PvP dev team unusually silent?

[styil]

Legion is introducing some of the biggest PvP overhauls in the history of WoW, along with some of the biggest class overhauls in the history of WoW. Despite this, the PvP dev team seems to be mostly silent and working behind the curtains. It seems like the playerbase is not part of the process at all.

With the PTR in a few weeks and the launch date ticking closer, there is not much time to hear feedback, let alone act on it. After the PvP disaster of WoD, the PvP dev team cannot afford another PvP catastrophe.

Should the PvP dev team continue with their current strategy of working amogst themselves, or should they be more consultative with the broader PvP community?

[Arrowset]

After the PvP disaster of WoD, the PvP dev team cannot afford another PvP catastrophe.

It's too late to prevent that- the continued ability prune will guarantee a further pvp decline. The response I've seen from pvpers who participate on beta has been overwhelmingly negative.

I'm a pvp'er, and I gave up on the retail game months ago and moved to private servers.

[rda]

Well... I want to laugh and cry at the same time.

The PVP team is a special disaster even for WoW. They are constantly making big changes and a ton of them are making things worse, not better. It's always 5 steps forward, 4 steps back and 2 steps to the side (into a hole which nobody saw because we were too far from it).

Yes, they should effing listen more, because they don't listen and it is patently clear that their cockiness of "we know better" harms instead of helping.

But none of that is important, because nothing is going to change. They will crash and burn again in the first season of Legion, this will force some changes, things will get somewhat better, etc, then they will do another revamp in the expansion after Legion crashing it all in a different way, this is an eternal story of PVP.

[Cracked]

The whole team went quite silent 3 weeks back, except for celestalon, based on their twitter feeds, they are playing overwatch instead of working. =)

[rda]

The response I've seen from pvpers who participate on beta has been overwhelmingly negative.

Here's why, BTW. Communication with the devs went like this:

Blizzard PVP devs: Here's alpha, please play it and report what you think! Keep in mind this is very unfinished. Have fun!!!
Players: Thanks! <report tons of issues, on pruning first and foremost>
<several months pass>
Players: <report tons more issues, dislike pruning>
<several months pass>
Players: <more issues, getting a bit irritated, say they really, really dislike pruning>
Blizzard: Oh, hey, we see you are testing. Pruning is fine. Please test more. BTW, we are changing the gearing model, you will have to raid.
Players: WTF??? <brace themselves, do summaries of issues, say that they continue to dislike pruning, say that the new gearing model is shit and explain why>
<another month passes>
Players: Oh, fuck it, we don't know why we are wasting time doing this "testing" with nobody talking, nobody listening, nobody fixing and nobody giving a damn in general.

That's Legion.

[Mafic]

The whole team went quite silent 3 weeks back, except for celestalon, based on their twitter feeds, they are playing overwatch instead of working. =)

Exactly. Despite overwhelming negative responses surrounding the class threads and PVP changes they are shutting down communication. They are in tunnel mode now that release is 3 months away.

[Caolela]

Judging from what I've seen on the official Legion PvP forums, Blizz doesn't give a shit. There's some great feedback to be had and no doubt they're using some of it to their advantage, but their response has been awful to non-existent.

It looks like they're stubbornly going with their own agenda, which may or may not be what many players would like. Why? Anything that increases their profit margins in some way overall, regardless of QoL or anything else for the customer is all that matters to them. Blizz knows they have addicts who will pay for an xpac, subs, new accts., or other titles no matter what.

And then in Rated PvP we have the rampant cheating. The cheaters/scripters that Blizz looks the other way on and thus encourages - because overall, Blizz makes money on them, and the hardcore cheaters do as well. It's mutually beneficial - but not for the legit players. Reams of wasted keystrokes have been spent on that topic for literally years, with tons of evidence to support it, but to no avail. They openly brag about their deeds on Blizzard's own forums, so what does that tell you?

[nazrakin]

Yeah not sure why the pvp side has been so quiet. Giving them the benefit of doubt, my guess would be that the focus is on getting spellbook/talent/artifact to better place then they'll start in on pvp template/honor tuning since they're only available at 110.

[Kazuchika]

If I was as bad at my job as Holinka has been I wouldn't say anything either.

[effs]

I've given up doing "PvP testing". Seems like what everyone wants to do is test the overpowered specs. Can't believe there have been 0 changes.

[PrairieChicken]

Legion pvp is full trainwreck ahead, best be silent about it eh?

