Is Mastery a hidden gem

[Deleted]

As we more than likely all know that MM goes crit > MS then 48% crit you change to MS weapon enchant etc.

Just curious, 1 Hunter who i raid with seems to have taken the mastery route with MM, i mean im talking 23-24% sniper training buff on damage dealt. Has anyone seemed to feel Mastery can be 'decent' at a point or does it take over MS when MS it at a set % and the fact bosses melt so fast now so dont even need really consider moving anywhere near as much to maintain 90% + uptime on sniper trianing

[Balakam]

Not really good imo.


Full mastery = bad focus regeneration because less AiS crit = less burst.

Mastery when > 48% crit ... yeah not really, the mastery you gain at this point will be pointless.

You can have fun and run the maths. but honestly, mastery has nothing to do in MM spec

[Vaelkyri]

As a general rule no, however when synched with Rapid fire CD it is very good. IE Khiras allows for very very high burst when combined with rapid fire as it increases not only base damage but also the damage on those guaranteed aimed crits.

TLDR, base mastery eh. On use mastery ok.

[Deleted]

Not really good imo.


Full mastery = bad focus regeneration because less AiS crit = less burst.

Mastery when > 48% crit ... yeah not really, the mastery you gain at this point will be pointless.

You can have fun and run the maths. but honestly, mastery has nothing to do in MM spec

yeah thats also the reason khiras adrenalin injector is our BiS Trinket on everything after the 715 version lol

As a general rule no, however when synched with Rapid fire CD it is very good. IE Khiras allows for very very high burst when combined with rapid fire as it increases not only base damage but also the damage on those guaranteed aimed crits.

TLDR, base mastery eh. On use mastery ok.

so why is the statweight table from azor listing 0.62 mastery and 0.64 ms per point?

[Ehuehuecopter]

injector is BiS after 715 just because simcraft takes in the calculation the legendary ring and since ring procs = +% DMG and mastery MM is the nearly the same, at some point HUGE amount of mastery + ring are even better than stacking MS

[Azortharion]

injector is BiS after 715 just because simcraft takes in the calculation the legendary ring and since ring procs = +% DMG and mastery MM is the nearly the same, at some point HUGE amount of mastery + ring are even better than stacking MS

No? Not really.

What imaginary point would this be? Why would Mastery increase in value when you get more of it? Nonsense post.

[Ehuehuecopter]

There was a post in the thorycraft thread that stated that injector was trash tier before the 725 version due to the fact that in some simcraft injector was better than censer myth.


tl;dr - the better is upgrading your ring the better will be the proc of injector due to the fact that they stacks and you get a huge amount of overall %dmg increase

[Azortharion]

That doesn't mean Mastery becomes a better stat than Multistrike as an overall statement, which is what you said. It just means that stacking a powerful proc with another powerful proc means you get a very powerful result, which is basic DPS logic.

- - - Updated - - -

at some point HUGE amount of mastery + ring are even better than stacking MS

This part specifically. It's wrong.

[Ehuehuecopter]

I'm sorry but my english isnt very good , i guess i haven't expressed myself clearly

I meant that Mastery isnt good as MS and CRIT neither is better than them BUT in the specific case of the Injector 735 warforged the mastery proc from the trinket and the proc from the ring gave us a huge amount of dmg.

[Balakam]

in the specific case of the Injector 735 warforged the mastery proc from the trinket and the proc from the ring gave us a huge amount of dmg.

So you're just saying mastery is better if your are a super super lucky boy ...

Come on, MS is a constant buff, Mastery isn't due to sniper training downtime. You can't ignore all mecanics in mythics fight and stop moving etc ...

If mastery was viable, alot of hunter would have switched to it, including me, so please why arguing on a cause already lost.

I mean TC discussion are good, but here we are just wasting time.

[worcester]

Actually, mastery does become better than multistrike eventually. This is because multistrike provides a linear gain when you hold other stats constant for marksmanship who don't have any multistrike hooks (disregarding interaction effects between stats). Mastery, on the other hand, implicitly relies on critical strike (in a non-linear fashion where the second derivative is positive), thus any non-zero amount of critical strike would let mastery pass multistrike in damage return per point eventually: the higher the critical strike; the greater the change in slope: the sooner mastery can overtake multistrike.

As shown below with some reasonable assumptions, if you ever had around 5000 points worth of floating stats that you can swap between multistrike and mastery without affecting anything else, mastery will give you a ever so slight edge over multistrike. If you have less free stats available, multistrike seems to be marginally better.
(The graph assumes 100% uptime on mastery with a fixed 30% critical strike; in reality you would normally have a lower mastery uptime and higher critical strike which lead to similar conclusions)



It should be noted that +% damage increase has nothing to do with the stats' intrinsic value and it is wrong to assume these things (ring or trinket) will in any way affect the damage gain from these stats. There are a few things that can cause discontinuity jumps, none of which are possible with current ring/trinket options.
Finally, even if you could even push your mastery above multistrike rating briefly using trinket procs you always have to consider the opportunity cost of using said trinket to what seems to be a very marginal gain.

[Azortharion]

Completely inapplicable theory (since you don't have 5000 points you can throw around between those two stats, at all).

[worcester]

simply pointing out mastery does increase in value the more of it you get, albeit very slowly. But yes, for practical purposes and obtainable gear MS is better. Just testing an intuition to see if mastery can be good hypothetically (if the numbers ever got adjusted in terms of reliability and strength).