Question about the rotation for Marks

[Xenosanta]

I understand the shot priority (Or at least I think I do) but I feel like I'm messing it up badly because my dps is terrible for my ilevel. Do any other hunters have any suggestions about cleaning it up? Is there some kind of timing with a 2.3 second cast, how do you handle Thrill procs, how many Steady Shots should be used before using Aimed Shot and do we hold off on Aimed Shot if Chim Shot is 1 sec from coming off CD? Right now it's frustrating me and I need some outside input. Thank you.

[Azortharion]

You gotta think a few seconds ahead, know your cast times and fill the gap between Chimaeras with as many shots as possible in the most perfect order as possible (that is to say, not delaying the CS because you spent too much focus, but not find yourself doing nothing either).

There are no "rules" to -how- you do it, there are only rules for what you must/must not do, in this rough priority:

1) Don't stop casting.
2) Don't delay CS.
3) Don't cap focus.

If whatever you are doing breaks any of those rules, you're doing it wrong. There are a billion ways to follow them, however.

[NoClueWhatToDo]

I recently watched Paragon's Mannorth kill and gained some good knowledge on how the top hunters are doing their rotations. Perhaps the rotation said hunter was doing only works with 4P, but it helped me gain 3K to 4K DPS (No 4P yet) I would recommend watching videos of top hunters. Because you can sit there and tell me how I should do something, but for me personally, I need to see it in action to fully understand.

Speaking of which, Azor. You should totally do short videos to give examples of what the rotations should look like and put them in your guide.

[Azortharion]

Maybe a hunter guide that goes into play.

[NoClueWhatToDo]

Maybe a hunter guide that goes into play.

It might help people if they can visually see the rotation in action. Plus, that youtube money you can get from monetizing the videos.

[vaald]

Im still fairly new to the hutner myself jus rerolling in MoP but i feel as i have come along way from then due to the work you have put in went from doing ok to now pursuing a mythic level guild. lol, but where does barrage fit into our opener? im assuming CS>aimed>barrage? then rapid fire after that?? any help would be apprecaited and thanks azor.

[Xenosanta]

Thanks Azor, my friend who also plays hunter says the same things. And I've been trying it. But I'm still doing 40ish thousand dps w/ 702 ilevel. I feel like I'm always casting something and CS is being used as often as possible. I may be delaying it by accident w/o realizing cause it's a 9 second cooldown and I'm used to 6 second Explo Shot or Kill Command cooldowns. I'll try and set up a weakauras for Chim Shot and get back to it. Thanks again for replying tho, I really appreciate having an in depth, up to date guide instead of scavenging EJ forums or asking around in WoW official forums.

[Spl4sh3r]

You gotta think a few seconds ahead, know your cast times and fill the gap between Chimaeras with as many shots as possible in the most perfect order as possible (that is to say, not delaying the CS because you spent too much focus, but not find yourself doing nothing either).

There are no "rules" to -how- you do it, there are only rules for what you must/must not do, in this rough priority:

1) Don't stop casting.
2) Don't delay CS.
3) Don't cap focus.

If whatever you are doing breaks any of those rules, you're doing it wrong. There are a billion ways to follow them, however.

By number 1 I am guessing you mean not to interrupt a cast you already started? Or are you saying we should delay CS if we are not casting anything before CS comes off cooldown? SInce otherwise those rules makes no sense since they can all go against eachother. An example would be you used Steady Shot to gain some Focus to use more Aimed Shot and you then cast Aimed Shot with Thrill active, you hit 100 Focus for some reason then Chimaera is about to come off CD but you aren't casting anything so you have to cast another Aimed Shot (which would delay CS even more and might cap focus with Thrill active) or you cast Steady Shot (which will cap focus but less delay on CS).

[Azortharion]

Well, since they are in a rough priority, "don't stop casting" being above being above "don't delay CS" kinda means that you wouldn't stop a cast if CS came up during the middle of it.

Looking at them both together, though, it's okay to use one's own brain and make out that you wouldn't start casting Steady Shot if CS is just 0.5s from coming off cooldown (unless you need the focus for a Barrage coming right after, or something).

In the scenario you put up, in order to be at 100 focus after casting an Aimed Shot, you would have to be at focus cap when the Steady Shot cast preceding it ended, meaning you broke rule 3 already.

Also, you realize that an Aimed Shot cast literally cannot cap your focus, it can only -spend- focus, not generate it. It costs 30 with ToTH, generates 20 if it crits. Do the math.

If CS is coming up and you have so much focus that a Steady would cap you, then you'd AiS into CS since that's 85 out of your ~100 focus spent with little to no delay.

I get the basic sentiment of "both choices are wrong" in some cases. That's where the priority comes in, e.g. you'd rather cap focus than delay CS more than necessary. It just so happens that the Steady Shot choice would be the one to break both, while Aimed would only break one of them (in a severe fashion), by potentially starving you. That's how on-the-fly decision making comes into play. Believe it or not, I cannot make a guide that considers every specific rotational scenario. Or I could, but that'd take a while..

[Tekslol]

Well, since they are in a rough priority, "don't stop casting" being above being above "don't delay CS" kinda means that you wouldn't stop a cast if CS came up during the middle of it.

Looking at them both together, though, it's okay to use one's own brain and make out that you wouldn't start casting Steady Shot if CS is just 0.5s from coming off cooldown (unless you need the focus for a Barrage coming right after, or something).

In the scenario you put up, in order to be at 100 focus after casting an Aimed Shot, you would have to be at focus cap when the Steady Shot cast preceding it ended, meaning you broke rule 3 already.

Also, you realize that an Aimed Shot cast literally cannot cap your focus, it can only -spend- focus, not generate it. It costs 30 with ToTH, generates 20 if it crits. Do the math.

If CS is coming up and you have so much focus that a Steady would cap you, then you'd AiS into CS since that's 85 out of your ~100 focus spent with little to no delay.

I get the basic sentiment of "both choices are wrong" in some cases. That's where the priority comes in, e.g. you'd rather cap focus than delay CS more than necessary. It just so happens that the Steady Shot choice would be the one to break both, while Aimed would only break one of them (in a severe fashion), by potentially starving you. That's how on-the-fly decision making comes into play. Believe it or not, I cannot make a guide that considers every specific rotational scenario. Or I could, but that'd take a while..

Maybe a guide for simcraft so we can see how the math all works out and also so that we can answer these questions about specific rotational questions ourselves?

[Azortharion]

You can't sim something like that.

[Tekslol]

You can't sim something like that.

How do we figure out the answers to such things?

[Spl4sh3r]

In the scenario you put up, in order to be at 100 focus after casting an Aimed Shot, you would have to be at focus cap when the Steady Shot cast preceding it ended, meaning you broke rule 3 already.

I had T17 in my mind while I wrote it, some might still be unlucky with T18 4set. So with 2set T17 you get 28 focus on an Aimed Shot crit and since it takes 2.3 seconds or so to cast it you will gain some focus during the cast so it goes above the 30 focus it costs to cast with Thrill active.