[6.2.3] Shadow PvE Guide and Discussion

[Yvaelle]

I bought the upgrade for my Sandman trinket but didn't apply it, waiting for our Oregorger kill... and the trinket dropped for me with a socket! So I re-sold the crafting upgrade and all was well.

Nice! Congrats

[Biomega]

Might want to keep crafted around though, since it can be upgraded further in the next tier.

[Theminger]

Yeah, I will.

[snaxattax]

If you're playing properly, that situation will never happen on single target. Multi, sure. And then you just don't care about VT anyways.

you absolutely can get long enough chains of GCDs of nothing but casting nothing but MB/DP/insanity in single target with a goren soul repository proc to have VT fall off single target.

[Nestar]

you absolutely can get long enough chains of GCDs of nothing but casting nothing but MB/DP/insanity in single target with a goren soul repository proc to have VT fall off single target.

Even inside bloodlust, single target with 100% crit rate, you will only get an orb every 2 seconds. which means 1 of your 4 casts in a 6 second period is DP, 1 is MB that still leaves 2-3 for Filler. With Weak aura's such as twintops apparition tracker you have plenty of warning for those orbs incoming to be able to refresh early.

[DarkieZ]

Hi guys, I don't normally raid or do pve nerd things like that, so what would you guys recommend to a noobersmith like me for challenge modes and such cause my friends made me do some but Idk if what I was doing was right pls help ty.

[Yvaelle]

Hi guys, I don't normally raid or do pve nerd things like that, so what would you guys recommend to a noobersmith like me for challenge modes and such cause my friends made me do some but Idk if what I was doing was right pls help ty.

Mind Sear Insanity, Twist of Fate, Cascade.

Clarity of Power for most runs - either you will want the higher single target (at that item level) from Spike/Blast, or you will want the +40% additional mass AoE on your Searing Insanity. Challenge modes don't have a lot of sustained dot cleave, and the 630 item level will reduce the amount of attainable crit to make Auspicious Spirits feels less effective.

[Dawnrage]

Even inside bloodlust, single target with 100% crit rate, you will only get an orb every 2 seconds. which means 1 of your 4 casts in a 6 second period is DP, 1 is MB that still leaves 2-3 for Filler. With Weak aura's such as twintops apparition tracker you have plenty of warning for those orbs incoming to be able to refresh early.

I find that in those strings of decent SA procs, I tend to get into periods where

VT is at or < 6 seconds left
I didn't get a multi-strike DP and I extended insanity perfectly on the previous DP

In those situations, I end up having to pick between -

1) Casting VT first after the insanity and before the new DP, but losing 4pc stacks.
2) Casting DP right after the insanity, and have VT fall off for a tick or two.
3) Recasting VT at some point during insanity instead, and losing insanity ticks.

I was curious in this scenario, what's the most optimal way to play for max DPS?

[ZombiexCat]

Don't lose insanity ticks. If you're already channeling, just keep going. VT off for 2 ticks will make less of an impact than the loss of a full insanity channel.

[Haikus]

It has a higher DPET because it lasts 15 seconds. The question is to delay VT for 2 GCDs, not to avoid casting it altogether for the next 15 seconds. For 2 GCDs (one MFI cast):

~3 tics of VT (you'll lose one tic for letting VT drop) = 87.75% SP
4 tics of MFI = (263.4%)*(1+%mastery) SP

So I'd channel that last MFi.

I thought VT ticks were worth like ~59% sp and vt only consumes one gcd so you also need to add in the mflay ticks, but yeah rereading his original question now that i'm not groggy from lack of sleep. I'd go with the extending of insanity. Also were you including the haste modifier for dots in your Vt calcs?

[Triggered Fridgekin]

I've always wanted to love Shadow Priests, having leveled many but never following through. However, as I am rolling on a new server, I'd like to roll with something I don't have on my master server so I'll be giving it a solid try again. I figure dungeon and even quest grinding is more than suitable in Disc which makes it that much quicker to get out of the gutter and hit 100.

What has always intimidated me (as well as Warlock and Boomkin) is multidotting, especially with Shadow and the uptime of SWP and VT and the current state of raiding where multidotting is nearly the standard for casters. Granted, I am sure it's not rocket science and I already use a UI which tracks DoTs and the likes.

