Most mythic restos use Seed/DP. Why no Unstable Fel Emulsion anymore?

[Intricate]

All the 730+ restos I armory are using Seed/DP for their mythic progression, next to none are using the Unstable Fel Emulsion anymore (AKA the leech trinket)

Are the numbers really better with that setup? Leech accounted for 10% of my total heals last pull (M-Reaver @warcraftlogs) Has the leech effect just been overhyped or drop off at higher levels?

Since I can't seem to find hardly any restos that use it anymore I've gotta assume everyone knows something I don't

[Koor]

On the contrary, with all the valor upgrades leech is stronger than ever, since it scales both with your ilvl, and with the dps ilvl. Unless your raid has a very low dps, using the leech trinket would amount to more healing.

If you're looking at top ranked resto druids on warcraftlogs to find the armory links to compare gear with, you're not likely to see much use of the leech trinket, since leech healing is attributed to the entire raid rather than the healer with the trinket. Therefore not using the leech trinket is kind of necessary to rank those days (along with running with few healers, having high dps for short encounter length, etc).

[Tiberria]

It's primarily because most of the people you are armorying are probably done with progression, and the fact that the Leech trinket doesn't attribute as healing on WCL just sucks the fun out of having it equipped when you can have 10-20% higher numbers by using the class trinket.

I used the Leech trinket through all progression (except used Felspark over Leech on Velhari), but have switched to just using Seed full time now that every thing is on farm and it doesn't really matter. If I was going to try solo healing fights, I would probably switch back to Leech. Part of it too is that I got a Mythic Seed on the first Archi kill, but never managed to get a Mythic Leech trinket until just this past week. The difference between the heroic Leech trinket and upgraded Mythic seed in terms of actual healing is probably fairly minimal.

And, yes, if you are looking at top rankings or percentiles, you absolutely will not see any Resto Druids using the Leech trinket. You are essentially reducing your overall effective healing on logs by upwards of 20% if you don't equip Seed. It's probably a stretch to even get about 50th percentile if you give that much of a head start to Seed users.

They really should have fixed WCL to show Leech trinket healing months ago. Ask Mr. Robot logs apparently attributes it properly, so I have never understood why WCL couldn't have done it.

[Adramelch]

They really should have fixed WCL to show Leech trinket healing months ago. Ask Mr. Robot logs apparently attributes it properly, so I have never understood why WCL couldn't have done it.

I'm pretty sure it's been shown that there's no accurate way to properly calculate the amount of leech owed to each person's trinket and distribute the healing accordingly. Afaik, AMR and everything else there is out there (addons, WAs) give you an approximate estimation. If memory serves me well, the WCL creator explicitly said that they don't want to have something approximate that's not based on actual combat log stuff. Whether or not you agree witht that stance (I reckon I'd prefer it if they did, given that the approximation itself is not that bad) is another thing.

[Tiberria]

I'm pretty sure it's been shown that there's no accurate way to properly calculate the amount of leech owed to each person's trinket and distribute the healing accordingly. Afaik, AMR and everything else there is out there (addons, WAs) give you an approximate estimation. If memory serves me well, the WCL creator explicitly said that they don't want to have something approximate that's not based on actual combat log stuff. Whether or not you agree witht that stance (I reckon I'd prefer it if they did, given that the approximation itself is not that bad) is another thing.

Yeah, I basically disagree with that stance, because even though using an approximation isn't ideal, leaving it out completely makes a complete mockery of healing rankings/percentiles/logs for the entire tier, since everything is vastly skewed by that trinket.

[Intricate]

They really should have fixed WCL to show Leech trinket healing months ago. Ask Mr. Robot logs apparently attributes it properly, so I have never understood why WCL couldn't have done it.

AMR claims to be able to account for it and WCL claims they don't and won't but in my logs they both seem to be reporting nearly the same amount of leech...

for example-
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ability=143924
http://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/combat...,d=1,c=14,s=16


and both of these numbers arnt close to what the Skada addon/Weak aura are reporting.

