Beast Mastery class fantasy? (good-natured, not a rant)

[Bullerick]

i really don't get this weird fixation on 1 pet. every hunter spec has always had their 1 main pet. i think a master of beasts should be able to call out for other animals to assist him or her.

But I don't get the weird new approach to suddenly having an army of random wild beasts.

[Katchii]

And the Artifact wolf is a letdown. I was sure it'd look more like that wolf boss in one of the dungeons

Agree with this 100%.

The model of the Artifact pet is from 4 expansions ago (Wod -> MoP -> Cata -> WotLK)... extremely disappointing to say the least if this pet is supposed to be with us 100% of the time. I'd be OK if the model was like Gara or the other WoD wolf models, but Hati is going to look like shit next to my tamed Fel Wolf....

I really hope the model is a place holder, or at the very least we get to change the model based on the model we're using of the weapon itself, because as it is now, using a wolf model from WotLK is embarrassing.

[threads]

But I don't get the weird new approach to suddenly having an army of random wild beasts.

yea they just suddenly added dire beast, crows, and stampede to the game. never had those before.

[Eapoe]

Agree with this 100%.

The model of the Artifact pet is from 4 expansions ago (Wod -> MoP -> Cata -> WotLK)... extremely disappointing to say the least if this pet is supposed to be with us 100% of the time. I'd be OK if the model was like Gara or the other WoD wolf models, but Hati is going to look like shit next to my tamed Fel Wolf....

I really hope the model is a place holder, or at the very least we get to change the model based on the model we're using of the weapon itself, because as it is now, using a wolf model from WotLK is embarrassing.

Umm, for the sake of lore and game immersion, it IS an artifact, meaning old, handed down, been around for generation. Why wouldn't the pet that is tied to it also be an older style beast?

[Biggety]

Umm, for the sake of lore and game immersion, it IS an artifact, meaning old, handed down, been around for generation. Why wouldn't the pet that is tied to it also be an older style beast?

Maybe, but if they were to use an updated wolf model (blue gara with lightning effect) no one would have said a peep about the model - though they might still ask for the option to switch to something other than a wolf model for personal preference.

Speaking of . . . the spirit of Hati inhabits the gun, and the gun summons Hati to do your bidding (somewhat.) From a lore perspective, wouldn't it be just as compelling to say that the spirit of Hati needs a physical vessel to interact with the world, so Hati inhabits a second pet from your stable? This could even play into the development of the artifact. Initially, your control of Hati is weak and you have to master Titanstrike in order to master Hati, eventually unlocking the ability to command Hati as you would a normal pet.

But really, I just want a lightning-charged Terrorpene.

[artaxix]

Maybe, but if they were to use an updated wolf model (blue gara with lightning effect) no one would have said a peep about the model - though they might still ask for the option to switch to something other than a wolf model for personal preference.

Speaking of . . . the spirit of Hati inhabits the gun, and the gun summons Hati to do your bidding (somewhat.) From a lore perspective, wouldn't it be just as compelling to say that the spirit of Hati needs a physical vessel to interact with the world, so Hati inhabits a second pet from your stable? This could even play into the development of the artifact. Initially, your control of Hati is weak and you have to master Titanstrike in order to master Hati, eventually unlocking the ability to command Hati as you would a normal pet.

But really, I just want a lightning-charged Terrorpene.

That's what I'm talkin about!

As I've said on the WoW Forums, every bit about Hati feels bad.

Little-to-no interaction with the player, no control over Hati, all of it feels terrible. Yeah, Master of Beasts is all well and good, but you don't really interact with them still. You'd be pressing those buttons regardless, it's just passive shenanigans - which is the last thing BM needs more of.

Then there's the issue of aesthetics. We should be able to pick a beast from our stables as our 2nd Pet. There's zero bond with Hati. This is all compounded on the fact that Hati uses an out-dated model, the only variation is dependent on your artifact choices. Congrats, BM.. you all get the same pet forced upon you.

Then.. there's the Fantasy of being a master of beasts, yet this particular beast, if you think about it, masters us. Has that given you the warm and fuzzies yet? No thanks.

All in all, I'd like to see absolute control given to the players over the execution of the 2nd pet. Create some BS reasoning for it, make Hati possess one of our stable pets, I don't know, but give the player control over the 2nd pet. Otherwise, it just feels really lame.

[Boneshatter]

I think making chimera shot baseline and adding something else to the talent tree would help the rotation a lot.

