Classic World of Warcraft Discussion [Megathread]

[Pannonian]

I don't know what country you are from but I highly doubt there is anyway that the players on a private server could possibly be considered members of a criminal organisation. I suggest that it is your understanding of this law and how it applies that is the issue.

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A Blizzard backed Legacy service is no-way an admission that the current game is garbage. If Blizzard did introduce a legacy service then there is little reason why it and the current retail version could not co-exist.

It is this kind of inflammatory rhetoric that attracts the anti-Legacy and is partly why this thread keeps going around in circles.

The country is Austria, and im not quite sure if there are any sources on this law on english. And you're right, i'm not an expert on laws, but there has been a lot of controversy regarding this law, as it was originally designed to prosecute the mafia. It has only been used once - to hunt down some animal right activists, who trespassed into animal factories, to film illegal treatment of animals. They were sued under this law, as they prosecutor used the law in a way that he declared the whole animal right group as a group that came together to engage in illegal activities. This law, its loosely definition of "illegal activities" and the use against a harmless group of animal rights activists (remember it was enacted to get rid of the mafia) casued a lot of controversy in my country. This law is planned to be changed by the government. But until this point ANY group of people that do something illegal can be (theoretically) prosecuted under this law. Of course its highly unlikely that this will happen to any private server, but my whole point was that there are places on the earth where playing on such a server can get you in troubles.

So while i'm no layer myself, i've spent a lot of time on this subject, and its something incredibly stupid... but its still a thing here...

[Sabever]

I don't think that making Legacy Servers is admitting that current game is garbage, cause they are two different games. Is like...i don't know, if we are playing...Gears of War 4, and Microsoft decide to put on the market Gears of War 1 at the same time. Just an example XD

Legacy and Retail can coexist cause they are two different games and community's, for Blizzard is like making a "new game" cause is gonna attract a different target of players.
@Pannonian: Is see you are from Vienna, so you are from Austria. I don't think that the law in Austria say that playing in a private server is be a part of a criminal organison. Maybe i'm wrong, but i don't think the law in Austria is different to the Germany or Holland laws in that matter.

It should not be an admission but Blizzard has treated it like it has.

[Deleted]

Maybe Blizzard on this years don't see that Legacy can be a thing, but the last 3 years the community around them is growing more and more and more, the first hit whas the Blizzcon Q&A 2013, the famous "You think you do but you don't", and from that, all explode.

[Pann]

The country is Austria, and im not quite sure if there are any sources on this law on english. And you're right, i'm not an expert on laws, but there has been a lot of controversy regarding this law, as it was originally designed to prosecute the mafia. It has only been used once - to hunt down some animal right activists, who trespassed into animal factories, to film illegal treatment of animals. They were sued under this law, as they prosecutor used the law in a way that he declared the whole animal right group as a group that came together to engage in illegal activities. This law, its loosely definition of "illegal activities" and the use against a harmless group of animal rights activists (remember it was enacted to get rid of the mafia) casued a lot of controversy in my country. This law is planned to be changed by the government. But until this point ANY group of people that do something illegal can be (theoretically) prosecuted under this law. Of course its highly unlikely that this will happen to any private server, but my whole point was that there are places on the earth where playing on such a server can get you in troubles.

So while i'm no layer myself, i've spent a lot of time on this subject, and its something incredibly stupid... but its still a thing here...

As an EU member Austria's laws will be similar to other member states. The activities of the animal rights activists that you describe are criminal in nature therefore it is reasonable that they would fall foul of criminal law and as a result of being an organised group that engages in criminal activity it is no surprise that they were treated as such.

Players on a private server are neither part of organised criminal gang or, at least in the EU, actually committing a crime (although it is an extremely grey area).

[Zandalarian Paladin]

I wonder how things will go down during Blizzcon. It's definitely something I look forward!

[Edison]

I am playing on a private server as we speak. My friends and I just met up at the xroads to do some questing. The realm is full. The world is alive. People everywhere. The quests are immersive and fun. People helping each other, people pvping, people trading and people supporting the community. The starting zones were packed. I got three friends involved who knew nothing of Nost or private servers as of 1 week ago. They played in Vanilla and as far up as through Legion (myself) and MoP one other. We all agree that this is a world and this is how it should be.

Current wow has no players in the world outside of who is not phased in Legion. The world feels empty. The quests and goals are not immersive. You can level to 110 in hours from 0. The quests have almost no chance of death. The world is dead as well as the game. Private servers are reportedly full for a game that is hard to get connected to. People are not as willing to spend time on a game that can get shut down yet the servers are at max capacity. Blizz has two options. Continue to deny Legacy servers and exclusively support Legion. This option denies many people who do not play Vanilla but want to, as well as fails to legitimize vanilla servers. It also is lost revenue and income for Blizz. That said, this is the most likely outcome.

