Why do mage movement should be restricted?

[Deleted]

1) I also play a warrior (casually but still...). Is rage management still a BIG DEAL nowadays? Guess what.... AND, do not ever compare resources to circle of stupidity. I for one would love if mana management was more engaging (give us power boosts at cost of mana and ways to regenerate mana, like locks are getting ). But do not ever compare some BS reticle on the ground to rage or any resource.

RoP is one of the mage tools in Blizzards fantasy of easy to learn hard to master. As mage you have no ressource to manage. So we got movement. If you dont like it dont play it but its a tool of class diversity.

2) As for lock's, this is not true. As a lock I could, for instance, stay 2x ou 3x more time on BH's balcony even if someone screwed smash. On the contrary, mages are only superior when it comes to big hits - and due to IB and GI* (GI is gone, IB is going to be a talent... so....)

Speaking about Blackhand ask a WL how much massive debris he could soak in the last phase. Every class has its pro and cons and thats totally fine.

Also I liked how you ignored sacrificial pact and SL. Good job!

*I'm not going to search right now but always thought GI was too powerful, borderline OP.

I was never ignoring anything. The question was about selfheal. Ofc WL has some sort of dmg-mitigationcds and thats totally fine. That they are weaker and lesser in number is maybe another side which you are ignoring.

[Fennixx]

RoP is one of the mage tools in Blizzards fantasy of easy to learn hard to master. As mage you have no ressource to manage. So we got movement. If you dont like it dont play it but its a tool of class diversity.



Speaking about Blackhand ask a WL how much massive debris he could soak in the last phase. Every class has its pro and cons and thats totally fine.


I was never ignoring anything. The question was about selfheal. Ofc WL has some sort of dmg-mitigationcds and thats totally fine. That they are weaker and lesser in number is maybe another side which you are ignoring.

Like I said, Mages are vastly superior when it comes to big hits, but you cannot argue defensive kit is way superior compared to other pures (its not).

As for BH, P3 was never a issue to my guild. Most wipes did happen in p2 (and then we got 3 rogues and 3 hunters for first kill).

[Deleted]

Because they want casters to cast and not be basically melee with range advantage over standard melee.

Also a lot of CCs are getting theirs CDs increased like from 30s CD to 60s CD and there are also less breakers.

[Ulsaki]

Blizzard: "We are removing these things we don't think are fun"
Players: "WTF? We liked this"


Players: "FOR THE LOVE OF GOD REMOVE RUNE OF POWER AND INCANTER'S FLOW! WE HATE IT!"
Blizzard: "These are fun talents. If you don't like them, use the other one"

Personally I think it's the brainchild of one of the dev's daughters or something.

[Deleted]

...but you cannot argue defensive kit is way superior compared to other pures (its not).

Did I? Ofc our defensive kit shouldn't be (and is not) superior compared to other pures. Thats a thing called balancing. We have our niche, they have theirs. So i again dont see your problem.

As for BH, P3 was never a issue to my guild. Most wipes did happen in p2 (and then we got 3 rogues and 3 hunters for first kill).

And guilds with 3 boomkins didnt have problems with balconies. Again i dont see your problem. All you claim are that specific things are bad in specific situations. But this is totally fine. If everyone is good at everything the game would be very boring.

[Deleted]

I saw all discution on Rune of Powe, it even reach the front page of reddit /wow. There is discussion about the new level 15 talent, especially Bone Chilling who increase damage based on how much we reduce our movement. An interresting design, not sure it can work in game.

But the question remains : why restricting movement?

If I remember correctly, it all start in end of Cata or early MoP when mage was a lot more mobil with instant spell, cast while moving and effect like that. Mage wasn't as mobil ss hunter are, but not far behind.

Since then there's talent that increase mobility at level 15 and talent that restrict it at level 90.
The idea : damage buff should come at the price of mobility: Invocation and RoP.

Then it was WoD rework where the deal was more randomness or less movement. Always this cost idea.

And now, in early alpha of Legion, we see the mobility restrive talent (rune of power) on the same row than the mobility improving talent. The cost idea is still here, even more openly.
But Legion gameplay isn't that much mobile:
- more cast time to make haste value more
- less proc and instant to make room for new talent/trait/perk.

The main question is : why do mage have to trade mobility for power? Why did they have to restrict themself?

Because thats the only downside of playing a caster? With better understanding of fight mechanics and better placement is how you win damage meters as a ranged character.

People always bring in hunters but they are accounted for this by being a little bit under a top performing mage, warlock and so forth in end game raiding.