I really like the option (glyph probably) to make the dire beast call something from your own stable. It would feel more realistic.

I am also disappointed in Hati. I like wolves/wargs and the Norse theology that follows Hati, but they wouldn't be my first choice of a pet. An idea I had was that Titanstrike is so technologically advanced that it it able to make a copy of your existing pet. Even throw in a little cheese by making the replicated pet's name be your existing pet's name backwards. Doing that would allow dino lovers like me to have 2 dinos, wolf people get 2 wolves, cat people get 2 cats, etc.

[Runeitude]

I'm not a fan of the current direction for Beast Mastery in Legion, I'm also more into the idea that it's more about the bond between you and your main pet, rather than calling in the beasts of the wild. I like the synergy in abilities like Bestial Wrath where both you and your pet go crazy together, and it feels like your shared bond is pushing you both to fight better.
I've also enjoyed Kill Command (apart from it's janky animation) once it settled into being a rotational ability, but does anyone else feel like Survival's new Flanking Strike feels like even more of a BM ability than Kill Command? Both hunter and companion attacking their prey together sounds more like the kind of hunter I want to play.

I don't have alpha access, so I can only go on what I've seen in videos, and read from datamining, but the way it looks now Survival feels like more of the shared bond hunter that I want to be than Beast Mastery does. Hunter was my original main in Vanilla through to Cataclysm (I tank now), and I've always been BM through the good times and the bad, only ever changing out when i was doing organised raids during the bad times. I don't want that to change, but it's looking like it might.


TL;DR
Survival seems more like the Beast Master fantasy in my head than Beast Mastery does.

[Fenixhart]

I just think it's weird that The Hunter who is most harmonious with the wild and nature gets a space tech gun...

[Ealyssa]

To me BM is someone who like his pet more than most people.

Someone with a big pet, usually bigger than a "dog size" pet. A bear, a tiger, something big and intelligent than truely helps him in life and in fights. Think Rexxar and Misha.
I'm really not into the "hey I have a horde of dogs with me" fantasy.

In image

BM is more this :


than this :


And I totally agree that the gun artefact is on the opposite of the spec flavor. Should IMO throw axes or spears ! Blizzard could really go wild on this one for once with the artifact system, ike the demolock skull.
So disappointed of the gun

And to expand on the difference with other specs :

MM is the true archer, a sniper without pets.

Survival, is someone who really live outside, in jungle, forest, mountains. He has a pet a companion to not be alone, help him hunt, guard while he sleeps. And while he like his current pet, he knows he may die tommorow and will have to tame a new one. Really more like a master/pet relation. Think shepherd and his sheepdog.

[Bullerick]

yea they just suddenly added dire beast, crows, and stampede to the game. never had those before.

Oh no you proved me wrong but oh wait. The magic behind those is that you can choose not to use any of those! Did you know that you can change your talents at any time? The current BM in the alpha gives you no option. You're forced to have a second pet, your dire beast is part of your baseline rotation and you summon a million of them. Play BM right now in live WoW and you can actually choose if you want to use dire beasts and crows or if you want to make your own pet stronger.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

I remember picking Hunter when WoW launched because of the pet fantasy; taming, feeding, happiness level, having to tame higher level beasts to learn higher pet skill levels... it was very cool. Being a good Hunter meant you had to put the work into it, which I didn't mind. This meant finding that perfect pet was also part of the fantasy, taking hours, days, even weeks to get that rare pet (mine was Humar the Pridelord) just gave your Hunter an identity, a gravity that playing other classes just didn't have.

Beast Mastery to me has always been about forging an incredibly deep bond with your pet, to the point where they're your companion, your best friend, your other half. Previously that was kind of forced because your pets happiness level would decrease and they could flat out leave you if you didn't use them, and IIRC their damage was lower at lower happiness levels.

I don't mind the extension of Beast Mastery to apply to multiple animals, I just pray they don't turn it into a menagerie where you're really just an effective trapper who has lots of animals trapped and usable to throw at your enemies, rather than a animal lover with lots of animal friends who willingly fight by your side.

They already seem to be going this direction. Just identifying dwarves as the BM race (i.e., as guns are being identified with BM), and dwarves being more mechanically inclined. I think Hemet Nesingwary, and I see a hunter more about killing or using animals than befriending them.

Not sure how my old Nelf hunter with his bow and white lion tamed in Winterspring all those years ago fits into the new vision for hunters...

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I just think it's weird that The Hunter who is most harmonious with the wild and nature gets a space tech gun...

