demon hunter is too similar to warlocks and could just be a 4th spec melee spec inste

[Mormolyce]

Are you trying to start a flame war?

He didn't start the fire, it was always burning.

[Deleted]

yeah I don't think we'll ever see demon hunters.. most of their iconic abilities have been given to Warlocks (Meta, Immolation Aura) and Rogues..

it's a shame but what can you do

[Deleted]

I agree with most people that there should not be a new class introduced, but instead a new spec to all classes (druids as well?).

Shaman - Earth warden
Warlock - demon hunter
Mage - (not sure about this one, either a battle-mage type tank, or something in line with their other specs, temporal (heal?))
Priest - inquisitor (trying to persuade the mind to become good, only it is damaging to minds that are evil, unlike shadow priest that just assaults the mind)
Rogue - dark ranger
Hunter - Tinker (with all of the inventions that have been going on throughout the expansion, hunter have finally mastered new things to use in their hunter)
Warrior - maybe work out the gladiator spec
Death knight - necromancer, maybe being able to summon a couple of ghouls/skeletons at once, but they do most of the damage, it is up to the necromancer to keep them up with death coil as they slowly lose health)
Paladin - Ranged dps, a couple of spells already exist, with denounce as filler.
Druid - no idea
Monk - no idea (ranged dps?)

Heck, another idea we can play with is that in the end of this expansion, we also drink from the pool of blood and become empowered sort of, maybe upgrading all current specs or adding the fourth spec.

[taliey]

Man, the speculation wars are heating up.

[Fuiking]

He didn't start the fire, it was always burning.

Did you just reference a song?

[Deleted]

Did you just reference a song?

since the world's been turning

[Fuiking]

Yes you did hahaha <3

[Notshauna]

Lorewise, nothing says a Priest can't.

Similarly to Green "I'm a one handed elemental-enhancement Shaman Warrior" Jesus Thrall over there.

Lore wise the classes are super duper muddied, for example a Mage can become a Warlock at will and vice versa, a Paladin is literally a Priest with military training (a clear upgrade). Plus we have countless hybrid spec/class characters who basically throw class purists through a mental hoop (is Vol'jin a shaman or a hunter?) making the entire lore based argument silly. Classes are a gameplay contrivance, and as such trying to make the best gameplay is the only consideration (thematics are important to the feel aspect of gameplay, a random collection of abilities is a lot less fun than a thematic). Lore is irrelevant here.

[Fuiking]

I love muddied classes *remembers the time when he ran around as a heavily armored Battle-Mage/Rogue/Ghostwalker (most favo spell all time) in Oblivion*

[NoiseTank13]

I'm starting to wish Blizz retconned Demon Hunters and Tinkers out.

[HeiAggra]

I never really got the appeal of demon hunters or warlocks. I just pretend my warlock is a blood mage with her little phoenix and floaty ball things.

Though, I suppose if you wanted you could make every commonly requested class into a 4th spec.
Hunter-Tinker
Warlock-Demon hunter
Rogue-Dark Ranger
Death knight-Necromancer
Priest-Bard
Mage-Artificer
Warrior-Warden

There you go, I think that's all of them. Many new class!

4th spec. IMO
Hunter-Shadow Hunter (I don't see the tinker class as a Hunter's only spec it's a profession trait)
Warlock - Necromancer (instead of summon deamons would summon the dead)
Rogue-Dark Ranger
Death Knight - Fire Knight (Like Bolvar LK)
Priest-Bard
Mage-Artificer
Warrior-Warden
Shaman - Witch Doctor

I did not put DH because Locks and Rogues have all the spells from DH'S so it would be a copy paste of 2 classes into one. Sorry DH lovers but i just dont see them coming as a player class

[Irian]

Or they could manage to merge demon hunters with warlocks significantly easier.

Or they could not and create an entirely new class seeing as how only one class has a fourth spec and they implied they currently have no plans to give fourth specs to other classes.

Warlocks are not demon hunters. Instead of butchering two class concepts it'd be much cooler and a long-awaited and likely ridiculously popular idea to give them their own class, seeing as how style-wise there is next to no overlap. Like I said, they share basically nothing lore-wise except for the use of fel magic, a perfect analogy is a priest vs. paladin. One is a generalized fel user, the other is a fel-corrupted melee-combatant who loathes all things demonic and only uses them as a means to destroy demons.

Also, I have no idea why you're talking about WC2 death knights. The death knights of WoW are clearly WC3 Lich King death knights and have nothing to do with the kind you're talking about, and said WC3 death knights are - while not perfect - fairly close to a respectable level to their original incarnation.

[Talen]

To address the topic more directly though, here's a quick checklist of major differences between Demon Hunters and Warlocks:
1) Demon Hunters are melee fighters, Warlocks are ranged casters.

Enh Shamans are melee...Ele Shamans are ranged
Boomkin Druids are ranged...Feral and Guardians are melee
Grand Warlock Nethekurse is a Warlock who melees
Player warlocks have a history of acting in melee
Blizzards given Warlocks melee capability of varying effectiveness in the past.

Neither game design, lore, class design or player history supports the assertion that Warlocks cannot melee. All that can be said is that the current specs make ranged combat a better option.

2) Demon Hunters dual wield, Warlocks don't.

Yep. This is true. However....dual wielding is a skill, and a skill that can be added to a class or spec at any time. What if Dual Wield is a L101+ baseline skill for Warlocks? What if, next XPac, Blizzard makes it a L50 Demo specific skill? What if they add a 4th spec and one of the L10 skills is Dual Wield?

So yes...Warlocks don't have it. Is there any difficulty or problem that would prevent Blizzard providing it? No.

3) Demon Hunters don't summon demons, they want to hunt and kill them.

