[HOLY] Holy Sh*t!: Legion Edition

[MCC]

Just got my Velen's Future Sight. Looks moderately useful, especially when paired with other cooldowns. Probably more useful than the shoulders.

What's the consensus regarding this trinket?

[Azsune]

Just got my Velen's Future Sight. Looks moderately useful, especially when paired with other cooldowns. Probably more useful than the shoulders.

What's the consensus regarding this trinket?

I want to try it out. Heard some of the top mythic raiding paladins were wearing it but I do not have one to even try out. Considering how much over healing we do when we pop things like wings and how short the cooldown is. I kinda think for things like Aura of Sac(On fights it works with) it might be a bit ridiculous.

[trm90]

Velen's is a top tier trinket, mostly because it's a very beastly stat stick - a lot of our BiS trinkets are low ilvl or difficult to find, and finding the ideal stat sticks (Arcanocrystals/Charms, WF/TF versions, etc) in the usual PvE content is very difficult. The on-use effect is just the icing on the cake really.

Personally, unless on-use/proc trinkets turn out to perform really well in M NH or get buffed even further, I would permanently equip Velen's for the rest of the expac.

[Staalsy]

Just got my Velen's Future Sight. Looks moderately useful, especially when paired with other cooldowns. Probably more useful than the shoulders.

What's the consensus regarding this trinket?

Not better than the shoulders, about equal to the ring. Shoulders will forever be the best legendary

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[fangless]

Just got my Velen's Future Sight. Looks moderately useful, especially when paired with other cooldowns. Probably more useful than the shoulders.

What's the consensus regarding this trinket?

Compared to other trinkets, it's like a good 30k-40k dps higher, assuming what other ones you have now are solid. If they're shitty trinkets, it could be more. It's hard to compare to other legendaries, like the shoulders are dependent on the damage you take and how much the other healers heal you + how much of that is overheal on the beacon.

General consensus is that the trinket/shoulders/pryz are all A Tier, with the judge ring being S tier, and then belt/cloak B tier. The leftover ones then being C.

[EzG]

The trinket is a good 30-40k hps above the others when used properly. On high damage fights with no overhealing you may be losing out on a good amount of effectiveness but the % increase should hold up. I don't personally have it but my current legendaries are ilterendi and prydaz which are a fantastic combo for progression.

@MCC in regards to your shoulders/trinket and which being better I suppose that depends on your other legendaries plus damage you are taking in favor of those shoulder's and overall raid damage.

[MCC]

The trinket is a good 30-40k hps above the others when used properly. On high damage fights with no overhealing you may be losing out on a good amount of effectiveness but the % increase should hold up. I don't personally have it but my current legendaries are ilterendi and prydaz which are a fantastic combo for progression.

@MCC in regards to your shoulders/trinket and which being better I suppose that depends on your other legendaries plus damage you are taking in favor of those shoulder's and overall raid damage.

Well, here's the interesting thing. My shoulders do about 6-7% of my total healing on every fight regardless of damage patterns. My attempts to increase it by taking damage on purpose at strategic moments were unsuccessful: it's still 6-7%. The good news is that I do have a good idea how much healing I'll be giving up if I choose to replace my shoulders.

The question becomes this: is a non-legendary trinket + shoulders better than Velen's + non-legendary shoulders? My trinkets are basically stat sticks; a low-level Unstable Arcanocrystal and a 880 haste trinket from Helya. I imagine I would be replacing the Arcanocrystal. A quick comparison of my stats before and after the change and a bit of napkin math, and it looks like my raw throughput will increase by about 0.5%.

This means the on-use effect on the trinket must do at least 6-7% of my healing to match the shoulders. Is that likely? I am not sure, but my gut feeling tells me it is not. Used on cooldown, this trinket increases my healing by 2%. That means I will have to use it together with other cooldowns. Maybe I'll get good mileage out of it by using it together with AM+Sac. Not sure about that, either; the mechanics of the trinket are actually at odds with our mastery when used with AM+Sac.

I guess I'll try and see how well it works, but it doesn't look promising.

[Taeldorian]

Quick question regarding aura of sac.

Do you guys pop it before the big damage actually comes out or do you pop it as soon as it hits everyone? Just curious.

[MCC]

Quick question regarding aura of sac.

Do you guys pop it before the big damage actually comes out or do you pop it as soon as it hits everyone? Just curious.

You never use it before damage. If the damage comes in one big chunk, you use it after damage is done. If the damage comes in multiple smaller chunks, you use it as soon as the raid's health is low enough for your spells to start doing some real healing.

Which should have been obvious if you had spent more than two seconds thinking about it.

[Staalsy]

AoS is a reactive raid cool down. AoD is proactive. AoM, isn't to be treated like a raid cd imo. It's healing is more akin to a shamans ancestral guidance.

