"Hero picks don't matter": The only way that HotS isn't pay-for-advtanage

[pateuvasiliu]

LoL, which is the biggest MOBA in the world.

Only because half its players have a smurf account. Out of 30 millions, around 4 accounts are mine. I know plenty people that have an account on NA, EUW and EUN.

DotA offers the biggest prizes and if you were to study the individual players ( not accounts ) of each game you'd end up with similar numbers.

[Mormolyce]

Only because half its players have a smurf account. Out of 30 millions, around 4 accounts are mine. I know plenty people that have an account on NA, EUW and EUN.

DotA offers the biggest prizes and if you were to study the individual players ( not accounts ) of each game you'd end up with similar numbers.

All speculation.

It's irrelevant anyway. LoL is widely considered the market leader.

[Kyanion]

Only because half its players have a smurf account. Out of 30 millions, around 4 accounts are mine. I know plenty people that have an account on NA, EUW and EUN.

DotA offers the biggest prizes and if you were to study the individual players ( not accounts ) of each game you'd end up with similar numbers.

Biggest prizes mean jack crap. League is the bigger game playerbase wise (also more people watching Tournaments). It is wonderful that there is a lot of big prize pools for the smaller games. It really does not matter though. Just because you think a large prize pool makes it the better game and that Blizz should emulate it is silly.

[Bloodletters]

Only because half its players have a smurf account. Out of 30 millions, around 4 accounts are mine. I know plenty people that have an account on NA, EUW and EUN.

DotA offers the biggest prizes and if you were to study the individual players ( not accounts ) of each game you'd end up with similar numbers.

Sorry, that's anecdotal evidence that doesn't really answer why League has 70 million unique log ins a month. If you look at twitch viewership, League is three times more popular than Dota, right now. Dota has the biggest prizes for their world tournament because it is crowd funded and League doesn't do that.

[Kyanion]

Sorry, that's anecdotal evidence that doesn't really answer why League has 70 million unique log ins a month. If you look at twitch viewership, League is three times more popular than Dota, right now. Dota has the biggest prizes for their world tournament because it is crowd funded and League doesn't do that.

Yeah if League followed the same crowd funding method Dota did the prizes would shit on Dota. Why? More people watching/playing. Simple.

[Mormolyce]

Can we really stop getting into pissing matches? LoL has the biggest playerbase and all that history, DOTA2 has those cool tournaments/community stuff and the really cheap and open pricing model, SMITE has its unique 3D thing, HoTS has its different maps/objectives/no last hitting/team XP...

There's different strokes for different folks. If you like one and not another, that's cool. The other ones are just a little different.

[Tekkommo]

Can we really stop getting into pissing matches? LoL has the biggest playerbase and all that history, DOTA2 has those cool tournaments/community stuff and the really cheap and open pricing model, SMITE has its unique 3D thing, HoTS has its different maps/objectives/no last hitting/team XP...

There's different strokes for different folks. If you like one and not another, that's cool. The other ones are just a little different.

How dare you try to bring reason to a MOBA thread!

[Deleted]

How dare you try to bring reason to a MOBA thread!

lol - you've heard the man!

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

I'm not playing the game.

.

Then why are you complaining about it?

[velspine]

I just did the sane thing and just reported this thread to get locked, seriously PU is either trolling everyone who he is blatantly a holders of a short bus pass. Quit feeding him.

[paralleluniverse]

You're assuming that counter-picking will be more beneficial than just playing your best hero, which is flawed at best. Just because you have a hero available doesn't mean you play it well or that it'll make you any more effective.

I'm not assuming that and I have never assumed that.

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In 13 pages, no one has been able to counter my argument because no one has been able to explain how in a game where heroes are NOT always equal, can it be possible that buying heroes is not pay for advantage.

And the reason no one can explain it is because it is not possible.

In addition, in 13 pages, no one has been able to counter my counterargument to "you can unlock all the heroes without paying", which is that even if you unlock all the heroes the game is still unfair as your opponent may not be able to unlock all the heroes because he doesn't have enough money.

And the reason no one can counter my counterargument is because it is true.

[Calfredd]

I'm not assuming that and I have never assumed that.

- - - Updated - - -

In more than 13 pages, no one has been able to counter my argument because no one has been able to explain how in a game where heroes are NOT always equal, can it be possible that buying heroes is not pay for advantage.

And the reason no one can explain it is because it is not possible.

