"We think [Elite] Players deserve better gear" - Kaivax

[Deleted]

I think tier bonuses can have such a powerful impact on how a class is played that it's stupid to relegate players that don't want to do higher difficultly raids to second class player status by putting pointless bonuses on the gear they can get. I also think it's fine for there to be higher teir gear with better stat allocations, and I also think it's fine to reward people based on the difficulty of the encounter.

I don't honestly understand, though, why some 'elite' players care as much about this as they do.

Tier gear in lfr potentially "forces" raiders to go there for missing pieces

[Jaylock]

That is literally just another number balance change. Have at it, if it makes sense after the math.

EDIT: Now, once you start combining pieces, there's a doozy of change. Goes against Blizzard's "equip this upgrade" plan.

Easy fix. LFR Tier does not mix with Normal+ tier. Problem solved.

[Bisso]

What do you think about the recent blue post essentially saying "We think [Elite] players deserve better gear?"

Reminder --
We’re sensitive to your concerns and we’ll keep them all in mind as we settle on ilvl values for gear.

Something worth repeating --
There’s been some concern from both PvEers and PvPers that “raiders will just do Arena to get easy gear” and “gladiators will just do Mythic raids to get easy gear.” We feel it’s important to remember how challenging both types of gameplay can be. Downing Mythic bosses and earning Gladiator rating are two of the most difficult accomplishments in World of Warcraft. We think players who have demonstrated skill at those levels deserve to be rewarded with better gear.

This was a direct quote from Kaivax, a blue poster on the official forums.

Personally I agree. If people are going to spend the time and effort in that type of Raid or PvP environment, we better damn well get better gear than people clicking an "i win" button for LFR.

This is why tier bonuses and trinkets from normal and above raiding should not be in LFR at all. Why give players elite level bonuses / trinkets for janitor level performance?

What are your thoughts?

That's one amazing extrapolation right there. And a valiant effort to put words in mouth of devs to yet again, talk about the damn LFR.

[Drakain]

Tier gear in lfr potentially "forces" raiders to go there for missing pieces

So what? How is that different from anything else? If someone is actually an elite raider, doing a LFR queue is, like, one of many tasks they need to do to be competitive. Frankly, even that argument doesn't make sense because if you're an 'elite' raider, you WANT to be able to maximize your ability to obtain and maintain a competitive edge. The alternative is of having one less opportunity a week to complete your set which doesn't seem like a win/win for a raider.

[Aori]

Gear ilvl should be the same across the board. Differences should just be cosmetic at this point along with monetary, mount, pet, achievement and title based rewards. I think the only difference between sets should be the bonus and stat allocations and maybe a tiny bit of rng for increase ilvl.

I would normally never think this way but I'm honestly tired of how out of control the ilvl is.

[Molis]

As it should be. Not really any thing to discuss here.

I also keep looking for this quote, but do not see it.
"We think [Elite] Players deserve better gear"

[Glorious Leader]

Item levels and uniquely challenging encounters are the rewards.

Set bonuses need not be.

Indeed and subsequently the statement is vacuous of all meaning. The gear could be 1 ilvl greater and it would.still be better rewarded.

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Tier gear in lfr potentially "forces" raiders to go there for missing pieces

Too bad. You could always not do it you have that choice but if you're compelled oh well.

[Deleted]

This is why tier bonuses and trinkets from normal and above raiding should not be in LFR at all. Why give players elite level bonuses / trinkets for janitor level performance?

What are your thoughts?

I think this is just a typical Jay-I-hate-the-lfr-plebs-Lock thread and the op should get a perma

[cFortyfive]

As it should be. Not really any thing to discuss here.

I also keep looking for this quote, but do not see it.
"We think [Elite] Players deserve better gear"

Let me help you there

We think players who have demonstrated skill at those levels deserve to be rewarded with better gear.

[OreoLover]

Indeed and subsequently the statement is vacuous of all meaning. The gear could be 1 ilvl greater and it would.still be better rewarded.

Literal example of what you're trying to point out? That's commitment.

Technically true, albeit absolutely specious.

[Glorious Leader]

Literal example of what you're trying to point out? That's commitment.

Technically true, albeit absolutely specious.

