again its all about hps :(

[holypri]

hello there,

I ve been playing holy priest lately and I ve progressed 6/7 hm M and 2/10 brf M so far. but I wonder if there s a chance for holy priest have a raid spot for later mhytic progression? coz at the end of the day healing officers and raid leaders care about rankings and hps meters.. I knw they show something but as a holy priest it is really a way of depressing and underevaluting for our performance..

I tried healing mhytic disc-h.pala-monk-shaman-h.priest and the things I observed

you cant tank heal like h.pala
you cant aoe heal like resto or monk coz your powerfull spells poh is like where my mana gone? and pom/coh has some cd u really need to have a good rotation to take advantage
hymn seems a bit weak and our hps-mania whore monk always use revival when ppl around %40 hp
TOF is good but cant have good uptimes in many fights other than grull kromog (may be some in oregorger)
in many fights your renew almost overheal %50

I like my class and really fond of playing it but a bit broke coz holy seem to have no power according to statistics rankings etc..

I read those posts to have some good points to increase my throughput and just wonder how u (like other h.priests) get away with this?

plz dont tell me "ohh I m bombarding hps meters bla bla with 3 healer...or that much hps"
just want to hear some strategies or tips to play better holy priest..

for example.. never 30man brf hc with 6 healers (one is u) coz it s really annoying and boring..
thnks..

[Soiprax]

Logs and armory will be of great help, not sure we can help much without those, as its impossible to determine what your doing... or even your co-healers..

EDIT: PoH strong spell?? Hits for about the same as CoH, for me atleast.. and got a cast time and is bound to a group??

[Deleted]

When i heal i never really used PoH, it's not worth it.

[ipaq]

Logs and armory will be of great help, not sure we can help much without those, as its impossible to determine what your doing... or even your co-healers..

EDIT: PoH strong spell?? Hits for about the same as CoH, for me atleast.. and got a cast time and is bound to a group??

Just look at the composition of his emails... 'nuf said.

[Deleted]

Just look at the composition of his emails... 'nuf said.

what?
10chars

[Jarob22]

coz at the end of the day healing officers and raid leaders care about rankings and hps meters.. I knw they show something but as a holy priest it is really a way of depressing and underevaluting for our performance..


hymn seems a bit weak and our hps-mania whore monk always use revival when ppl around %40 hp

Your officers suck balls if that's what they're evaluating you on then.

Your monk also sucks balls if he's pissing away a -very- useful cooldown just to improve his freaking hps. I would gladly take a hpriest who can listen and performs well mechanics wise and has decent hps than a monk who focuses only on hps, dies to stupid shit and pops his cd when I don't ask (I'm a healing officer for my guild).

[Deleted]

Firstly, if your guild only cares about hps meters and doesn´t look at spell usage then they are bad.

Its hard to tell if you do things right or wrong without logs, so if you have them please share.

But from what i can tell you:

- Hymn is not weak at all, its very strong raid cooldown
- Set a cd rotation/call out cds so Rev won't snipe you (or even an addon so Monk can see)
- Are you using renew enough?
- Use PI if you can´t have a high uptime on ToF
- You shouldn´t be worrying about tank healing. Pala/disc can do this better and even without a shaman/monk will do it better then you. But even then single chakra isnt that bad.
- Do have enough spirit/regen items? Good mindbender/solace uptime or SoL usage?

But the most important: Overhealing will make your heals weaker, and your other healers/officers should know that and should really drop a healer.

[holypri]

thank u for advices..

since newly logined cant link logs and stuff will make it later

and I dont want to argue with rl and healer officer not to seen behaving like a child in offence "...I m doing this but u never see...etc" but first I want to fix my faults instead. but I agree they say "ohh disc priest has way much hps than our holy priest.." its like 2x2 = 4 for me but well..

[Deleted]

thank u for advices..

since newly logined cant link logs and stuff will make it later

and I dont want to argue with rl and healer officer not to seen behaving like a child in offence "...I m doing this but u never see...etc" but first I want to fix my faults instead. but I agree they say "ohh disc priest has way much hps than our holy priest.." its like 2x2 = 4 for me but well..

Your raid leaders must be really stu...

[Jarob22]

thank u for advices..

since newly logined cant link logs and stuff will make it later

and I dont want to argue with rl and healer officer not to seen behaving like a child in offence "...I m doing this but u never see...etc" but first I want to fix my faults instead. but I agree they say "ohh disc priest has way much hps than our holy priest.." its like 2x2 = 4 for me but well..