MM hunters also have sniper training.

[Orrin]

Because thats the only downside of playing a caster? With better understanding of fight mechanics and better placement is how you win damage meters as a ranged character.

People always bring in hunters but they are accounted for this by being a little bit under a top performing mage, warlock and so forth in end game raiding.

MM hunters also have sniper training.

Problem is casting is already the thing that stops you from moving. If you move, you either use instant casts and instant cast procs or lose damage. You don't need RoP for it.
Why restrict movement further with a talent that creates an illusion that you do more damage while it actually make you jump through additional hoops to do as much damage as all other casters do?

[Deleted]

....Why restrict movement further with a talent that creates an illusion that you do more damage while it actually make you jump through additional hoops to do as much damage as all other casters do?

Where is this thing coming from? Every single class in this game has something to care about. And to set this into the right context: We are not speaking about 15% dmg. If u dont like RoP take IF. You have nothing to care about. And all you loose are 2-3%.
This last few % can be found in nearly every spec.
Easy to learn, hard to master.
RoP vs IF is imo a perfect way to describe this mantra. Take the passive and stay fine or take the active, manage it and get rewarded.

[gallamann]

Very stupid questions as answer:
Was da Vinci running around while painting the Mona Lisa?
Did Einstein run around while calculating time and space?.

I like to think Da Vinci was scoring some serious ass, with all that talent women should have been flocking to bed him. Hell Mona Lisa may look like that cause she just gave him head and swallowed

Einstein, well there are loads of pictures with his hair everywhere... in fact looks like he just had wild sex with three chicks at once in most of them!

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You have Blink, Cauterize/Ice Block/Shimmer, and Ice Barrier. If you can't survive in a raid with three of those spells, you probably shouldn't be raiding to begin with.

Let's tackle these!

Blink pretty much makes Cauterize/Ice Block/Shimmer useless. Sure you may get a boss that Cauterize will cheese a mechanic. Shit happens on your location you are moving regardless of Blink being up (aka I see no value to Shimmer in raids), Ice Block I currently don't have since I spec Evanance, if you have it it wastes time you could be casting. Cauterize, half the time you die anyway cause your healers didn't realize it procced and normal paper cuts take ya out and lets face it Cauterize procc'd because you already exhausted all other tricks (or you suck at raid awareness).

So Blink and Ice Barrier, big fan. After that Greater Invis currently, not sure it survives in Legion.

[Orrin]

So the main question about RoP is: is there any other talent for any other class that influences damage output, dictates the theme of it's talent row and is passionately hated by the part of it's class community?

[Polarthief]

So the main question about RoP is: is there any other talent for any other class that influences damage output, dictates the theme of it's talent row and is passionately hated by the part of it's class community?

Ooh I know the answer! "Abso-fuckin'-lutely not"!

[Orrin]

Well, this is the answer for "why it's bad talent".
Another good question would be "How loud outcry would be if RoP was removed?". I would say as loud as whispers go

[Polarthief]

Another good question would be "How loud outcry would be if RoP was removed?". I would say as loud as whispers go

Not even that loud.

You know how when something really big happens that people don't like, you'll always get a group of protesters, sometimes massive, to try and get things fixed? Removing RoP has a ridiculously-huge sized crowd around Blizzard HQ while the campaign to bring RoP back would be the random solo guys with a petition that maybe one or two people have signed as "Poopy Buttface".

They (Blizzard) always uses the excuse for "it's better for the majority" when designing things, so I'll never understand why RoP is still here. It's literally there for the extremely microscopic minority of people who actively enjoy and even go as far as defend the talent, and the biggest differences between these is that things like LFD/LFR don't hurt the game while things like RoP causes the entire talent tier to be balanced around it, thus actually hurting Mages. Imagine a whole new set of fun talents we could have in its place, or hell buff my damage by 13% across the board and give me the Polymorph enhancers back in MoP's original beta, or keep L45 talents. I'll GLADLY make a useless decision over one that limits my fun.

[Ironsquidlol]

Well, this is the answer for "why it's bad talent".
Another good question would be "How loud outcry would be if RoP was removed?". I would say as loud as whispers go

Imnick would have words.

[Deleted]

I'm going to miss Invisibility just because I liked going invisible. I enjoyed using it out of raids.

Yes, me too. -.-

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Well, this is the answer for "why it's bad talent".
Another good question would be "How loud outcry would be if RoP was removed?". I would say as loud as whispers go

A very lood cheering, I guess. I would be cheering for sure!