Veterans frustrated by presidential debate on Iraq war

[Deleted]

Awww, we have to resort to flaming now?

When your opinion matters I'll give a shit, till then....

Thats not flaming if you take a dump on the constitution of your nation you deserve every bit of flak you can get.

The constitution is not just a bunch of fancy words its far more valueable then a guy with a loaded rifle.

[Machismo]

It's become quite clear that the reasons for going to Iraq were completely false. At best, our leaders and military intelligence were woefully incompetent. At worst, they deliberately chose to ignore and manipulate intelligence to further their own agenda... at the expense of a great many lives. Not only should we have never been there, we sure as shit should have never stayed. The locals stopped wanting us there in late 2003, and fro then on, we just made their lives worse.

[Theinquisition]

Thats not flaming if you take a dump on the constitution of your nation you deserve every bit of flak you can get.

The constitution is not just a bunch of fancy words its far more valueable then a guy with a loaded rifle.

Obviously you didn't get my point, maybe it's my fault for not communicating it right, my apologies.

What I was tryi,g to convey, is that Without the US military to back it up and if necessary use force to guarantee it, it could easily be run over by subversive elements

I love our constitution

[Skandulous]

Of course brother, I was just curious how other vets here feel about it. I spent almost 4 years of my life there, I feel like I have a vested intrest in what happens. Sucks to watch everything we sweat and bled for slip away.

Spent 4 years their myself i know how u feel but i knew it was bullshit from the beginning. Alot of ppl i served with knew we were their for the wrong reasons and didnt want to be their but they fought and some lost their life's all because our govt is fucked up. We never won or were gonna win its a lose lose situation thats fucked up and american lives should have never been put in it.

[Deleted]

Obviously you didn't get my point, maybe it's my fault for not communicating it right, my apologies.

What I was tryi,g to convey, is that Without the US military to back it up and if necessary use force to guarantee it, it could easily be run over by subversive elements

I love our constitution

Thats the job of the police and courts not the one of the Military.

Military is against non domestic threats.

[Theinquisition]

Thats the job of the police and courts not the one of the Military.

Military is against non domestic threats.

Not really, the polices job is to enforce local and state law, it is the militaries job to protect the nation from foreign and domestic enemies.

In our path we litteraly swear to defend the constitution.

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Spent 4 years their myself i know how u feel but i knew it was bullshit from the beginning. Alot of ppl i served with knew we were their for the wrong reasons and didnt want to be their but they fought and some lost their life's all because our govt is fucked up. We never won or were gonna win its a lose lose situation thats fucked up and american lives should have never been put in it.

I just made sure I was there for the guy to my left and right, I didn't want to get caught up in the politics, that would be a huge distraction

[Deleted]

In our path we litteraly swear to defend the constitution.

Just fancy words without a loaded gun I heard.

Not really, the polices job is to enforce local and state law, it is the militaries job to protect the nation from foreign and domestic enemies.

Think again about the domestic enemys you are walking on thin ice there my friend if you are not part of the National guard.

That is not your job.

[Theinquisition]

Just fancy words without a loaded gun I heard.


Think again about the domestic enemys you are walking on thin ice there my friend if you are not part of the National guard.

That is not your job.

Active duty forces can absolutely be mobilized to fight a domestic or a foreign enemy on US soil, sure there's different legalities involved, but that's what we are here for. So yes, it absolutely is our job. The national guard is supposed to be a state militia that can be federalized. Sure the Active duty military is bound by posse comintatus, but that can be overturned under emergency.

I mean shit man, Do you think police cruisers are going to stand up well to a T-90 Tank? Or a large scale domestic disturbance I.E. revolution?

[Deleted]

I mean shit man, Do you think police cruisers are going to stand up well to a T-90 Tank? Or a large scale domestic disturbance I.E. revolution?

So you would fire on american citizens?

You didnt say coup.

[Theinquisition]

So you would fire on american citizens?

You didnt say coup.

Really depends.

If they were anarchist style revolutionaries bent on over throwing the givt by forceful means to create some sort of Marxist hellhole, and killing other American civilians in the process......maybe.

[Independent voter]

Really depends.

