about a thing.

[Vark]

Taking Germination just for little more healing on one/two target is really dumb. Reju's duration could be 12 sec (with lesser cost) and I wouldn't see much difference, oh, maybe less overheal and more mana. Second Reju is only useful on fights like Ko'ragh, when one-two targets takes a lot constant damage. I'm not byuing these sims/maths/ponies. When I started using MoC, problem with mana disappeared, boredom is gone and some dynamic thinking is finally present and my HealingDone increased a lot.

MOC just seems like a more "fun" playstyle since there's a proc element to it

"like a more "fun" playstyle since there's a proc"
"more "fun" playstyle since"
"FUN"
This. So much this.

[MegaVolti]

Instead of having it last a fixed amount of time they should have it last either a fixed amount of time after the first cast or a fixed amount of casts to begin with. Make it like the 2p set bonus, just better. OoC now applies to your next 5 spell casts instead of only 1 and makes them instant. Problem solved, talent is great.

[theburned]

Tried out the talent on gruul mythic, tbh I dont think it would've mattered which talent I went for because well we could soak just about every non-one-shot (double flares, the tank cone, a few ticks of cave in.) ability, yet do no healing, because the fight does not in any way require 5 healers. Will try it out on operator, and blast furnace.
on Gruul though I just felt it didnt do much, I could spam it during CC proc, but yet there was never anything to heal.

My question though lies in wheter or not to run with the glyph, for more consistant heals, or unglyphed for more HoT healing so that the proccs at 100% arent entierly wasted.

Also when it comes to druid level 100 talents I just feel the talent that has 2 purposes is just super OP, euphoria f.ex is pretty much on par when only considering the cast time reduction, then you get the shorter and better eclipse additionally. The germination talent until now which was superior due to the 3 sec duration increase, then it adds stacking rejuvs on top of that. Now MoC should be quite good, but I suppose it takes some getting used to, considering you've always had like 15 seconds worth of clearcasting to get out one regrowth, now you have 5-6 seconds where you can just spam it. But I suppose it wont be too good on high movement fights, but I can see this skill being good at thogar, BF and Blackhand, and quite likely kromog too, can't really speak for the first bosses.... as they are just so little healing required.

[Deleted]

Instead of having it last a fixed amount of time they should have it last either a fixed amount of time after the first cast or a fixed amount of casts to begin with. Make it like the 2p set bonus, just better. OoC now applies to your next 5 spell casts instead of only 1 and makes them instant. Problem solved, talent is great.

I like your suggestion about a fixed number of spell casts, but making them instant would probably put the talent quite a bit over the top. I played it a bit last night and I actually got so many procs that I felt like most of my time was spent spamming Regrowth. If you made them instant cast, you would essentially remove the talent's only weakness which is mobility. It would still be a random proc of course, but by the number of procs I seemed to be getting, it actually ended up fairly reliable.

[jahoosuphat]

Question is; who's gunna make a weakaura to track it?

[Deleted]

Question is; who's gunna make a weakaura to track it?

What kind of weakaura are you looking for? I use a bar with an icon and it works well enough for me.

[Jayjayhey]

to those bashing germination (lol), here is what you're forgetting:

1.) keeping two rejuvs on your tanks is a big deal

.

3.) the talent also increases your tick by 3 secs, another big deal

4.) If you use MoC, you better not ever use tree then. Throw it out the window and use SOTF 100% of the time, because all those reduced-mana rejuvs from tree stack better with germination.

5.) MoC is still unpredictable. Have fun with that 7 second duration where there is absolutely no healing needed. It's going to happen more than you think.

[Skyfall]

to those bashing germination (lol), here is what you're forgetting:

1.) keeping two rejuvs on your tanks is a big deal

2.) rejuvs boost your mushroom

3.) the talent also increases your tick by 3 secs, another big deal

4.) If you use MoC, you better not ever use tree then. Throw it out the window and use SOTF 100% of the time, because all those reduced-mana rejuvs from tree stack better with germination.

5.) MoC is still unpredictable. Have fun with that 7 second duration where there is absolutely no healing needed. It's going to happen more than you think.

Your mushroom stopped being affected by rejuv overhealing when bloom went away, unless it affects it in some other way I'm not aware of.

To the point of the 3 seconds, I find a lot of people saying that its likely to be overheal, but I'm not entirely sure thats true. It may be likely that a target is healed to full before the rejuv ticks to full, but people seem to be neglecting the chance that they will take damage again before the last tick. I would wager the extra tick is no more likely to overheal than any of the last two or three. Sure its not as strong as if it, say, doubled the healing of the first tick to make it riptide-eqsue, but youre right, a lot of people seem to be overlooking the 3 seconds far more than they should.

MoC buffs tree pretty hugely, as it allows you to spam instant free regrowths on the move. I would argue, in fact, that MoC gets the largest benefit when Tree is up by a wide margin, and tree probably buffs MoC more than germ.