Or you have selective reading bias and just skipped addressing the ones that did counter or at least said otherwise.

[paralleluniverse]

Or you have selective reading bias and just skipped addressing the ones that did counter or at least said otherwise.

There are none. If you think there are, then link it. Every argument has already been countered. People are just going around in circles, repeating the same already debunked arguments without reading or addressing it.

it is logically impossible in a game where heroes are NOT always equal, for the ability to buy heroes with real money not to be pay for advantage.

[paralleluniverse]

Blizzard has just released a YouTube video where the following quote appears.

Pro gamer from TempoStorm, winner of the North America Opens: "If you have a bad draft it can be really, really hard to win".
http://youtu.be/730nOpPtX6s?t=53

Yet we have people blinded by ideological rigidity who claim otherwise. Because accepting that not all hero picks or drafts are equal in a game where you can buy heroes necessarily implies that the game is pay for advantage. And they just can't accept that logical conclusion.

[Ryme]

Sometimes I wonder if you're trying to cause controversy, I think you've made your point now

[Waaldo]

Blizzard has just released a YouTube video where the following quote appears.

Pro gamer from TempoStorm, winner of the North America Opens: "If you have a bad draft it can be really, really hard to win".
http://youtu.be/730nOpPtX6s?t=53

Yet we have people blinded by ideological rigidity who claim otherwise. Because accepting that not all hero picks or drafts are equal in a game where you can buy heroes necessarily implies that the game is pay for advantage. And they just can't accept that logical conclusion.

Dude... just stop....

No one wants to talk about it anymore because you don't seem to understand why this game isn't pay for advantage. All heroes can be unlocked in game without using real money. That's all that needs to be said.

[paralleluniverse]

Dude... just stop....

No one wants to talk about it anymore because you don't seem to understand why this game isn't pay for advantage. All heroes can be unlocked in game without using real money. That's all that needs to be said.

Dude... just stop repeating the same debunked nonsense over and over and over again...

If you would learn to read, this nonsense argument was already debunked on the 3rd post of this thread.

[Mirishka]

No, what matters is what people do in reality, not what they could do. Also, even if you have all heroes unlocked, when your opponent doesn't, then you are at an unfair advantage over your opponent. You could buy all the heroes, but you STILL can't make the game fair because you can't make your opponent buy all the heroes.

So its Blizzard's fault that people like you exist? People who lost sight of the fact that gaming is a hobby, for fun, and not this obsessive OMG MUST MAKE OPTIMAL BEST CHOICES ALWAYS OR NOT ENJOYING SELF stupidity?

You can buy heroes for gold without spending a dime no matter how (incredibly) dumb you want to try and spin that. Maybe you should stick to single player games?

[Deleted]

There are none. If you think there are, then link it. Every argument has already been countered. People are just going around in circles, repeating the same already debunked arguments without reading or addressing it.

it is logically impossible in a game where heroes are NOT always equal, for the ability to buy heroes with real money not to be pay for advantage.

Because having access to all heroes does not mean you will win the game -- thus giving you zero advantage. The only thing that it gives you is the access to all of the heroes, and everyone has that to some degree; some choose to acquire the heroes quickly; others do not. There is literally no advantage to having all the heroes unlocked -- just like with any MOBA or any fighting game for that matter. Your argument is correct but it's not valid because the initial premise isn't met; it doesn't give you an advantage to begin with, so you can't argue that it does because it does not, as your success is relative to a team effort and not just your own.

[paralleluniverse]

Because having access to all heroes does not mean you will win the game -- thus giving you zero advantage. The only thing that it gives you is the access to all of the heroes, and everyone has that to some degree; some choose to acquire the heroes quickly; others do not. There is literally no advantage to having all the heroes unlocked -- just like with any MOBA or any fighting game for that matter. Your argument is correct but it's not valid because the initial premise isn't met; it doesn't give you an advantage to begin with, so you can't argue that it does because it does not, as your success is relative to a team effort and not just your own.

Doing drugs in sports doesn't mean you will win.

Buying a 100% damage buff for real money also doesn't mean you will win.

So doing drugs and buying a 100% damage buff are fair.

Also, you're wrong, there is an advantage. Read the OP. Read what pro gamers say in the video above. Read what the Game Director of Heroes of the Storm says, he says heroes are not equal. So yes, heroes are not equal and yes the game is pay for advantage.