No examples come to mind but that isn't the point. Being rewarded "better gear" ignores the ilvl inflation. The developers can seek to reduce the inflation of gear by bringing up the bottom end (I. E awarded lfr and non raid content better) while not awarding the top end anymore (I. E shrinking the ilvl gap) and technically it would still be better gear. It doesn't need be 56 or whatever er ilvl between lfr and mythic with no tier. "BETTER" is grossly subjective in that sense

[OreoLover]

No examples come to mind but that isn't the point. Being rewarded "better gear" ignores the ilvl inflation. The developers can seek to reduce the inflation of gear by bringing up the bottom end (I. E awarded lfr and non raid content better) while not awarding the top end anymore (I. E shrinking the ilvl gap) and technically it would still be better gear. It doesn't need be 56 or whatever er ilvl between lfr and mythic with no tier. "BETTER" is grossly subjective in that sense

That's actually much better than an example, thank you.

I do not expect them to make much headway changing the current "big power jumps, catch-up sources" system. I would guess their best bet would be to trim the middle-tier, organized content ("friends and family" modes) by removing either Normal/Heroic as one of the steps. Removing LFR would remove queue-only people, removing Mythic would remove big-effort organized people (and one of the important symbols as a PVE game), and removing either Normal/Heroic removes an organized progression step (the first step for really great players, or the final step for above average players).

Changing the power alone is arguable. I just don't think it would make as much sense, as the reward-related "subjectively better" feelings would be nerfed across the board.

[Deadite]

What are your thoughts?

They do get better gear and always have. I don't know what your first language is but you seem to be in error. Mythic gear is substantially better than LFR gear. It must be a while since you have played this game i assume?

[Deleted]

So what? How is that different from anything else? If someone is actually an elite raider, doing a LFR queue is, like, one of many tasks they need to do to be competitive. Frankly, even that argument doesn't make sense because if you're an 'elite' raider, you WANT to be able to maximize your ability to obtain and maintain a competitive edge. The alternative is of having one less opportunity a week to complete your set which doesn't seem like a win/win for a raider.

Because Bing ask and gaining gear isn't what someone looking for a challenge wants. Same with garrisson missions.

Elite raiders are people looking for a challenge.

[Deleted]

Mythic raiders/ gladiators get the best looking gear. Just make it so that the gear that drops in LFR does have a tier set bonus, but worse/ reduced attributes than its heroic/ mythic counterpart.

Mythic: xyz deals +10% damage
LFR: xyz deals +3% damage

Or something along the lines of that...

[Deleted]

I agree. In any competition whether it's sports or gaming, or your work...

The better you perform as an individual the more rewards you get for doing so.

People that complain about this, either live in a basement or simply are too stoned to get the concept of life.

[Deleted]

Indeed and subsequently the statement is vacuous of all meaning. The gear could be 1 ilvl greater and it would.still be better rewarded.

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Too bad. You could always not do it you have that choice but if you're compelled oh well.

This makes no sense. It's like putting lfr drops in low level dungeons and then when lfr people complain "lol well to bad, just don't so it rofl hurr durr"

[Katchii]

People who run harder content already get better gear, and will continue to do so. That's fine. No need to stir up forum drama over it.

This^

They're not saying anything we don't already know and see in practice in this game currently (and since it's inception). No need to try and stir the pot.

[Deleted]

Mythic raiders/ gladiators get the best looking gear. Just make it so that the gear that drops in LFR does have a tier set bonus, but worse/ reduced attributes than its heroic/ mythic counterpart.

Mythic: xyz deals +10% damage
LFR: xyz deals +3% damage

Or something along the lines of that...

This would work. This and the tier bonuses not being compatible with normal+ gear. Like a set piece from normal and one from lfr would not grant a set bonus

[Deleted]

Mythic raiders/ gladiators get the best looking gear. Just make it so that the gear that drops in LFR does have a tier set bonus, but worse/ reduced attributes than its heroic/ mythic counterpart.

Mythic: xyz deals +10% damage
LFR: xyz deals +3% damage

Or something along the lines of that...

It's already like that with the stats on gear itself. LFR to Mythic is roughly 30% damage difference.