[DarkBlade6]

Here's why, BTW. Communication with the devs went like this:

Blizzard PVP devs: Here's alpha, please play it and report what you think! Keep in mind this is very unfinished. Have fun!!!
Players: Thanks! <report tons of issues, on pruning first and foremost>
<several months pass>
Players: <report tons more issues, dislike pruning>
<several months pass>
Players: <more issues, getting a bit irritated, say they really, really dislike pruning>
Blizzard: Oh, hey, we see you are testing. Pruning is fine. Please test more. BTW, we are changing the gearing model, you will have to raid.
Players: WTF??? <brace themselves, do summaries of issues, say that they continue to dislike pruning, say that the new gearing model is shit and explain why>
<another month passes>
Players: Oh, fuck it, we don't know why we are wasting time doing this "testing" with nobody talking, nobody listening, nobody fixing and nobody giving a damn in general.

That's Legion.

Ability pruning is not going anywhere , if you complain about that, it basically fall into the twisting nether.... Just saying. To be honest, I dont get it why people are so angry. With the PvP talent tree, you will get all the utility abilities needed to compete, that said, the PvP template are OBVIOUSLY not balanced and I must say the World PvP is terribly broken... but if instanced PvP feel great (I mean way better than ever, yeah I know we're not there yet, but we still got 3 more months of Beta), I think its a good compromise!

[PrairieChicken]

Ability pruning is not going anywhere , if you complain about that, it basically fall into the twisting nether.... Just saying. To be honest, I dont get it why people are so angry. With the PvP talent tree, you will get all the utility abilities needed to compete, that said, the PvP template are OBVIOUSLY not balanced and I must say the World PvP is terribly broken... but if instanced PvP feel great (I mean way better than ever, yeah I know we're not there yet, but we still got 3 more months of Beta), I think its a good compromise!

Well 3 months of beta means that pretty much nothing will change. It is mostly polishing phase at this point

[TS26]

cuz the entire pvp system will be cut

[Nihilan]

They are trying to help the PVE crew figure out why the goddamn phasing keeps breaking.

[Deleted]

Because it's way too late to back away from their widely disliked PvP design, I guess

[Pull My Finger]

Legion is introducing some of the biggest PvP overhauls in the history of WoW, along with some of the biggest class overhauls in the history of WoW. Despite this, the PvP dev team seems to be mostly silent and working behind the curtains. It seems like the playerbase is not part of the process at all.

Because it isn't.

Yes, I generally think the devs should keep it to themselves, do their thing and not give away too much. It's a big, big problem in the today's gaming landscape. There's just way too much information floating around. People should shut up, kick back and stop expecting to be constantly informed, in the picture, and asked for "feedback". This totally takes away all the sense of anticipation and discovery in games.

Besides, this thread is a good example why minimal communication is enough. You're all just bitching and dragging everything down anyway. Who cares?

[Deleted]

The main reason they aren't doing anything in regards to balance is due to the PVE balancing going on at the moment once that is complete the PVP balance can happen in regards to the set stat bonuses you will get, no point balancing something when the spec could change a week later.

[rda]

The amount of people engaging in pvp testing is pitiful compared to pve testing. I think part of the problem with pvp design is that they simply never get a proper data sample.

They never get a proper data sample because they are ignoring feedback and neither fix things nor even talk.

If you meant to say that since nobody tests, the area doesn't get much attention from the devs, it's exactly the reverse - the area doesn't get much attention from the devs, so nobody tests (after 6 months or so only the diehards still try banging their heads against the wall).

- - - Updated - - -

Besides, this thread is a good example why minimal communication is enough. You're all just bitching and dragging everything down anyway. Who cares?

You know nothing of PVP testing, didn't read a thing, didn't try a thing, didn't submit a thing, didn't effing do any PVP. It is patently clear from the oblique generic drivel you are posting. Why the hell are you commenting in this thread? You have nothing to contribute.

Blizzard devs ignored PVP testers this beta. Nobody cares that you think this is not the case and we are all whiners.

[Deleted]

The amount of people engaging in pvp testing is pitiful compared to pve testing. I think part of the problem with pvp design is that they simply never get a proper data sample.

There are plenty of people testing PVP for them and providing feedback. They aren't paying any attention though. Just to mention an example: It currently takes around four people to take out a single prot paladin/ blood dk. They are wrecking havoc across the battlefield yet nothing has happened so far. Only thing that is changing daily is the amount of people willing to test PVP and provide feedback - it is declining heavily.