If they're actually calling you out on your hps, I do think you need to have a private chat with your healing officer and explain politely to him the situation. As others said, if you bring many healers with you a holy priest is gonna get shafted, especially if you have a disc priest or 2. A rule of thumb for BRF is 1 healer per 4/5 people depending on your setup and which boss you're on.

As a side note: one of our priests went holy for Kromog and wrecked the meters, so they can do very well, there just aren't all that many fights where I'd take a holy over a disc.

[Deleted]

since newly logined cant link logs and stuff will make it later

You can post it with spaces or like (dot) in between, or say your char name and realm and we can look it up

[holypri]

hi again.. hope this works tnx for input

http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/...4&type=healing

http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/...1&type=healing

armory
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...apwns/advanced

I sometimes lack on pom casts tho I have 2 sets already



added links - red

[PosPosPos]

This entire thread is most probably just a very bad attempt at fishing for sympathy - what kind of sympathy you may ask, it's the comfort of a bruised ego; telltale signs being the one-sided, unsupported and/or unjustifiable claims of

1) Holy Priests can't perform well(completely untrue)

you cant tank heal like h.pala

Nobody can, but eh, nice try as any.

you cant aoe heal like resto or monk coz your powerfull spells poh is like where my mana gone?

This part starts to be lolworthy.

and pom/coh has some cd u really need to have a good rotation to take advantage

....Isn't this a problem on the user's part and not a problem of class design? Regardless of which healing style you use(with 0pc or 4pc), PoM or CoH has a ridiculously low CD for such a cheap mana cost.

hymn seems a bit weak and our hps-mania whore monk always use revival when ppl around %40 hp

All the 3 minute healing CDs are "a bit weak" compared to Revival. Just like no healer can tank heal as well as a holy pally.

TOF is good but cant have good uptimes in many fights other than grull kromog (may be some in oregorger)

It's almost like Divine Insight w/ 4pc bonus and Power Infusion didn't exist for those fights. Almost.

in many fights your renew almost overheal %50

Why does this even matter? Should be more worried about CoH and DH when it comes to overhealing, not a cheap filler spell which most important purpose is simply to lower the CD of CoH.

I like my class and really fond of playing it but a bit broke coz holy seem to have no power according to statistics rankings etc..

All I can do here is refer to the idiom "A bad worksman blames his tools".

2) "The guild leadership only cares about HPS"

It's almost like the general readers on this forum are either 1) psychic 2) utterly gullible to believe this one-sided story. While my experiences of this sort are clearly anecdotal and doesn't necessarily reflect the majority, the only kind of healers I have encountered making these sort of claims are those who pull abysmal numbers like 20k with sufficient gear when other healers are pulling 40-50k and have next-to-no raid awareness or understanding of their class and fights.

So far, the warning bells like the previous point about Holy Priests being an inferior class compared to others seem to point to this as the case.

Not too long ago I had a 680 resto druid inquiring about a healer spot in the guild - naturally, the first question I asked aside from the other obligatory questions like ilvl and experience was his logs. So he linked one, and was brought immediately to a parse on H Kromog where he pulled 30k 3 healing for a 17 man raid while the 67x resto shaman and holy paladin were each pulling 55k and 50k respectively. The same thing happened on other fights where the resto shaman and holy paladin were completely destroying him. My first reply to him was that the experience and knowledge of his own class needs brushing up due to his inability to pull nominal numbers required for mythic progression.

Of course, his sarcastic parting reply was along the lines of "HPS is not everything bro, I will find a better guild". I am sure he will, what with that shining mentality.

3) "Can't link logs"

This is not the first time I have seen a <10 post count OP making this claim in similar ranting threads about the state of the class, how good of a healer they are and how unjustly they have been treated by their guild leadership - and the solution is simple - just put brackets around parts of the link like this:

(www).warcraftlogs.(com)

Doesn't take more than a pinch of common sense by the audience to remove those brackets when copypasting the link. Then again, my leading suspicion is they deliberately refuse to put the link in because they know even a passing glance at their logs would expose their little game and send the charade crashing down around their ears.


tl;dr
In conclusion, I guess my point is: the most popular(or rather, tired) excuses for an abysmal performance as a healer seem to be

1) "The class is bad, not me"
2) "My guild leadership cares only about HPS and meter whoring"
3) "Other classes do everything better than me"
4) "I am sure I am doing well and that I am not doing something specifically wrong"

and when prompted for logs/armory

5) "Sorry don't know how/new to the forums so can't post links"

[Deleted]

This entire thread is most probably just a very bad attempt at fishing for sympathy - what kind of sympathy you may ask, it's the comfort of a bruised ego; telltale signs being the one-sided, unsupported and/or unjustifiable claims of

1) Holy Priests can't perform well(completely untrue)




Nobody can, but eh, nice try as any.