I agree the unpredictability is the problem with the talent, but moreso than just proccing when theres nothing to heal, proccing on a movement phase when there is a lot to heal is the larger problem. I could see it performing well on stand still fights, but if you have to move any distance within the proc window you are losing a HUGE amount of the benefit of the talent, and would have likely been better off with germ. I think its a decently viable talent on a select few fights where you can count on being rooted in place for a large portion of the fight, but one of the best strengths of druid healing is being effective on the move, and MoC seems to fly against that to some extent, by making the bulk of your healing output come from abilities with a cast.

[Jayjayhey]

I guess you could make the argument that MoC can buff tree with regrowth, but that is nowhere close to what our primary spells are. We only should use regrowth in times of clearcasting proc and the occasional oh shit tank needs a heal moment. If I do need to be on the move or someone does need a quick instant heal, that is what our 2 piece does for now (3 instant casts from NS).

Using Tree with Germination is way better option for mana use IMO. If the raid needs heals like on Kromog after a breath and you pop tree, there is no guarantee that MOC will be up, and if it is, it's only for 7 seconds. Not only that, but with Tree and Germ, you can blanket the raid in rejuvs for less cost mana.

Germination is overall the better talent. You want that extra HoT on the tank.

[Vark]

Geez, ToL has 3 MINUTE COOLDOWN. What do you want to do in that 2,5 minute window? Reju is expensive, WG is dumb. Just keeping Lifebloom and shroom? Or you want to depend on DoC healing?

And that argument - "MoC will proc when there's no need to use Regrowth", np, but additional overhealing tick from reju is ok. Actually, it procced few times in a row for me so I was spamming Regrowth for about 20 seconds. If there's no need for healing - spam Regrowths on tanks, Living Seed is like disc shield (I mean, we can use it to preheal incoming dmg). There's no option I will return to germination - boring, not so effective (sry, but I'm not healing raid alone). That talent isn't that strong really, remember that ToL is used mostly with NV or HotW. We have strong cds already, but we need something to save mana and something to use between cds.

[jahoosuphat]

What kind of weakaura are you looking for? I use a bar with an icon and it works well enough for me.

Are you running something like the lifebloom/harmony/mushroom weakaurasa that are floating around? I'd love to see!

- - - Updated - - -

I guess you could make the argument that MoC can buff tree with regrowth, but that is nowhere close to what our primary spells are. We only should use regrowth in times of clearcasting proc and the occasional oh shit tank needs a heal moment. If I do need to be on the move or someone does need a quick instant heal, that is what our 2 piece does for now (3 instant casts from NS).

Using Tree with Germination is way better option for mana use IMO. If the raid needs heals like on Kromog after a breath and you pop tree, there is no guarantee that MOC will be up, and if it is, it's only for 7 seconds. Not only that, but with Tree and Germ, you can blanket the raid in rejuvs for less cost mana.

Germination is overall the better talent. You want that extra HoT on the tank.

Ran ToL+MoC last night for our first mythic Oregorger kill as well as Darmac. It seems much more impactful than germination and since I leave tank healing to the more well equipped tank heal classes it works out well. I feel especially powerful when I get procs during ToL and the raid is getting low; WG then start real smart healing with regrowth spam.

I look forward to trying it on Kromog without glyphed regrowth so I can spread free HoTs and living seeds.

[Hildrande]

You want that extra HoT on the tank.

Some 35-40k over 18 second is not really significant when it comes to tank healing, in situations that matters.

[Brilynn]

Some 35-40k over 18 second is not really significant when it comes to tank healing, in situations that matters.

In situations with a lot of movement where healers can't just stop to single target heal the tank, it's pretty good.

[Deleted]

people are arguing a lot about this, there Are no better optoin, just play what you prefer as long as it does the job

i was playing about a week ago with MoC and today i needed to swap to germination, couse i needed to heal a small group .. and my hps got rly low in myhtic oregorger... guess i'm used to MoC now never rly liked germination

[Deleted]

Are you running something like the lifebloom/harmony/mushroom weakaurasa that are floating around? I'd love to see

Yes, I've simply created a group of things I like to keep track of. The bars are not really near the middle of my screen or anything, but more the sort of thing you glance at every 5-10 seconds to help keep track of Harmony, Lifebloom, cooldowns and such. I'll be happy to post what I'm using, although it'll have to wait until I get home. Otherwise if you're having trouble with creating a WeakAura to your liking I'll be glad to help you out

Oh, and just to get on topic a bit: I've switched to MoC now almost completely. Although I'm not raiding Mythic, I've been getting so many procs that there are fights where Regrowth accounts for the largest part of my healing. I find running SotF + MoC is very strong at the moment, especially if you have to do both a lot of tank healing and raid healing at the same time - as I do in my guild's fairly small raid group.