Agreed.
/10 char.

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I've been looking at videos of BM in the alpha, and it looks like a lot of fun to play for someone like me, whose favorite class ever was the City of Heroes mastermind. But I have to wonder: does anyone actually have a fantasy of their hunter controlling every pet in the area, like Tarzan calling for help? Exhibit 1:



I've always thought of "hunter" in conjunction with one pet, or maybe 2-3 of a kind. But that's just me! Anyone out there going, "Yes, this is precisely what I always wanted"?

Perhaps another (more positive) way to view the new Beast Masters in Legion is like the movie Avatar - yes, they are calling animals en masse to charge well-armed enemies knowing many will die, but it's the very life of the planet they are fighting for, and the animals have as much to lose as we do.

[Deleted]

I won't comment on the actual mechanics of the spec since I only recently returned to WoW and I don't even have a main or a 100 yet.
I saw some videos and the spec seems very bare bones at the moment. But the core aspect of it I actually like. Calling upon beasts to assist you in combat and having them tear at your foes is a cool concept.

I do agree that the whole "summoning random beasts" part is a bit wierd since Hunters have always had a connection to their pet(s) and formed a bond with them.
To that end I actually like the glyph incoming for BM where Dire Beast will summon one of your stabled pets. There should also be a glyph for Stampede and one for Hati.

I think these glyphs/spellbooks could give the BM Hunter more of a "Leader of the pack" feel than a guy who calls upon random beasts to assist him.
I am kinda wierd with my Hunters, I always tame pets that I think are fitting of my Hunter or just plain cool, but I never tamed a pet "just" to have a Wolf.

In Wotlk, when you absolutley NEEDED to have a Wolf a lot of Hunters begrudgingly went and tamed the highest leveled one they could find.
I on the other hand had a Wolf from Westfall named "Cream" because I liked the colour. I grow a wierd attachment to these random collections of 0's 1's and pixels. I remembered taming Cream as a young Dorf Huntard in Westfall when I ran around with a big Axe because I thought it was cool, and was dying to get a hat(Azure Silk Hood hype) And I have memories attached to most of my pets. Like going on a long trek to tame Mazzranache(Pink tallstrider from Mulgore) and traveling to the Blood Elf starting zone to tame a Dragonhawk.

To be able to call upon all the beasts I befriended over the years to assist me in combat is cool. Much cooler than summoning whatever beasts may be around at that given time.

The random pet given by the gun doesn't sit well with me. But I can see how people think it's cool to have an ancient pet at their side.
But a simple Glyph that changed Hati to one of your stabled pets would be awesome.

Similarly, Stampede calling upon your entire pack to overrun and plow trough your enemies would really cement the "Leader of the pack" feel.

[Ashrynn]

I'm pretty excited to see how this spec plays out, and I really don't mind using the gun too much since I already use WSR and I like the idea around it. But I do think the Eagle Spear makes way more sense as a BM Weapon and that BM does fit more of the melee style. Unfortunately, SV is such a cluster that they had to get radical and really change it for it to have any class fantasy.

Would be cool if they just re-did things down the road and made BM a Melee spec and changed SV to a Shadow Hunter and just totally start from the ground up with it. Then again people would still complain so best to just not suggest suggestions.

[Beoren]

I think they should bring back a focus generate shot like Steady shot (or WoD's cobra shot) and keep the ]current Dire beast mechanic just remove the focus they bring so dire beasts only do dmg.

Also I dont think Chimera shot will remain that strong - expect a nerf.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

It seems like their problem was trying to bring the warcraft 3 beastmaster into the game but they mixed it up into survival and BM so now they're both mediocre designs that people aren't really happy with.

You get BM summoning wild beasts and stampedes like wc3 but it's getting some robot's gun? Mixed design.

Then you get survival which is melee + pet but half the talents look like a rexxar inspired pet guy, then half are traps and grenades. Like who the fuck would throw a grenade if they're in melee?

Idk looks like they just didn't really know what they were doing.

Could have easily made BM the melee beast summoner and left survival as the generic WoW hunter that people still want to play.

"Like who the fuck would throw a grenade if they're in melee?"
ikr?

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I actually like the new BM a lot ^^ my hunter is a dwarf and it makes me feel like Hemet Nesingwary

I don't remember any of Hemet's pets. All I remember is him wanting to shoot all the animals.