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[Deleted]

We started to count AoM as a raid cooldown. It is bit slower than Tranq but with LoD, prism and fast heals it serves very well.

[Hawg]

You never use it before damage. If the damage comes in one big chunk, you use it after damage is done. If the damage comes in multiple smaller chunks, you use it as soon as the raid's health is low enough for your spells to start doing some real healing.

Which should have been obvious if you had spent more than two seconds thinking about it.

If you had ended your response without the last sentence it would have been a helpful reply and you would have looked like a valuable forum contributor. Not sure why you felt the need to turn into an ass instead.

But to respond to Taeldorian's question: If you know big damage is about to come, and you really want to max Aura of Sac, then you could try something like this: pre-cast rule of law, then Tyr's Deliverance, then Bestow faith, then avenging wrath, aura of aura mastery, LoD, HS, FoL - If you time that right you'd get 15% of the BF, LoD, HS, and FoL transferred to the entire raid, which with crits should heal any raid from zero to full.

[Taeldorian]

If you had ended your response without the last sentence it would have been a helpful reply and you would have looked like a valuable forum contributor. Not sure why you felt the need to turn into an ass instead.

But to respond to Taeldorian's question: If you know big damage is about to come, and you really want to max Aura of Sac, then you could try something like this: pre-cast rule of law, then Tyr's Deliverance, then Bestow faith, then avenging wrath, aura of aura mastery, LoD, HS, FoL - If you time that right you'd get 15% of the BF, LoD, HS, and FoL transferred to the entire raid, which with crits should heal any raid from zero to full.

Thanks for the reply mate.

That's what I've been doing but I wanted to double check to make sure it was correct.

[Deleted]

I have a question about legendary. I have bis Ring, gloves and today won wristy for holy paladin. I wonder if you wear gloves or wrist. I have 48.86% crit, wants to bring the time when I have 100% holy crit shock, I currently have 90%.

[MCC]

I have a question about legendary. I have bis Ring, gloves and today won wristy for holy paladin. I wonder if you wear gloves or wrist. I have 48.86% crit, wants to bring the time when I have 100% holy crit shock, I currently have 90%.

Arguments for the bracer:

Gives you an efficient tank heal on a 20-ish second long cooldown (as long as you don't need BoF for anything else).
Does not restrict your T19 piece choice.

Arguments for the gloves:

More frequent access to your OH SH*T TANK IS ABOUT TO DIE button is potentially useful during progression (if you are quick about using LoH).
Higher stat budget compared to the wrist.

My personal preference would be the gloves.

As far as your crit goes, keep in mind that you'll eventually get 4pc T19, which gives you a soft cap of 45% crit.

[Ponky]

Guys, I have a dilemma.

I got Velen's Future Sight today and I am definitely equipping that, but now I have to choose which one to unequip - shoulders or neck? If I look at my logs, the neck is double the healing of the shoulders for me. But everyone here says that shoulders are better?
I tried both ways, playing with BoF to get shoulder off-heal on both tanks and with BoL to pump everything in one tank but in any way, neck is still superior in terms of healing numbers.

[Harbour]

Guys, im slightly confused about the target for healing when i use AoS+Aura Mastery. Should i focus heal on myself to keep my health on 100% or passive heal from other healers would be enough and i should focus heal tank instead?

[Staalsy]

Guys, im slightly confused about the target for healing when i use AoS+Aura Mastery. Should i focus heal on myself to keep my health on 100% or passive heal from other healers would be enough and i should focus heal tank instead?

I'm not sure I understand the question.

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[EzG]

Guys, im slightly confused about the target for healing when i use AoS+Aura Mastery. Should i focus heal on myself to keep my health on 100% or passive heal from other healers would be enough and i should focus heal tank instead?

The idea behind AoS isnt really keeping yourself above the threshold of health. But to do enough EFFECTIVE healing to snapshot to the rest of the raid. AoS will not heal the raid with overheals. You need to pick a target(s) that is taking damage and that you can get large heals off on during the 8 seconds of AM.

[MCC]

Guys, I have a dilemma.

I got Velen's Future Sight today and I am definitely equipping that, but now I have to choose which one to unequip - shoulders or neck? If I look at my logs, the neck is double the healing of the shoulders for me. But everyone here says that shoulders are better?
I tried both ways, playing with BoF to get shoulder off-heal on both tanks and with BoL to pump everything in one tank but in any way, neck is still superior in terms of healing numbers.

Simple. You use the shoulders and the neck. The trinket is garbage.

- - - Updated - - -

Guys, im slightly confused about the target for healing when i use AoS+Aura Mastery. Should i focus heal on myself to keep my health on 100% or passive heal from other healers would be enough and i should focus heal tank instead?

You heal the target that will produce the most effective healing. You are obviously the best target if your health is low enough. If not, pick someone else near you (to take advantage of your mastery) and heal them. Their role doesn't matter; you are simply concentrating on maximizing your effective healing.