[Orionid]

The sole and only reason you see SoC over UFE on logs is because we're all filthy padders looking to rank. UFE's leech healing doesn't contribute to your numbers as the healer in logs. It's still one of the best progression trinkets. But for all high end raiders, progression has been over for quite some time.

[Nerxyrall]

I used the Leech trinket through all progression (except used Felspark over Leech on Velhari), but have switched to just using Seed full time now that every thing is on farm and it doesn't really matter. If I was going to try solo healing fights, I would probably switch back to Leech. Part of it too is that I got a Mythic Seed on the first Archi kill, but never managed to get a Mythic Leech trinket until just this past week. The difference between the heroic Leech trinket and upgraded Mythic seed in terms of actual healing is probably fairly minimal.

Why did you use Felspark on Velhari?
Its more than once i heard that people dont use Leech there, but i honestly dont know the reason.
Doesnt leech work properly in p2 or something like that?

sorry for a little off topic

[Tiberria]

Why did you use Felspark on Velhari?
Its more than once i heard that people dont use Leech there, but i honestly dont know the reason.
Doesnt leech work properly in p2 or something like that?

sorry for a little off topic

Neither Leech or Seed appear to work properly on Velhari, and generally give <7% total throughput contribution, whereas they would both do 15%+ on any other fight. It could well be that P2 doesn't proc either the same way because of the healing debuff - but even P3 Leech/Flourish healing is very low. It's probably better to just use Intuition's Gift or Felspark (or possibly even a DPS trinket) for that fight for the raw stats boost. Even if the reason why Leech/Flourish healing is so low is because the P2 debuff inflates all other healing sources, there realistically isn't very much to heal in P1 or P3 that Leech would be overly useful for.

[Koor]

Neither Leech or Seed appear to work properly on Velhari, and generally give <7% total throughput contribution, whereas they would both do 15%+ on any other fight. It could well be that P2 doesn't proc either the same way because of the healing debuff - but even P3 Leech/Flourish healing is very low. It's probably better to just use Intuition's Gift or Felspark (or possibly even a DPS trinket) for that fight for the raw stats boost. Even if the reason why Leech/Flourish healing is so low is because the P2 debuff inflates all other healing sources, there realistically isn't very much to heal in P1 or P3 that Leech would be overly useful for.

I believe that some of the weakauras used to track leech contribution are broken on Velhari. The leech trinket is amazing for Velhari, the real contribution is significantly higher than 7% (probably 20-30%). Warcraftlogs leech tracking shows significant different numbers on that encounter which make much more sense given aura of malice boosts dps and leech increases with more dps.

[Zoopercat]

Hey, I'm from Ask Mr. Robot. We wrote a bunch of code to figure out who the leech belongs to. First we determine how much leech each player has (it's accurate if someone has our addon), and who has the trinket. Then we look at event timing along with a few other factors. It was a pretty big pain in the arse. It's technically an estimation, since the logs don't tell you who it belongs to, but we're pretty confident it is very close to actual.

Hope that helps!

[Intricate]

Hey, I'm from Ask Mr. Robot. We wrote a bunch of code to figure out who the leech belongs to. First we determine how much leech each player has (it's accurate if someone has our addon)

So to get the proper leech numbers uploaded to AMR whats the exact process?

Does everyone in the entire run need to have the addon installed?
What if just the healers had the addon installed?
Do I have to be logging through the AMR addon specifically?

Thanks for the help! Ive read about how tricky these leech numbers are to properly determine, if this is the only way so be it.

[Zoopercat]

Ideally, everyone has the addon because we know how much leech everyone has on their gear (even if they don't have the trinket). That helps us make the most accurate calculation. But if JUST the people with the leech trinket have the addon, that would be pretty darn close to the right answer. Then, whoever is uploading logs to AskMrRobot would also want to have the addon. And that's it!

The addon collects the exact gear, talents and glyphs of everyone in the raid (who also has the addon), at the start of every pull. That makes the logs powerful for comparison purposes, because you can verify every thing about that character. As a side note, this info will be included in logs for Legion so you won't have to rely on our addon for that. Yay! It also means WCL can add gear information too (he's already got that stubbed in for legion, but doesn't have it for the current tier since it requires an addon to collect it this tier).