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I've been looking at videos of BM in the alpha, and it looks like a lot of fun to play for someone like me, whose favorite class ever was the City of Heroes mastermind. But I have to wonder: does anyone actually have a fantasy of their hunter controlling every pet in the area, like Tarzan calling for help? Exhibit 1:



I've always thought of "hunter" in conjunction with one pet, or maybe 2-3 of a kind. But that's just me! Anyone out there going, "Yes, this is precisely what I always wanted"?

lol ~ Except the new BMs with their guns are more like the safari leaders that Tarzan had to battle.

[bloodmoth13]

SV hunters have a bond with their pet, true, but BM is about the mastery over beasts and the deepest bonds that affinity forms. Leave them to BM, not really much to argue against.

The way i see it, either exotic beasts are better than regular ones and BM have to choose them, meaning their list of pets is diminished, or they are equal to others and having them available to survival really changes nothing, and it doesnt really display any better control or anything, they are just different animals.

The way i see it, Survival fights next to his pet while BM manages his pet and others

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BM seems to have 2 different interpretations.

The master of all beasts. Kills things for sport/trophies and commands large packs of nameless cannon fodder animals. Small amounts of damage from a lot of sources. Fox hunting with a swarm of dogs, master and minions kinda deal. Hemet Nesingwary, Houndmaster Braun, etc. Personally dislike this type of hunter fantasy but this is where it seems to be going with the recent changes.

Other direction is hunter and companion. Kind of druidy with the respect for nature/all animals thing. Single, named, absolutely vicious pet that makes up 50% of the overall damage. Rexxar and Misha. Greatly prefer this fantasy from ye olde vanilla hunter days. Easy to get attached to a single pet when they're such an essential part of the gameplay.

Game seems to be getting away from this idea to make it easier to play. Not having to micromanage your pet's skills, no pet skill trees, not having to keep up with happiness, makes very little impact when your pet dies, etc.

Ideal option would be having both, depending on talents you can either control one really strong pet or multiple pets, but even rexxar has his boars and eagle.

... hmm they should totally add in spirit swoop as an ability and allow the flying creature to either be one of our pets or just a random bird (if no flying pet is in our stable!

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To me BM is someone who like his pet more than most people.

Someone with a big pet, usually bigger than a "dog size" pet. A bear, a tiger, something big and intelligent than truely helps him in life and in fights. Think Rexxar and Misha.
I'm really not into the "hey I have a horde of dogs with me" fantasy.

In image

BM is more this :


than this :

I have to disagree, i think it should be either, and rexxar has an inseparable bond with misha, yet he still has other pets he uses (spirit swoop/eagle, summon boars, stampede etc) so it doesnt have to be one or the other, though i would like to see a talent that changes dire beast to simply be a main pet buff, the new talent system is good for those sorts of changes

[Bigthumbb]

BM seems to have 2 different interpretations.

The master of all beasts. Kills things for sport/trophies and commands large packs of nameless cannon fodder animals. Small amounts of damage from a lot of sources. Fox hunting with a swarm of dogs, master and minions kinda deal. Hemet Nesingwary, Houndmaster Braun, etc. Personally dislike this type of hunter fantasy but this is where it seems to be going with the recent changes.

Other direction is hunter and companion. Kind of druidy with the respect for nature/all animals thing. Single, named, absolutely vicious pet that makes up 50% of the overall damage. Rexxar and Misha. Greatly prefer this fantasy from ye olde vanilla hunter days. Easy to get attached to a single pet when they're such an essential part of the gameplay.

Very true. And honestly, if you like the latter kind of hunter, it seems like survival is the better spec for it. No, the pet's not going be making up 50% of your damage, but it's still pretty sweet to be right up in the face of your enemy alongside your pet. If you're really into your one, single pet, it seems to me that survival is going to be the best spec to highlight him/her.

[Kaeth]

I want glyphs for Dire Beast and Stampede which cause them to always summon squirrels.

At least then I could race change to human female and be a tribute to the greatest Marvel character of all time.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

Maybe Legion Beast Mastery is a better fit for Troll hunters than Nelfs. Trolls be talkin to da Loa and channeling the spirit power of beasts in general.

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"Hunter (Forums / Skills / Talent Calculator / Artifact Calculator / PvP Talent Calculator)
So, whats going on with hunter pets post-raid buff removal, are they just a cosmetic choice now? what about exotics?
Pets that you tame are primarily a cosmetic and story choice for you. Exotics tend to have an extra utility ability. (WarcraftDevs)"

I know they're talking about raid buffs here, but this seems to sum up the direction Blizz is taking with hunter pets in general - "cosmetic".