Canadian Government threaten hate charges against those who boycott Israel

[Endus]

Im sure it all falls under C51. In which case you probably wouldnt get a normal judge or trial anyways

I'll be honest, I haven't read up enough on C-51, but still; this isn't gonna fly. This is the kind of thing we tear down governments over. And given the spanking the PCs just got in Alberta, this is not the time they want to be going to a federal election.

[Masark]

And given the spanking the PCs just got in Alberta, this is not the time they want to be going to a federal election.

Though they don't have much of an option on that. Their fixed election dates act has an election scheduled for October 19th. And even if they ignore that, the Constitution mandates that Parliament must be dissolved no later than May 23rd, 2016.

[Gheld]

^At the same time going by what I've witnessed here in manitoba provincial NDP usually runs more center friendly campaigns than their federal counterparts. So I wouldn't start throwing the confetti yet.

[Masark]

And predictably, Harper claims the story is "inaccurate and ridiculous", in spite of documentary evidence to the contrary.

https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2...-prosecutions/

[Stormdash]

The problem here is that Canada has a statute with which to threaten such nonsense, for either pro- or anti-Israel advocacy. Free speech necessarily means "hate" speech/rude speech/offensive speech/insulting, demeaning speech, even Mean, Smelly, Angry, Stabby, Very Bad Townlong Speech.

[Masark]

The problem here is that Canada has a statute with which to threaten such nonsense, for either pro- or anti-Israel advocacy. Free speech necessarily means "hate" speech/rude speech/offensive speech/insulting, demeaning speech, even Mean, Smelly, Angry, Stabby, Very Bad Townlong Speech.

"Murder laws are bad because I can accuse you of murder for not buying my product."

That's approximately what you're saying. Harper's claims are a total non sequitur and your claim is the law is the problem rather than the non sequitur.

[Stormdash]

"Murder laws are bad because I can accuse you of murder for not buying my product."

That's approximately what you're saying. Harper's claims are a total non sequitur and your claim is the law is the problem rather than the non sequitur.

I'm saying, again in pretty plain language, that there is no "right" way to apply a "hate speech statute", because the statute itself is contrary to the pillars of a free society. People are unhappy about Harper is using this weapon against dissonant ideas, then take away the weapon which neither he nor any other agent of the Canadian government should ever have had in the first place.

Murder, see, is wrong. Speech isn't. That's (part of) why your analogy is ridiculous. Speech is protected, or is at least supposed to be -- and the only kind of speech that needs legal protection is the kind of speech likely to annoy or offend. You don't need a law to protect speech nobody has a problem with.

[Masark]

Murder, see, is wrong. Speech isn't. That's (part of) why your analogy is ridiculous. Speech is protected, or is at least supposed to be -- and the only kind of speech that needs legal protection is the kind of speech likely to annoy or offend. You don't need a law to protect speech nobody has a problem with.

Is advocating murder wrong?

Hate speech doesn't merely "annoy" or "offend". It incites.

[Kuntantee]

The fact that Canadian Jews boycott Isreal does not matter, they are not immune to hating others, self-hate, anti-semitism, etc. It's like thinking blacks can't be racist against blacks.

I disagree. Intra-ethnicity racism hardly ever happens. When groups raise critical views of some actions inside a community, that tells you something.

[Rennadrel]

^At the same time going by what I've witnessed here in manitoba provincial NDP usually runs more center friendly campaigns than their federal counterparts. So I wouldn't start throwing the confetti yet.

Considering the NDP won Quebec last time around, I wouldn't be surprised if they get elected federally. I think the Cons have done enough to fuck up their chances federally, just because of all the stupid shit that Harper has done. I don't see the Liberals doing much this coming election. Aside from the harmonized child care benefit that would be far more effective than the clusterfuck version that Harper created, Justin Trudeau has yet to do anything that makes him a unique individual.

[Rhine101]

The irony of all this is some of the strongest boycotting advocates are Jews and entire Jewish organizations, such as the Independent Jewish Voices.

So, is Canada going to convict Jews with "hate" laws for boycotting illegal (by all international definitions) settlement Israeli products?

. Wouldn't be the craziest I have seen

Watched a special on TV about Jews calling other Jews nazis. The one being called that had relatives who died and survived concentration camps. Goes to show that logic goes by the wayside in such situations.

