Ninji after raid kick

[silverstarzs]

When did this become 'regular and standard and accepted' practice?

I remember it very occasionally in the past by immature asses.

But last night I was helping people get their moose, and almost every time the raid leader kicked someone, the kickee pulled, and caused a wipe - repairs, food and time wasted.

Seems intensely childish and immature. Each was given (multiple) opportunities and direction/instruction by the RL and they still failed. That's a valuable learning experience they were given. Hopefully they will be better next time. Why hurt other people's evening?

What can Blizzard and the community do to make this unacceptable?

[Phookah]

Nothing. Suck it up and move on pretty much.

[Nefarious Tea]

Two sides to every story. Yes, pulling and causing a wipe is petty, but maybe your raid leader was also being an asshat.

[Deja Thoris]

It's hard to judge.

I've just been helping a friend thru HfC HC on his alt.

He died on Socrethar because the tank turned the boss at the last second so he got smashed. The tank then proceeded to run the construct into ghosts so it almost insta died. My friend who wasn't at fault got kicked. Dumb stuff like this happens all the time in pugs. The root cause of the wipe isn't addressed and people just look at the bottom of recount and try to kick.

I'm not saying it was the case in your group but you get shit leaders and immature asshats. Shit happens.

[Zyky]

Not a SINGLE pug I've been in has had a raid leader that gives direction or instruction multiple times and been a decent/nice human being after a single fuck up. If you want this to be a non-issue for yourself personally, buck up and join a guild.

[silverstarzs]

^^ yea shit happens, we all know that . . . . but then causing a wipe that effects everyone? Even if the kick is undeserved that seems pretty poor behavior.

It seems irrelevant to me if the RL is an asshat himself or not (I dont happen think he was but would feel the same if he was) - take a kick like an adult, like a learning experience, and dont ruin other people's night.

(and I am in 5 guilds atm - that's mostly where I raid - but I do occasionally PUG to help people when there's not a guild thing convenient - that's why I was surprised at this - it was a guildie RLing, not our regular progression RLer but someone pretty good)

[Zyky]

It seems irrelevant to me if the RL is an asshat himself or not (I dont happen think he was but would feel the same if he was) - take a kick like an adult, like a learning experience, and dont ruin other people's night.

How is it a learning experience when you've done nothing wrong to be kicked? lol. You have very flawed logic. I'm not saying its an acceptable action, but the truth is people lash, especially when they're being blamed for something that isn't their fault to begin with, even the oldest of adults lash out. 9 times out of 10, raid leaders are just people there for their own benefit and don't care about the other people in the group, they remove anyone they deem lesser and that's the true problem with group finder, people thinking they're better than others when they're just as terrible.

[NatePsy]

It seems irrelevant to me if the RL is an asshat himself or not (I dont happen think he was but would feel the same if he was) - take a kick like an adult, like a learning experience, and dont ruin other people's night.

So he's allowed to be a dick and kick someone on unfair grounds, yet the person that was kicked can't be a dick because he was kicked unfairly? Double standard much? I don't know what happened in your group, you could be biased towards the leader. Seems to me that the leader acted like a dick and kicked the player for some ridiculous reason.

Being kicked for a unfair reason is not a learning experience, you gain nothing from said experience except for a sour taste in your mouth, which is probably why he acted the way he did and pulled mobs.

[Kyr]

sounds like your raid leader (if not more) was being a total asshole if you had to repeatedly kick people.

[silverstarzs]

How is it a learning experience when you've done nothing wrong to be kicked?

For me, EVERYTHING is a learning experience. In this case they might for instance learn how they might themselves be better RLs if they ever want to try.

But we agree on my basic point - no matter if the RL sucks or not - it is bad childish behavior.

sounds like your raid leader (if not more) was being a total asshole if you had to repeatedly kick people.

We wiped about a dozen times, people were not going in the nether, people with doing under 20k dps. First explaining where those people were failing and then kicking them when they did not improve do not make the RL an asshole (IMHO). BUT AGAIN - IT IS IRRELEVANT IF HE WAS AN ASS OR NOT _ IT IS STUPID AND CHILDISH TO INTENTIONALLY WIPE THE RAID because you were kicked - deserved or not - it is stupid and childish (IMHO).

Well, interesting, some of you want to blame the RLer and don't seem to think causing a Ninji wipe after kick is that persons bad personal responsibility - interesting . . . and disturbing. I dont understand why any of you think it is ok to wreck my (just another guy in the raid) night with intentional ninji wipes. Take your beef up with the RL, if he does not want to listen, suck it up, but why is it acceptable to take it out on the rest of the team?

[Zyky]

But we agree on my basic point - no matter if the RL sucks or not - it is bad childish behavior.

I don't agree with that statement at all. I agree that its childish. I don't agree that the raid leader, or raid group for that matter, shouldn't expect repercussions for being assholes. Haven't you ever heard of Newton's Third Law? For every action there is an equal an and opposite reaction.

[Deleted]

The good part of it is that when they pull you confirm you did the right thing to kick.

- - - Updated - - -

In a sense it's simple, bad players also tend to be foolish enough to do ninja pulls.

It goes together with being bad in performance. It's not surprising.

[nightfalls]

Haven't you ever heard of Newton's Third Law? For every action there is an equal an and opposite reaction.

This.

What is childish is OP's expectation that just because someone is removed from a group, they'll just nicely hearth out. Get a reality check and realize that people react accordingly to actions.

If I'm unfairly kicked from a group I may realize that the group is tense enough that a ninja pull may cause more people to leave or even a group disband, which is (in my view) what the leader would 100% deserve. Thus, a pull may mean justice prevails and comes at no cost to me (since I was already removed), so why not?

[Deleted]

Yes. You are right you should expect a ninja pull. Bad players in performance also tend to have bad attitudes.

[Dequanacus]

OP, the issue isn't that ninja pullers are blameless, it's that you're specifically singling them out when anyone in the game can be an asshole regardless of the position they are in. Why are ninja pullers so special? Because of your personal experiences with them. I could easily make a thread calling raid leaders assholes with a number of reasons.

[Steve French]

Its simple, you fucked with me. Now its my turn to fuck with you. Don't want people to be assholes when you kick them out of your group? Treat them with some respect.

[Deleted]

Treat them with some respect.

Wiping is not respectful to the rest.

[Steve French]

Wiping is not respectful to the rest.

You really think the person that got kicked cares about the rest of the group? Im sure most people that get kicked see the whole group as complicit.

[Deleted]

You really think the person that got kicked cares about the rest of the group?

No I don't. And I don't care about him. We're here to kill bosses, not carry a ninja puller.

[Zyky]

No I don't. And I don't care about him. We're here to kill bosses, not carry a ninja puller.

You're not even aware the person is a ninja puller before he's kicked, so how would you be carrying him?