Dual Wield in 6.2

[Taninsam]

And interestingly, hastefrost (ie, spending unholy runes on Obliterate) is a very small single-target DPS loss. But of course you lose a metric crapton of cleave

Wait wut? Hastefrost is the basically the 2H rotation. As DW, you still want to spend UH runes on OB - that's the masterfrost rotation. In fact, it's extremely important that you do in T18 w/tier bonuses, since it's a big dps gain to use every single KM you get (even if it means using the proc on OB).

[Manabomb]

Summon stone dude. Everyone has been saying it. Icy veins hasn't been relevant in years.

Want to know something interesting? Almost every guide on summon stone looks like a copy paste guide from Icy veins done by almost all the same people. Icy veins not being relevant is kind of hilarious, really.

[Schizoide]

Wait wut? Hastefrost is the basically the 2H rotation. As DW, you still want to spend UH runes on OB - that's the masterfrost rotation. In fact, it's extremely important that you do in T18 w/tier bonuses, since it's a big dps gain to use every single KM you get (even if it means using the proc on OB).

Sorry, misspoke, I meant death runes... but that's not what I simmed. You're right. Hastefrost is a good 5% behind. Probably a bit less, as the hastefrost APL isn't optimized for DW, all I did was take out the KM conditions.

Regarding icy-veins, the frost DK guide is written by Mendenbarr, who's rock-solid just like Skullflower. He's another one that tells people to wait on KM, though.

[Deleted]

Will the playstyle just be old school masterfrost?

[Taninsam]

Will the playstyle just be old school masterfrost?

Yes, but with some slight differences in priority (i.e. OB KM when you can't FS KM and you have at least one unholy rune).

[Cyanyde]

What exactly is hastefrost? Just using obliterate when you're about to cap unholy runes?

[Taninsam]

Like I said, Hastefrost was very similar to current 2H (aka OB spam), but you used remaining runes on HB. Just so you know, it's an obsolete rotation.

[Clash the DK]

I'm also interested in which priority will be tops depending on 2/4 piece and the final trinket. But to be clear, the following are the three different established rotations:

1. Hastefrost - All runes used on Obliterate
2. Masterfrost - Obliterate only used to spend Unholy runes
3. Mastersimple - Obliterate not used at all

[Maxweii]

Want to know something interesting? Almost every guide on summon stone looks like a copy paste guide from Icy veins done by almost all the same people. Icy veins not being relevant is kind of hilarious, really.

While yes, there are big names (different names but still big names) in each respective community making guide for Icy Veins, it's generally not a good source of information as it usually get's watered down and is almost a "last resort" style area to look. There's always better specialized websites for each spec, and now with Summonstone you get that a lot easier.

[Nayami]

The Masterfrost play style makes me want to gouche out my eyes. If hastefrost becomes viable I will definitely give DW frost a shot, otherwise I'll keep Unholy for my DPS spec. Although I'm really happy for DW Frost fans.

[Deleted]

For DW, the haste-frost rotation isn't viable at all. Even with literally no mastery, 2 howling blasts SIGNIFICANTLY outdamage 1 Obliterate.
Check "6.2 Death Knight Changes Discussion" for damage breakdown and new sim results.

[Raikh]

Masterfrost follows a similar "rotation" to unholy. HB is your SS and OB is your FeS to some degree. You want to optimize HB usage but still keep the runes you can't use it on depleted so you don't lose out on resources.
Its a bit different in that you don't generate death runes and get those unholy runes back over and over again but since you don't need to use OB once one comes up again the distribution of ability uses should be similar comparatively.

While I agree that unholy has more nuances with BB for sudden AoE/cleave, timmy transforming, possibly necroticblight and so on and KM/rime fail to replace that from a gameplay perspective its not like you play something entirely different and dumb. YOu will still be pretty much GCD locked to a degree, you still have to manage your resources and you still use all your improtant abilities on a regular basis.

Hastefrost and mastersimple were basically the degenerate playstyles were you suddenly dropped core abilities of your spec out of rotation. For hastefrost atleast in the newer versions with uh presence and so on, since higher FS cost etc.

I have a bit mixed feelings of switching to DW frost since unholy really is fun and I will especially miss BoS and necroticblight management but on the other hand I enjoyed frost in some tiers pretty much and DW now offers the more interesting frost playstyle so its ok.
I have no problem with playing a less colorful spec if it atleast feels powerful and feels fluid and effective for the bosses to come, since in case of most bosses they offer enough to focus on during progression so that its still an engaging experience even if the spec itself should be not as much fun as unholy.

Although the difference in ST damage between frost and unholy looks a bit silly. Having a bit of a dejavu here looking back at SoO release and probably a few other tiers, too.
The good part is that atleast the voerall sims I've seen put us in a better position overall than the SoO ones did, only need to see how that actually plays out in HFC.

[Deleted]

When playing PL/defile, you're very close to GCD locked, and I would imagine you are flooding in ressources during BL/Hero.

DW is very strong on the PTR.

[Skullknight]

Don't leave us unholy

[Adlian]

Don't leave us unholy

Blizzard decided to bench Unholy in 6.2...

[Maxweii]

Blizzard decided to bench Unholy in 6.2...

Except if you look around you will see that Unholy has it's place on a few encounters in the tier especially depending on fight strats you use.

[Sunnydee]

And on top of that, average joe has more choice than ever. You can go 2h frost, DWF, defile Uh, NP Uh, BoS Uh. Atm its Unholy or below tanks as frost after you managed to get decent gear in lfr or normal with your 1-2 times a week with friends. Sure DWF will be higher than the other now, but for someone who might play unholy better and isnt really on the higher end of tier raiding, ANY SPEC WILL DO JUST FINE, heck if you are shit as DWF you will prob do more output as unholy (or if extreme ilvl difference on weapons).

[Schizoide]

2H is likely only competitive on single-targets. It does look like DW and Unholy will trade-off, though, which is nice.

[pallyballz]

For Masterfrost is Mastery important enough to take over gems/enchants that are normally Multistrike?

[Ktz385]

For Masterfrost is Mastery important enough to take over gems/enchants that are normally Multistrike?

What does, 'that are normally multistrike' mean?