This part starts to be lolworthy.




....Isn't this a problem on the user's part and not a problem of class design? Regardless of which healing style you use(with 0pc or 4pc), PoM or CoH has a ridiculously low CD for such a cheap mana cost.



All the 3 minute healing CDs are "a bit weak" compared to Revival. Just like no healer can tank heal as well as a holy pally.



It's almost like Divine Insight w/ 4pc bonus and Power Infusion didn't exist for those fights. Almost.



Why does this even matter? Should be more worried about CoH and DH when it comes to overhealing, not a cheap filler spell which most important purpose is simply to lower the CD of CoH.




All I can do here is refer to the idiom "A bad worksman blames his tools".

2) "The guild leadership only cares about HPS"

It's almost like the general readers on this forum are either 1) psychic 2) utterly gullible to believe this one-sided story. While my experiences of this sort are clearly anecdotal and doesn't necessarily reflect the majority, the only kind of healers I have encountered making these sort of claims are those who pull abysmal numbers like 20k with sufficient gear when other healers are pulling 40-50k and have next-to-no raid awareness or understanding of their class and fights.

So far, the warning bells like the previous point about Holy Priests being an inferior class compared to others seem to point to this as the case.

Not too long ago I had a 680 resto druid inquiring about a healer spot in the guild - naturally, the first question I asked aside from the other obligatory questions like ilvl and experience was his logs. So he linked one, and was brought immediately to a parse on H Kromog where he pulled 30k 3 healing for a 17 man raid while the 67x resto shaman and holy paladin were each pulling 55k and 50k respectively. The same thing happened on other fights where the resto shaman and holy paladin were completely destroying him. My first reply to him was that the experience and knowledge of his own class needs brushing up due to his inability to pull nominal numbers required for mythic progression.

Of course, his sarcastic parting reply was along the lines of "HPS is not everything bro, I will find a better guild". I am sure he will, what with that shining mentality.

3) "Can't link logs"

This is not the first time I have seen a <10 post count OP making this claim in similar ranting threads about the state of the class, how good of a healer they are and how unjustly they have been treated by their guild leadership - and the solution is simple - just put brackets around parts of the link like this:

(www).warcraftlogs.(com)

Doesn't take more than a pinch of common sense by the audience to remove those brackets when copypasting the link. Then again, my leading suspicion is they deliberately refuse to put the link in because they know even a passing glance at their logs would expose their little game and send the charade crashing down around their ears.


tl;dr
In conclusion, I guess my point is: the most popular(or rather, tired) excuses for an abysmal performance as a healer seem to be

1) "The class is bad, not me"
2) "My guild leadership cares only about HPS and meter whoring"
3) "Other classes do everything better than me"
4) "I am sure I am doing well and that I am not doing something specifically wrong"

and when prompted for logs/armory

5) "Sorry don't know how/new to the forums so can't post links"

You always makes nice replies, thanks for being awesome

[Deleted]

You just love jumping to conclusions dont you? Wether its a cry for attention or just a cry for help, why does it bother you so much?

Also its pretty often that a new person won´t post links even with spaces. Often the first thought that comes to mind when told you cant post links under 10 posts is "oh its probably not allowed then, so i shouldn´t do it".

And in the end he posted logs so, there you go. Now you can rant on about those.

[holypri]

thnks for considering PosPosPos
u may disagree about my sights about my comparisons of h.priest among others, I'd take care those if u treated them kindly instead of lolworty attitude brother
and heyy I m not here for any sympaty who said that?..I just faced with a depressing situation and wondered how I m gonna fix it..
sorry but u put so much meaning to a 8 rows of my saying

and ps u were one of the guys I follow in these forums..

[Deleted]

Purely based on the logs you've shown. I mostly play disc, so not everything of what I say might be correct.

You've only casted 5 Holy Word: Sanc, and 2 Holy Word: Serenity, Power Infunsion, was used once, in total of those two logs.
On blackhand you've casted cascade 6 times in a fight which lasted 6 minutes.

So from my point of view there are many things you can increase your healing by. Up time, switching chakra's and placing Holy Words, using them. But like i said holy isn't my main spec.