Ahhh....this old chestnut. First, even if we accept your opinion that DHs "don't" summon demons, that doesn't mean they can't.

Further, can you prove your assertion that Demon Hunters don't or can't or won't summon demons? Further, can you prove the implication that DHs would only want to hunt and kill them and would not want to use them to fight other demons or assist him in other ways?

There are 9 or so named DHs in the world. Of these....8 worked with demons, and the 9th is an Illidan groupie who is a fan of the same Illidan who became a demon and worked with Demons. And I'm not counting all those BElf initiates who got training from Illidan and had to work with demons as a result.

4) Demon Hunters are extremely agile, Warlocks can't move while casting.

Warlocks can however move while casting instant cast spells or melee.

5) Demon Hunters came from night elves, and night elves can't be Warlocks (for good reason).

What you mean is that NElf players can't choose to be Warlocks. Night Elf's, however, can be Warlocks.

The point is, it would have to be an almost complete overhaul of the class

DHs would need a 4th spec to be done right...as in, to be raid viable. Technically, you could even do it just by adding in a dual weild skill. It wouldn't be raid viable as a DH but you'd be able to do everything a DH could.

That isn't an 'almost complete overhaul of the class'

and that's not even counting the lore. Lore-wise, Demon Hunter and Warlocks are pretty much as opposed to each other as two classes can be.

Lorewise, Demon Hunters and Warlocks encompass Demons, Sargeras, the Burning Legion. Lorewise, they're both beings who risk their soul for power. Lorewise, they are both beings who work with, kill and use use demons. Lorewise,the only difference between the two is that DHs got to go through the rites and rituals of associated with the Dark Embrace.

This is simply restating the opinion that Demon Hunters can't work with demons.....an opinion neither the game, nor lore nor game play supports. Most of the DHs in game have a history of working with Demons and the one that doesn't supports those who do. Further, a Demon Hunter PC who can't work with demons isn't going to fit in very well with Warlock players.

Also, it may seem small, but night elves can't be warlocks

As above, the fact that NElf players...AT THIS TIME...can't choose to be Warlocks doesn't mean NElf Warlocks can't or don't exist. They do. Alliance players even got to kill one in Darkshore.

EJL

[Raiju]

Grand Warlock Nethekurse is a Warlock who melees

Anyone using this argument can safely be ignored, for future reference in the thread. It's been proven 100 times over why it's simply due to game mechanics in 5mans at the time.

[Amnaught]

(they're a demon HUNTER... not a Demon USER [ie. warlock))

Wrong... http://classic.battle.net/war3/night...onhunter.shtml "They made a pact, long ago, to fight against the forces of chaos using its own terrible powers against it. "

[Deleted]

Anyone using this argument can safely be ignored, for future reference in the thread. It's been proven 100 times over why it's simply due to game mechanics in 5mans at the time.

Because it's obvious that Warlocks absolutely cannot melee. Every Warlock is born with a crippling bone condition that prevents them from practicing any form of melee combat lest they suffer ineffable pain. I thought everybody knew that.

[Talen]

Anyone using this argument can safely be ignored, for future reference in the thread. It's been proven 100 times over why it's simply due to game mechanics in 5mans at the time.

There are other Warlocks in game who don't melee. Are you really trying to say Blizzard had no option for that boss except to use a meleecWarlock?

Blizzard made the choice, Blizzard wrote his lore. Blizzard didn't need to call him a Warlock...they didn't need to make him a caster at all, nor did they have to make him a meleer. But they did.

But regardless of why, his existence IS canonical. He's a Warlock...who melees.

And really? If the only counter you have to canonical information is "ignore it because it makes me wrong"....then you simply have to accept you are wrong. Regardless of why Nethekurse was designed as he is, he is still part of the canon. He is still a Warlock who melees.

EJL

[Raiju]

Because it's obvious that Warlocks absolutely cannot melee. Every Warlock is born with a crippling bone condition that prevents them from practicing any form of melee combat lest they suffer ineffable pain. I thought everybody knew that.

Every warlock can swing their staff

Very VERY few warlocks can swing their staff well. The only source of warlock melee was by imbuing your staff with magic so it was the equivalent of a touch attack - merely making contact would travel a spell to deal damage more efficiently than throwing it through the air.

Warlocks as a general rule do not have the physical prowess that trained fighters of their race would have. The only warlocks who would realistically be combat capable are orcs of older generations who would've had to pass their rite of adulthood using physical prowess before being taught shamanism (before being taught warlock magic). Even then it will have been years, and even the most prominent example - gorefiend - relied on spells to cover his lacking fighting capabilities.

The only reason Nethekurses melees do high damage is because without it you wouldn't need a tank. This fight was designed in TBC when tanks did not have any real magical mitigation, and in raids when a mob was primarily caster you would indeed use a caster to tank it as they did they job better. This is no longer the case anymore. This game design has been improved and doesn't exist.

[Traveler Voltin]

4th spec. IMO
Hunter-Shadow Hunter (I don't see the tinker class as a Hunter's only spec it's a profession trait)
Warlock - Necromancer (instead of summon deamons would summon the dead)
Rogue-Dark Ranger
Death Knight - Fire Knight (Like Bolvar LK)
Priest-Bard
Mage-Artificer
Warrior-Warden
Shaman - Witch Doctor

I did not put DH because Locks and Rogues have all the spells from DH'S so it would be a copy paste of 2 classes into one. Sorry DH lovers but i just dont see them coming as a player class

Shaman would have a tank spec based off earth.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

Agility-based melee class that doesn't use pet demons and actively hunts and kills Warlocks.


Let's make it a Warlock spec!





Oh, also, if you make Demon Hunter a Warlock Spec, I hope you're excited for Night Elf Affliction Warlocks, because Demon Hunter literally is a Night Elf thing.