[Yvaelle]

I've always wanted to love Shadow Priests, having leveled many but never following through. However, as I am rolling on a new server, I'd like to roll with something I don't have on my master server so I'll be giving it a solid try again. I figure dungeon and even quest grinding is more than suitable in Disc which makes it that much quicker to get out of the gutter and hit 100.

What has always intimidated me (as well as Warlock and Boomkin) is multidotting, especially with Shadow and the uptime of SWP and VT and the current state of raiding where multidotting is nearly the standard for casters. Granted, I am sure it's not rocket science and I already use a UI which tracks DoTs and the likes.

DoT tracking is fun - you'll get it

Remember the rule, the secret to success is.... MOAR DOTSSSSS

[napoleonmp]

As yall can see my first post, i am not a serious raider more due to i dont really know the right people to become a hardcore raider... anyways im more a LFR raider, but i only enjoy the AS DoT build... will i ever as a LFR raider get enuff iLvL to be good at AS build?

[Djriff]

Honestly unless you have some crafted gear and blizz improves stat variance in LFR, no.

Easy to pug though, just open up group finder and find a normal. You don't need to be a hardcore raider just to get out of LFR.

[napoleonmp]

I didnt know i could do that! thanks!

[Naux]

As yall can see my first post, i am not a serious raider more due to i dont really know the right people to become a hardcore raider... anyways im more a LFR raider, but i only enjoy the AS DoT build... will i ever as a LFR raider get enuff iLvL to be good at AS build?

You will be able to in 6.2 with LFR dropping 685 + mythic dungeons.

[Yvaelle]

I didnt know i could do that! thanks!

Also you can go here, if you want to do Mythics / Heroics

MMO-Champion Guild Recruitment Forum (US)

(There are other regions too of course, I just took a guess)

[Deleted]

Quick question - is Cascade worth casting on fights like Kromog/Hans'gar/Oregorger where you pick it for the points of the fight with more than 1 target, when those targets aren't present? Is single target Cascade between these multi-target points in the fight worth more than a mind flay?

[Djriff]

Quick question - is Cascade worth casting on fights like Kromog/Hans'gar/Oregorger where you pick it for the points of the fight with more than 1 target, when those targets aren't present? Is single target Cascade between these multi-target points in the fight worth more than a mind flay?

I use cascade on oregorger when I have to move from an acid pool. I only do that if MB is on CD, I have weakened soul, or I'm not in a part of my dot weave I have 2 GCD's of insta casts. If you are going to do it, make sure its up for when you need it otherwise it will be a DPS los.

For Hans, assuming you are talented for AS, you should be running Surge of Darkness (insta mind spike talent) and save your Mind Spikes for when you have to move. If you are running CoP if you think your raid's DPS won't push the 2nd boss back down before your CD is up by all means use cascade.

As for Kromog, you can run cascade if you want to, however halo is superior in terms of dmg to kromog and to the pillars. You should only be running cascade if your raid is having problems killing the hands in a timely manner.

TLR Only use cascade if you are moving, it will be of CD for add phases, and you have no other productive insta cast to use.

Side note, cascade hits harder ST and a SW:P does.

[Yvaelle]

Quick question - is Cascade worth casting on fights like Kromog/Hans'gar/Oregorger where you pick it for the points of the fight with more than 1 target, when those targets aren't present? Is single target Cascade between these multi-target points in the fight worth more than a mind flay?

So long as you are getting the max range bonus (anything over 30 yards should do), yes - even on a single target without any bouncing, Cascade > Mind Flay (but not DoTs, Blast, Death, or Insanity - so be sure you're only throwing it out there as filler).

However, if you anticipate an add wave coming in less than 25 seconds it is probably still best to save it: a target-rich Cascade of course beats a one-hit Cascade by an order of magnitude, if there is any chance at all of managing to fit two Cascade into a single upcoming add wave, better to save it for the adds - drop it once they appear, and then again (ideally) before they die (ex. Darmac, Operator).

Edit: Side note, even on H/Frans I went back to Insanity personally - once you are comfortable with the fight the DPS loss from plate switching really isn't as bad as it originally appeared (or the other way of saying that is, even with 2 target VT uptime and very high movement, SoD still isn't good).

Plus, since I'm usually the ranged pacesetter for plate swaps, I activate the next plate when it suits my DP/Insanity!