[Deleted]

If a guildlead really only looks at hps done, as soon as priest get their hands on the tier-set-bonusses all disc priests would have to respec to holy.
Which is as stupid as the last months' mantra of discs claiming that they play the only viable spec.

[Deleted]

I'm not going through logs at the moment but did want to hit a couple of points.
It stood out to me that you say holy priest can't keep up with resto druids raid healing. I don't find this to be the case at all at the moment, I actually believe holy priest has stronger spot healing and can burst groups of people up much faster, resto druids are still great and the two specs cover a lot of the same ground but I'd go head to head on hps any day. One thing I have noticed is that tranq generally brings in higher numbers than hymn. Outside of the 3min CDs I think both are very competitive, each with strengths and weaknesses.

Just a quick look at your armoy a couple of things stand out to me.
You have a normal socket'd Elementalists Shielding Talisman; Everburning Candle should offer a decent upgrade, candle has a lot of int and has an equivalent 210spirit, it's overbudget for it's ilvl and should last you until you're looking at mythic trinkets to replace it.
Getting 4set would be a huge benefit to you, even 665 tier. Since you don't need to give up much ilvl (you could replace the 670 chest and legs) you're almost getting the bonus for free. 4set strength varies per fight but it's still an extremely strong bonus.

OK so I caved and opened the logs.
The first thing I see on your darmac kill is an extremely low number of CoH casts. A HUGE portion of your healing should come from this spell. It's high throughput, high efficiency, low cost and instant cast. If the only thing you do is aim to optimize CoH, getting as many out as possible at best effect, then you'll already find yourself playing Holy closer to it's potential. Similar deal with PoM, especially with set bonuses. This is especially true on long fights such as darmac where a large portion of the fight is mana conservation, rely more on your spells with a CD and less on renew filler. CoH/PoM/Cascade will get you a long way with no filler and should keep you almost mana neutral.
Don't be afraid of using DI instead of ToF on fights where the raid isn't dropping, especially when you get the 4set bonus. Mostly just something for farm to push a bit more hps, for progress obviously go with what's needed most. Even if ToF only has 10% uptime, if it's up when you need it most then it's still got value.

[PosPosPos]

You just love jumping to conclusions dont you? Wether its a cry for attention or just a cry for help, why does it bother you so much?

Why does it bother you so much that I "love jumping to conclusions" then? Or is this your attempt at hypocrisy?

Also its pretty often that a new person won´t post links even with spaces. Often the first thought that comes to mind when told you cant post links under 10 posts is "oh its probably not allowed then, so i shouldn´t do it".

There's actually no rule nor regulation saying new posters can't post non-malicious links, only that the system flat out prevents them from posting one.

But, you would know this if you actually read it before white knighting for the OP.

And in the end he posted logs so, there you go. Now you can rant on about those.

Of course I will. It's already atrocious at first glance.

thnks for considering PosPosPos
u may disagree about my sights about my comparisons of h.priest among others,

Of course I disagree. I never do agree with people who think they are infallible and it's always their class being weak for the reason they can't perform. I don't need you to tell me what I already know, but thank you anyway?

I'd take care those if u treated them kindly instead of lolworty attitude brother

The "lolworty attitude", is in fact the person who thinks his class is at fault for his numbers/performance.

and heyy I m not here for any sympaty who said that?..I just faced with a depressing situation and wondered how I m gonna fix it..

What's depressing is, even now, you still feel that your class, and not you, is responsible for the outcome.

sorry but u put so much meaning to a 8 rows of my saying

Your words speak for themselves

and ps u were one of the guys I follow in these forums..

Oh, want me to give you a lollipop? Or am I supposed to feel flattered?

hi again.. hope this works tnx for input

http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/...4&type=healing

http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/...1&type=healing

armory
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...apwns/advanced

I sometimes lack on pom casts tho I have 2 sets already



added links - red

Specifically: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...asts&source=17

Underlined points are the most important ones:

13 casts of Cascade, which is ~6 and a half minutes of uptime for a 9 minute 32 second fight.

31 casts of PoM, which is 6 minutes and 10 seconds of uptime.

8 casts of Mindbender out of 10 possible casts

2 casts of Lightwell out of 3 casts

36 casts out of 47 possible casts of Circle of Healing, which is 6 minutes seconds of uptime assuming no CD reduction(which is not the case obviously). With Sanctuary factored in, you should be casting this close to 50+ times on the high end.

Still think it's the class and not the user?