[Deleted]

I am now going to poke the hornets nest.

The Canadian Government is not going after every Boycott Israel group but just the BDS. For those who do not know. The BDS has a history of threatning, and assulting people. They are a hategroup, and hardly better then the Israely settlers they protest about.

For example at Concordia University. Students who disagreed with the BSD. Were harrassed, threatened and bullied and soon afterwards Anti-Semetic graffiti appeared in the University Bathroom Stalls.

In another incident at the university of Toronto, Students who spoke against the BDS were threatened and one Student was threatened with decapitation.

[Stormdash]

Is advocating murder wrong?

Hate speech doesn't merely "annoy" or "offend". It incites.

Advocating it in the abstract? Free speech. The boundary line at least in American law is speech that is a clear risk of inciting imminent lawless action, and reasonably foreseeable to the speaker. So, no, a website that lists the top 10,000 reasons to murder a ginger is still protected speech; too much has to happen in between your speech and any violent result for the blame to share to you and the state to therefore have the power to squelch your words. Standing in an angry mob of people and saying "kill the ginger!" and they immediately go "yeah!" and kill, that's what we're talking about.

In the context, advocating a boycott of Israel, or a buycott of Israel, neither of these come anywhere close to crossing from speech into words that themselves have legal significance as action (like incitement). Nor does pretty much anything that any "human rights" panel throughout the snowy dominion has ever hassled a private citizen over. So if you are mad at how Harper is wielding this ignorant bludgeon called a hate speech law, than take it away from him and all future executives.

[Deleted]

The very idea that they have "hate laws" in the first place is disgusting. "Free speech, as long as no one thinks it isn't nice!"

Every country has restrictions on free speech in some form (yes even the US). Anything else would be stupid.

[Kuntantee]

What a shocker, it was blown out of proportion by those that hate israel and want it to seem like the canadian government is totes in bed with them to support their cause.

- - - Updated - - -



Did you look into the story at all, or did you just see "Oh the people were anti-israel, so I supported them, because I hate israel"?

Too much use of word "hate" and accusing people with it does not make a better argument.

[Endus]

Did you look into the story at all, or did you just see "Oh the people were anti-israel, so I supported them, because I hate israel"?

I don't "hate Israel", and my position was in no way based on the subject being targeted; it was based on the pretty darned simple fact that our hate crime legislation only applies to cases where genocide is being encouraged, or hatred against a group is being fostered publicly, and a boycott in no way amounts to "hatred" nor "genocide".

It doesn't matter if the target is Israel, Russia, Sweden, Cuba, or anywhere else.

[Gheld]

Considering the NDP won Quebec last time around, I wouldn't be surprised if they get elected federally. I think the Cons have done enough to fuck up their chances federally, just because of all the stupid shit that Harper has done. I don't see the Liberals doing much this coming election. Aside from the harmonized child care benefit that would be far more effective than the clusterfuck version that Harper created, Justin Trudeau has yet to do anything that makes him a unique individual.

I want to believe. Unfortunately all I hear is "hurr durr, Trudeau, derpity derp." and I honestly don't see him doing anything at all different than Harper.

[Hyve]

Israel is such a difficult area to deal with for politicians. Their actions are borderline aggressive / abusive but unless you support them you're condemned as anti-semitic.

Yes, they're dealing with the difficulty of Hamas, but truth be told the whole situation over there is totally fucked because of us. It's just another example of how we've meddled too much in an area, and now we're struggling to control the damage.

[Lolretadin]

Wow, that is disgusting! How long before they push laws against boycotting certain companies or products?

That's not even remotely the same thing, less hyperbole would be nice.
The reason that it's happening is because some of the anti-Israel protesters (usually those of Arabic descent) have been going outside Jewish temples and beating people for the "crime" of being a Jew. I also have huge issues with these boycotting groups that support terrorist organizations like Hamas, and it doesn't help that these groups disseminate pro-Hamas messages along with the anti-Israel ones.

[Deleted]

The reason that it's happening is because some of the anti-Israel protesters (usually those of Arabic descent) have been going outside Jewish temples and beating people for the "crime" of being a Jew. I also have huge issues with these boycotting groups that support terrorist organizations like Hamas, and it doesn't help that these groups disseminate pro-Hamas messages along with the anti-Israel ones.

There are already laws, most centuries old and heavily used, for all the crimes you just listed.