Mythic Hellfire Assault Gone Bad

[Lobialkon]

Hello everyone!

So, we reached that spot where you either go for Heroic Archimonde or Mythic Hellfire Assault. As reading that HFA was an overall easier fight than Archimonde, we decided to go for that one.

We got crushed, we barely reached 80% when either one of the cannons was too low or the right side of the encounter was overwhelmed with adds. We never reached the 3min mark when everything goes to hell. We even tried using BL at the start of the encounter, although it was a little faster, it didnt seem to do things better.

We see the videos of the kills and they are pretty chill, they never have 2 sieges at the same time, nor too many gorebounds to kill, on my side, if we focused the berseker and then the siege that throw bombs to the raid, we got to 3 gorebounds at 90%HP more or less and another siege was comming.

On some tries the tanks got a lot of stacks of the debuff, our Blood DK even reached 8 before he died, so its not a healing nor tank issue, its a dps issue.

We were told to bring everyone on their single target specs and kill the adds one by one with zero cleave appart from starfall or earthquake or things like that, but we were being overwhelmed by the adds.

Logs arent up yet, i will post them as soon as they are, the raid ilvl was around 703 more or less, with a few normal archi trinkets and a few 4 bonus piece on the dps.

Tanks: Prot Warrior, Blood DK
Healers: Resto Druid + Mistweaver Monk -- Disc Priest + Resto Shaman (Our Holy Pally wasnt on, but he would go in exchange with the monk).
DPS (All on single target spec): 2 Mages, 1 Warrior, 1 Rogue, 2 Hunters, 1 Balance Druid, 1 Destro Warlock, 1 Pally, 2 DK's, 1 Monk, 2 Ele Shaman.

We did some tries before calling it for the night because we couldnt pass the 80% mark and went to do a full clear of normal to complete bonuses plus some good trinkets. Now we dont know if we should go again for M HFA or switch to H Archimonde, thanks in advance for your input!

[Dracodraco]

H archimonde's gear is far superior to HFA; Rather put more attempts into him than spending time on HFA, really.
That said, your post is sort of useless untill we have the logs. Can't tell you what you did wrong without them. Cleave is good though; Combat rogues lose very little singletarget dps by cleaving 24/7, eles are cleave machines even singletarget, arms warr is cleave machine even singletarget, balance druids have starfall 24/7 with the class trinket on single target, DKs spread diseases, destro warlocks are good with havoc etc... Plenty of cleave in there even if they focus on singletarget, really.

It's also not true that you want to 100% singletarget - you want to cleave machines/berserkers when those are up, and cleave casters to 60% *then singletarget nuke casters to 0 before they start casting*. Casters are the only reason in this fight that you wouldn't cleave.

[Concequence]

H archimonde's gear is far superior to HFA; Rather put more attempts into him than spending time on HFA, really.
That said, your post is sort of useless untill we have the logs. Can't tell you what you did wrong without them. Cleave is good though; Combat rogues lose very little singletarget dps by cleaving 24/7, eles are cleave machines even singletarget, arms warr is cleave machine even singletarget, balance druids have starfall 24/7 with the class trinket on single target, DKs spread diseases, destro warlocks are good with havoc etc... Plenty of cleave in there even if they focus on singletarget, really.

It's also not true that you want to 100% singletarget - you want to cleave machines/berserkers when those are up, and cleave casters to 60% *then singletarget nuke casters to 0 before they start casting*. Casters are the only reason in this fight that you wouldn't cleave.

You can BoP the stacks off your DK. You can Dark Simulacrum the AoE fire from the warlocks. Assuming they live long enough to even cast it.

[Deja Thoris]

Post logs, its completely pointless without them unless you want generic stuff like "hit things harder"

[Sorthalis]

The fight has a very sharp "dps hump" to get past, that would be my first point.

The second is that change something each pull if you wipe at the same point consistently. (change cds on tanks, switch talents, change positioning, etc)

[Deleted]

Logs from our first kill yestoday.. Took us 20 trys! Its all about using controlled aoe, and have your raider understand what targets to kill. Have 1 person to call out killing targets on each side. We mainly took down adds , or atleast Hulking Beserkers before the sieges. its SUPER important to save BL for the 3 min mark, where the transporter and all that spawns. After that its the same shit over, killing adds in the correct order. At some point (+7min) you get overwhelmed by adds, and you just kill the 2 sieges that comes and its completed. People really need to pay atention when the felcasters gets sub 50 %

Linking out angry assignments if it can help you!

DPS PRIO : Under 50% Felcaster / Hulking Berseker / Active Tank
Over 50% Felcaster / Contracted Engi / Iron Dragon

DPS PRIO 3 MIN (use bl here) : Crusher > Transporter > U'Rogg > Grute

Remember to BoP Tanks, since the tank damage can be quite high when they reach to many stacks. Clearing stack on the tanks before the 2 mini bosses comes is a really good idea aswell.

Keep changing group until it seems controlled.

- - - Updated - - -

But link some logs, then we can find the issues for you most likely!


Logs from our kill > https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...tJk3b#fight=21

[Deleted]

just wait for the rings lol than you will 1 shot all bosses

[Lobialkon]

Thank you all for your answers. Sadly, the officer recording the logs says that the mythic wipes dont show up, maybe they got replaced by the normal run we did after the wipes, we are trying to see if there is a way to get those logs up, as soon as they are, i will gladly post them.