Or, they can give in and let Legacy servers be made. Then Blizz would be admitting that their current game is garbage. That would be a hard pill to swallow. Especially since Legion had massive amount of promotion heading into it, including creating the DH class (which was held off to save the game), and a movie. That said, I have heard some rumors that massive unsubs are already beginning. I think it is possible that they do announce that legacy servers are not in the works, but will be.

Either way, with the blowback from Nost they will likely not be trying to shut down any more private servers anytime soon. Those playing on a private servers are seeing what an actual mmo rpg looks like and loving it. My class feels so dynamic and the abilities I am getting take so much thought and make such a well rounded game. While in legion everyone felt effectively the same, with a different spell animation and a barely different effect.

Long live legacy servers.

We just started playing on a private to It's AMAZING. I'm still currently subbed to legion but as you say, it feels empty, like a singleplayer game. Just like WoD did. I mean outside of the raiding and mythics there's not much to do. My friend told me yesterday "Look at me, i'm a lvl 14 mage grinding slow quests here in Vanilla and i'm having more fun than I've had this month in legion" And I just had to agree.

[Deleted]

So my guess for anything relating legacy wow at this years blizzcon would be 10 %,
if people forgot they dont do the random world of warcraft QA anymore,
question are scripted and taken from internet so they dont need to dodge any bullets, =)

[Saucerian]

Bumping because I don't want the Classic realm train to stop.

I've tried Legion and it's so hard to get invested in than past WoW, not because the overall game's old, but because its design has changed so much over time, and changed such that it discourages getting invested.

It's less RPG than MOBA now. Classes changed beyond recognition and more simplified than ever, questing and story all rush-rush-rush to level cap so you can run the same dailies, dungeons, and raids over and over, get bored, and quit. In Classic it took me 6 months to reach cap the first time. WoD and Legion, 2 weeks.

I find myself longing for when the game was mechanically deeper and much, much slower building up in both story and progression. That's what made me feel invested.

I just can't get into it anymore, personally. I suspect (and hope) Legion will wrap up Warcraft's story, and the next big announcement is Classic realms.

[Eleccybubb]

Bumping because I don't want the Classic realm train to stop.

I've tried Legion and it's so hard to get invested in than past WoW, not because the overall game's old, but because its design has changed so much over time, and changed such that it discourages getting invested.

It's less RPG than MOBA now. Classes changed beyond recognition and more simplified than ever, questing and story all rush-rush-rush to level cap so you can run the same dailies, dungeons, and raids over and over, get bored, and quit. In Classic it took me 6 months to reach cap the first time. WoD and Legion, 2 weeks.

I find myself longing for when the game was mechanically deeper and much, much slower building up in both story and progression. That's what made me feel invested.

I just can't get into it anymore, personally. I suspect (and hope) Legion will wrap up Warcraft's story, and the next big announcement is Classic realms.

Extremely doubt after Legion it's classic servers. The whole hype has died down recently and Blizzard themselves haven't said a word.

[Xargoth6634]

Or, they can give in and let Legacy servers be made. Then Blizz would be admitting that their current game is garbage.

That's a ridiculous statement. Legacy realms would be cool and people would play them, but the vast multitude of people wouldn't leave the current game behind to play exclusively on legacy realms. Many people started AFTER Vanilla/BC/Wrath and outside of curiosity likely wouldn't have much desire to go back to a game in the state that it was then. I'd certainly have a toon at each expansion's server if available, but would I go back and hardcore raid on them? Hell no, I already experienced that content (at a high level) when it was current. Most people will at the very least keep up with new xpacs and legacy realms would be an occasional diversion.

Your statement is fucking stupid, though. Blizz adding another good feature isn't admitting their flagship program's xpacs are garbage, and very few people (just check out other threads here) who have played Legion think it's bad. Most people are blown away at the improvement over the past few xpacs. Your bias is showing here, and it looks pretty ignorant.

[Tharkkun]

Extremely doubt after Legion it's classic servers. The whole hype has died down recently and Blizzard themselves haven't said a word.

They'll never do classic servers. They might do pristine but I don't think very many people showed interest in that. Most people have forgotten about Nostralius since Legion provided content again.

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It is literally 0% illegal to play on a private server. Even downloading the old client via torrent is totally legal. Only uploading it (being the distributor) is illegal.

It's fucking absurd people still don't understand piracy law.

I'm pretty sure the TOS/EULA that you clicked I agree to doesn't allow you to use the game client to connect to 3rd party services. So technically you are breaking the law. Blizzard isn't going to chase each individual though as it would the same as going after people for downloading music.