If they were anarchist style revolutionaries bent on over throwing the givt by forceful means to create some sort of Marxist hellhole, and killing other American civilians in the process......maybe.

Yeah, all those smelly left wingers who say they want a revolution and out the other corner of their mouth say how much they hate the military.

[Haven]

Personally, It makes me feel hollow about the time I spent there. All that time away from family and friends for what?

For oil, weapon manufacturers, and easy votes.

What Conflicts have we actually won militarily since the 2nd World War Besides Desert Storm. You mean once we made an incredibly fucking stupid mistake, we should keep forging ahead on a losing battle at all cost. Not actually that is the kind of dumb shit that actually not only loses wars, but waste resources and lives. Cut our fucking loses, learn from the past, and stop trying to fucking police and manipulate other regions of the world, fix our own country and problems first.

Impossible. If Americans aren't distracted by another crusade, another illusory enemy that scares them with totalitarism and makes them think they're superior and free, they'll sooner or later start paying attention to their own problems. Which will likely ruin America.

[Haven]

What oil? I see this all the time and not one person is able to explain it. What oil has the US gotten from Iraq? What American oil companies are raking in the profits from their new found ownership of Iraqi oil? If you're going to repeat this nonsense, at least have some evidence. Conspiracy theories are against the forum rules.

It's not HoMM. It's about who controls the territory and oil industry in the area. Why would America blatantly siphon all oil, if it can control the suppliers, hence control the prices and who they trade with? Besides, Americans ensure that no infrastructure is being built, no projects are initiated and ultimately that no country reaches the status at which it could interfere with American domination on energy market. Middle East is rich as fuck, and if Arabs were to unite and play their own game with prices on oil, Middle East would've been a serious power. That's why USA does everything in its power to make the region an eternal hellhole of religious war and chaos that never develops.

[Theinquisition]

Yeah, all those smelly left wingers who say they want a revolution and out the other corner of their mouth say how much they hate the military.

Omg hubcap, it's like you're in my brain, get out!

[Deleted]

Look how quickly mainland Europe fell in WW2.

Was it because of the dirty liberals living in a bubble or because of bad military strategy?

[Theinquisition]

It's not HoMM. It's about who controls the territory and oil industry in the area. Why would America blatantly siphon all oil, if it can control the suppliers, hence control the prices and who they trade with? Besides, Americans ensure that no infrastructure is being built, no projects are initiated and ultimately that no country reaches the status at which it could interfere with American domination on energy market. Middle East is rich as fuck, and if Arabs were to unite and play their own game with prices on oil, Middle East would've been a serious power. That's why USA does everything in its power to make the region an eternal hellhole of religious war and chaos that never develops.

Actually we spent lots of time and money building things. The problem is, as soon as a job got done, dickheads would g on strip it down for parts, and sell shit.

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Was it because of the dirty liberals living in a bubble or because of bad military strategy?

Both

10Char

[Deleted]

Both

10Char

Let me guess you think the first caused the second.

Same old same old its the homefront that caused it in the end lacking support for the military and not vastly
incompetence in the armed forces where you have elitist thinking and ivory towers in the upper echolon as well.

Not properly policing Bghadad City in the first months after the War costed years if not decades but who gets the blame?

[Hooked]

We should have just destroyed them and then left Immediately. I am no fan of nation building or putting our soldiers at risk any longer than it takes to defeat the enemy. Get in, do the damn thing, then get out. Let them fix it back up, and warn them not to try it again or its gonna be the same but worse.

[Deleted]

We should have just destroyed them and then left Immediately. I am no fan of nation building or putting our soldiers at risk any longer than it takes to defeat the enemy. Get in, do the damn thing, then get out.

Like the mongol horde?

[Theinquisition]

Let me guess you think the first caused the second.

Same old same old its the homefront that caused it in the end lacking support for the military and not vastly
incompetence in the armed forces where you have elitist thinking and ivory towers in the upper echolon as well.

Not properly policing Bghadad City in the first months after the War costed years if not decades but who gets the blame?

Thought you were talking about pre ww2 Europe?

The magniot line was an awful idea. Combine that with a weak stomached govt.....boom disaster.