We didnt try with people focusing more on aoe, we were told it was a single target fight and we read everywhere the same thing so we followed that advise, guess we got it wrong, we will try with a better focus on aoe and burn down the adds that become a priority.

Thanks kinky for the aa, will sure link it during raid so everyone remembers what the priority is!

[Genju]

I doubt that a raid that has massive problem with mythic hellfire assault will stand a chance at archimonde heroic.
HFA ist 10 times easier.

[ddsad2212]

Not sure why guilds are going mythic honestly. We're a pretty average guild. only killed mannorth yesterday and already got to 20% on Archmonde with our biggest issues been phase 1 dps which will be fixed on reset gear. I can see it been a harder fight but it gives better gear so I cannot understand leaving it really

That been said the fact only 600 guilds killed it makes me think the last 15% of phase 3 must be far far harder then on normal but I just don't see it if you have 2 people competent enough to drag the adds away (which I know at least 3 people not in the portal group can do)

[Deleted]

This is a DPS race moreso than Archimonde for the most part at least early on in the fight and during the transport/crusher phase. The fight gets progressively more difficult if your dps falls short a bit, its like trying to stay on a treadmill that's going too fast, eventually you just get overwhelmed.

In general, you want some cleave but not much, preferably 1 hunter on each side to manage the ammo and good single-target/target switching DPS. Passive cleave is good but there should only be 1-2 dedicated AoE.

Furthermore, you need to split the DPS between each side according to what adds are most common there. An example is Spriests being assigned to the left side group due to the higher spawnrate of felcasters and engineers rather than dragoons.

[Gaarashatan]

hfa or archy is a dps race. you have to pull tight numbers unless you did split runs to down them this early.

[Pearl1717]

That been said the fact only 600 guilds killed it makes me think the last 15% of phase 3 must be far far harder then on normal but I just don't see it if you have 2 people competent enough to drag the adds away (which I know at least 3 people not in the portal group can do)

Basically. The fight doesn't even start to get hard until sub 20%. From a healing perspective, you just get overwhelmed at sub 20% with constant wrought, chains, infernals, demonic feedback etc, all back to back to back. Its a lot going on. Not to mention dps have to prioritize the correct targets while paying attention to where they are and what they're doing more so than any other phase. Its just a complete clusterfuck.

On normal you can just zerg through it no problem, but no so much on heroic, at least not yet.

Either way, guilds should do H Archi before M HFA because the gear you get from archimonde is much better than the gear off the first 4 mythic bosses.

[Totaltotemic]

Either way, guilds should do H Archi before M HFA because the gear you get from archimonde is much better than the gear off the first 4 mythic bosses.

You can also get more gear because you can bring your entire roster which is upwards of 24-25 for most Mythic guilds. Of course, anyone that can kill HFA can kill Reaver too fairly quickly so that's not terribly important.

That said, the biggest thing that helps on HFA is to have one person on each side that understands the fight very well using a keybind to put a marker on the mob to be killed. Everyone else just cleaves focusing on the marked target and follows the bouncing marker around. You also never ever want to switch targets. If you pick a target to kill, you go hard until that target dies otherwise you just leave a threat sitting at 20-30% health instead of actually being dead.

[Tojara]

HFA is easier, but you still kinda need a plan unless you massively out gear it. The gear from it is also pretty fucking terrible, unless you get lucky and get ranged weapons for your hunters from it. Archimonde on the otherhand offers trinkets, caster weapons for all, and generally just better itemized stuff at equal iLvL. Literally the only hard part of Archimonde is the last 25%.

It's just about single target damage honestly, and killing the right adds at the right time. The hardest part (IMO) is transitioning from the first 2 1/2 minutes cleanly to the the middle 2 minutes. If you get past the middle part with lots of sieges and mini bosses with pretty much the entire raid alive, you will win. The last half of the fight is literally kill a couple priority adds, ignoring the rest and just nuking siege things down.

One of the biggest things to keep in mind on HFA is that the Felcasters really don't need to die. You can literally have a shitload of them up as long as you don't push them below 50%. Having one below 50% is pretty much like having 4 of the normal ones up at a time, and having them transform when there are berserkers or siege things up is really bad. For berserkers you either have to kill them really quick, or BoP the stacks off when they reach 4-5. At the end of the fight, around the 6:30 to 7:00 minute mark you basically won't be able to keep up with adds anymore so it's more about running around tagging stuff and making sure it doesn't hit the canons.

[Lobialkon]

So, last night we gave it one more chance with some of the feedback you gave us, sadly, one of our tanks was having problems with his internet and kept on disconnecting on a lot of the tries. Luckily, we have the logs from last night for you guys to check out.

FWLX3AM4zbKxwaPV (I cant post links, so thats the code that goes after the /reports)

We reached the 3min mark when everything goes to hell but we couldnt go beyond it as it turned to be quite messy and we had tanks still up on both sides to focus on the center, so the siege with the drill on the front reached the right cannon and we wiped.

[Smartblonde]

As with all end bosses on heroic, the first mythic boss is always easier. Numbers don't lie friends.....

[Maxweii]

As with all end bosses on heroic, the first mythic boss is always easier. Numbers don't lie friends.....

Yeah but in this case the gear from H Arch will do your guild better seeing as it's generally better as well as having the class trinkets (which for some classes are big jumps in damage)

[Tehterokkar]

As with all end bosses on heroic, the first mythic boss is always easier. Numbers don't lie friends.....

Heroic Archimonde is about execution, Mythic HFA is about numbers. Reaver is far easier than HFA too(you can only die if you stand in fire literally).