[Sabever]

That's a ridiculous statement. Legacy realms would be cool and people would play them, but the vast multitude of people wouldn't leave the current game behind to play exclusively on legacy realms. Many people started AFTER Vanilla/BC/Wrath and outside of curiosity likely wouldn't have much desire to go back to a game in the state that it was then. I'd certainly have a toon at each expansion's server if available, but would I go back and hardcore raid on them? Hell no, I already experienced that content (at a high level) when it was current. Most people will at the very least keep up with new xpacs and legacy realms would be an occasional diversion.

Your statement is fucking stupid, though. Blizz adding another good feature isn't admitting their flagship program's xpacs are garbage, and very few people (just check out other threads here) who have played Legion think it's bad. Most people are blown away at the improvement over the past few xpacs. Your bias is showing here, and it looks pretty ignorant.

The statement stands because Blizz has treated legacy as an admission of inadequacy. The people unsubbing right now speak for themselves. Yes my bias is showing, and so is your fanboy bias. WoD had a lot of people happy at launch. It seems like day 1 sales were great for Legion but did not match prepurchases (from the reports of DH created in the prepatch), and the post Legion unsub rate appears to already be in line with WoD. I have played the game a lot longer than most and everyone I have on my battlenet friends list who played from any expansion before Cata are still not subbing (save 1).

Legacy might save wow.

[Deleted]

So my guess for anything relating legacy wow at this years blizzcon would be 10 %,
if people forgot they dont do the random world of warcraft QA anymore,
question are scripted and taken from internet so they dont need to dodge any bullets, =)

Dude that's for real?

Damned...thats one of the sadest things i hear in a looooong time. Feels so...ufff...

[Molis]

The statement stands because Blizz has treated legacy as an admission of inadequacy. The people unsubbing right now speak for themselves. Yes my bias is showing, and so is your fanboy bias. WoD had a lot of people happy at launch. It seems like day 1 sales were great for Legion but did not match prepurchases (from the reports of DH created in the prepatch), and the post Legion unsub rate appears to already be in line with WoD. I have played the game a lot longer than most and everyone I have on my battlenet friends list who played from any expansion before Cata are still not subbing (save 1).

Legacy might save wow.

Nobody has any idea what the sub or unsub rate is.
How does the Demon Hunters created have anything to do with the games health? I resubbed for Legion and didnt make a DH.

You are spouting opinions or made up facts to back up your pro legacy stance.

WoW doesn't need saving it is making money just fine.

[Pann]

The statement stands because Blizz has treated legacy as an admission of inadequacy. The people unsubbing right now speak for themselves. Yes my bias is showing, and so is your fanboy bias. WoD had a lot of people happy at launch. It seems like day 1 sales were great for Legion but did not match prepurchases (from the reports of DH created in the prepatch), and the post Legion unsub rate appears to already be in line with WoD. I have played the game a lot longer than most and everyone I have on my battlenet friends list who played from any expansion before Cata are still not subbing (save 1).

Legacy might save wow.

Blizzard have made no such admission. Not wanting to create a legacy service and an offhand dismissal of a question at Blizzcon is not an admission that WoW is inadequate.

Since Blizzard do not release sub numbers there is no way to know how well Legion performed although its sales seem in-line with previous expansions.

Blizzard are a business and if they believed that Legacy would be anywhere near as successful as retail then we would already have it.

[Sabever]

Nobody has any idea what the sub or unsub rate is.
How does the Demon Hunters created have anything to do with the games health? I resubbed for Legion and didnt make a DH.

You are spouting opinions or made up facts to back up your pro legacy stance.

WoW doesn't need saving it is making money just fine.

Blizzard stated in the time before Legion that 3.4MM demon hunters had been made, in total. That included China, the US and Europe. It is logical to infer that most people, who were subbed were likely to take advantage of a new feature to enjoy the game. Does it imply 51%? Probably more like 95%. That means the player base from pre-patch to launch. So even if you think 51% 3.4MM seems very low. If it is 95% it seems very very low.

You are correct in stating many people did not play prepatch and Blizzard did release day 1 sales numbers. Day 1 sales numbers are almost entirely meaningless, as it does not include those who prepurchased the game or purchase on day 2 and beyond. So these are blizzards number, some conjecture (although highly logical conjuncture) combined with a little range to keep people who don't understand numbers (like yourself) can understand.

Happy yet? If not, I would go back to 1st grade math and start over.

[A dot Ham]

How is this thread still alive?

I know that everyone is hoping for more information regarding legacy servers at Blizzcon... and I hope they just glaze over it completely.

[Molis]

Happy yet? If not, I would go back to 1st grade math and start over.

I know for a fact first grade math does not include percentages.

I am happy, thanks. I am enjoying Legion and hope they do not funnel resources away from the live version to please 10% of the population.

[McNeil]

How is this thread still alive?

I know that everyone is hoping for more information regarding legacy servers at Blizzcon... and I hope they just glaze over it completely.

So you don't have any interest, then why even visit this thread at all?

[Herbert]

Worst thread necro of all time.