(US) No Federal Laws Against Terrorist Groups Purchasing Firearms

[Scathbais]

http://www.npr.org/sections/itsallpo...om-buying-guns



https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...m-buying-guns/



You want reasonable gun control solutions? Here's one. It's just the majority party is blocking it.

Show us evidence that this would reduce mass killings. Show us how buying these weapons in a gun shop vs a gun show would have stopped the mass killings.
You can't so /end thread!

[Vyxn]

There is an appeals process. You get due process.

guilty till proven innocent isn't due process not in America it isn't

[Matchles]

If you are put on it without being able to contest it as its happening, I wouldn't count that as due process. It's like getting a guilty verdict without being able to prove you're not at trial, and then appealing once you found out about it

Not really, there are administrative hearings like this for all sorts of issues. You aren't guaranteed a hearing before denial.

[MasterOfNone]

The article is about how even with a check revealing that you are on the watchlist you can still make the purchase. Also there are plenty of FFLs at gun shows who DO have to perform checks. Also there is nothing stopping the feds from closing the gun show loophole, they just haven't. The discussion was on federal laws that could be passed. So again, what is your point?

Go read the post dude. This is not a federal problem. It's state. The laws are in place for federal. You also do not have to perform checks if it's private. You are dead wrong. This will be my last post arguing something with some one who is completely ignorant of gun sales and purchases, and yes I have done a lot of the mentioned as well as frequented dozens of shows. Good day.

[Matchles]

guilty till proven innocent isn't due process not in America it isn't

This isn't a criminal inquiry so what does guilt have to do with anything?

[Crissi]

This isn't a criminal inquiry so what does guilt have to do with anything?

Because it involves a constitutional right (as of Heller interpret). Guilty until proven innocent is not due process, and rights can only be taken away by due process. The list implies you are guilty of something

[Tijuana]

This isn't a criminal inquiry so what does guilt have to do with anything?

It has to do with being on a list that says people on this list can't do stuff. You really don't understand?

[Matchles]

Go read the post dude. This is not a federal problem. It's state. The laws are in place for federal. You also do not have to perform checks if it's private. You are dead wrong. This will be my last post arguing something with some one who is completely ignorant of gun sales and purchases, and yes I have done a lot of the mentioned as well as frequented dozens of shows. Good day.

You go read the post it is looking at POTENTIAL federal laws. There is nothing that would stop the feds from closing the gun show loophole and then the entire country would have to abide by the same rule. Likewise, the subject of the article, there is nothing stopping the feds from including the terrorist watchlist as a disqualifying factor in an NICS background check. You are mistakenly assuming I don't know the law or how it operates.

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It has to do with being on a list that says people on this list can't do stuff. You really don't understand?

No I do. Unfortunately, I don't have the time or patience to explain the entirety of administrative law on a message board.

[CellarDoor]

Yea cause this didn't just happen in france with 120 more casualties. You people are sick in the head with this agenda.

[Deleted]

The only thing stopping a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun so what do you have to fear?

[Tijuana]

You go read the post it is looking at POTENTIAL federal laws. There is nothing that would stop the feds from closing the gun show loophole and then the entire country would have to abide by the same rule. Likewise, the subject of the article, there is nothing stopping the feds from including the terrorist watchlist as a disqualifying factor in an NICS background check. You are mistakenly assuming I don't know the law or how it operates.

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No I do. Unfortunately, I don't have the time or patience to explain the entirety of administrative law on a message board.

But you seem to have time and patience to get corrected on a myriad of other side issues...

[Kellhound]

This isn't a criminal inquiry so what does guilt have to do with anything?

It is about removing a Constitutional Right from people, and considering how easy it is to get put on the list and how hard it is to get off it is a stretch to call it due process.

Besides, why stop there, why not strip them of citizenship and expel them from the country. They can always petition to be allowed back after all.

[Damajin]

So a bi-partisan group introduced the bill?

Peter King isn't exactly Republican, despite the party label. It might as well have been called a Democrat backed piece of legislation.

[Matchles]

Because it involves a constitutional right (as of Heller interpret). Guilty until proven innocent is not due process, and rights can only be taken away by due process. The list implies you are guilty of something

There is nothing criminal about being in a mental institution or renouncing your citizenship but those are disqualifying factors in being able to pass a background check. Due process doesn't mean "jury trial", it is a fluid concept, especially in administrative hearings which this is.

[Tijuana]

Peter King isn't exactly Republican, despite the party label. It might as well have been called a Democrat backed piece of legislation.

Wasn't he the guy from Jersey who was just outraged that congress didn't approve hurricane sandy relief funds that were triple the damage done, despite over 95% of it being insured?

[Kellhound]

There is nothing criminal about being in a mental institution or renouncing your citizenship but those are disqualifying factors in being able to pass a background check. Due process doesn't mean "jury trial", it is a fluid concept, especially in administrative hearings which this is.

You have to be a citizen to purchase a firearm, so renouncing your citizenship is a self inflicted prohibition. Mental incompetency rulings have FAR higher standards than being placed on the no fly list.

[Matchles]

guilty till proven innocent isn't due process not in America it isn't

That sounds odd considering how many of the discussions on police shootings have gone on these boards.

[Vyxn]

This isn't a criminal inquiry so what does guilt have to do with anything?

because it takes away a constructional right and if your going to take away a right there better be due process

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That sounds odd considering how many of the discussions on police shootings have gone on these boards.

and did I say those on the list should have guns what I'm advocating for there needs to be due process if a right is taken away getting put on the list

[Matchles]

You have to be a citizen to purchase a firearm, so renouncing your citizenship is a self inflicted prohibition. Mental incompetency rulings have FAR higher standards than being placed on the no fly list.

Well you can't purchase if you are under indictment for a crime punishable by one year. A low standard of proof in itself.

[Damajin]

Wasn't he the guy from Jersey who was just outraged that congress didn't approve hurricane sandy relief funds that were triple the damage done, despite over 95% of it being insured?

I hadn't heard of that but it wouldn't surprise me in the least, he's known as a wheeler and dealer, influence peddler and pro government pro authoritarian everything.