Murky world of PC game key reselling exposed by indie developer

[unholytestament]

1) Yes you can buy warranty that lasts longer. But with G2A you must buy protection or you have NONE. Does not matter what happens. If you did NOT spend the $2 They will NOT refund you shit.

Actually you do have some protection. If you don't redeem it at all you can return it for a full refund.

I mean, if you're going to split hairs as you do later in this post I think it appropriate I do the same.

2) No Gamestop will NOT refund you on new titles only on used. With New titles they only offer a replacement.

I didn't say anything about new titles but okay, whatever. That doesn't detract from my point.

3) No 100% protected does not imply anything. 100% protected means you are protected 100%. G2A offers you 0% protection unless you pay for it.

Except you're not protected 100%. If you return it too late you aren't guaranteed anything. How is that 100% protection?

And how does 100% protection not imply anything? Is everything a weasel word to you?

Would you like me to post a screenshot of Gamestops warranty to prove you wrong?

Oh no, you might prove something that has so very little do with my point wrong while you continue to ignore the fact that your 100% protection claim is wrong.

And you continue to ignore that the developer in your article lied about their potential revenue losses and instead make a big deal about paying 2 bucks for a warranty on a game I'm getting 25-75% off on. Woe is me.

[Jtbrig7390]

Actually you do have some protection. If you don't redeem it at all you can return it for a full refund.

I mean, if you're going to split hairs as you do later in this post I think it appropriate I do the same.

I didn't say anything about new titles but okay, whatever. That doesn't detract from my point.

Except you're not protected 100%. If you return it too late you aren't guaranteed anything. How is that 100% protection?

And how does 100% protection not imply anything? Is everything a weasel word to you?

Oh no, you might prove something that has so very little do with my point wrong while you continue to ignore the fact that your 100% protection claim is wrong.

And you continue to ignore that the developer in your article lied about their potential revenue losses and instead make a big deal about paying 2 bucks for a warranty on a game I'me getting 25-75% off on. Woe is me.

Of course you are not 100% protected for 9999999 years. You are moving goal posts.

Also no once again go read the TOS on G2A sells. Unless you buy the protection you are 100%+100% fucked.

Replying to you is pointless so I won't be doing it anymore. You keep moving that goal post and ignoring basic facts. Gamestop protects there sells and G2A doesn't unless you pay for it.

[caervek]

Once again the blacklash from doing that is greater in cost.

There is no backlash for the developer, if people are using a key that stops working that is because they were using a stolen key. Their issue is with the place who sold them the stolen key and they should demand a refund (or stop buying keys from dodgy sites).

[darkblood14]

No system is perfect but having no system is bad. Good chance apple would track the phone (since they can) see who has it and go from there. If they for example tracked it to you then you would just show you bought it from ebay who would then show the seller.

There is legal protection in place for both Ebay and Buyers.

I don't really care about the buyers at this point, the initial problem was with the seller getting nothing for that product. Yes, there are legal ways for ebay to track down the seller (but most likely the seller would protect his ass if he isn't just a petty thief with fake identity).

And I agree with you, no system is bad, but you can't really say that they are the direct culprits for selling these keys, those keys could have been sold using trade chat in wow or any other social media outlet with the details being finalized offline by the seller and the buyer (and would result in the same case, no buyer protection, no money for the dev).

And one more point, G2A tries to do a small form of screening, mostly for their clients I think, I sold a few copies of games I received as gifts and on most games over 10$ value they blocked my auction and asked me to provide proof that the key is valid and mine (usually a picture of the box or order info).

[Jtbrig7390]

There is no backlash for the developer

Ubisoft would disagree with you. Its the people who backlash and they do it at the developer.

[Pann]

I might be misunderstanding what has happened but it appears as if the developer has sold their game to someone who has used a stolen credit card who then goes on to sell the key they bought to G2A. If that is what has happened G2A is as much as a victim as the developer if not more so as they have lost the game key and the money they spent buying the key from the fraudster and have to refund their legitimate customer who bought the key from them in good faith. I fail to see how G2A owes the developer any sort of compensation.

[Aeula]

Thanks for pointing G2A out to me OP, I'd heard of it before but didn't realize just how cheap the games on it were! Three games on my steam wishlist just got checked off for under £10! Woo!

As for the OP itself, it seems the indie dev doesn't have much proof. And even if he did, it's the seller's who should be blamed not G2A.

[Mormolyce]

G2A just sits there and handwaves it because they are not the seller they just host the selling site.

Yeah. Might come to court action one day, and then it'll be a different story.

[Jtbrig7390]

Yeah. Might come to court action one day, and then it'll be a different story.

Hope it does. Everyone shitted on ebay until they was forced to protect both buyers and sellers.

Its going to take the sametime happening to G2A.

[Raiju]

It will catch up to them at one point. Napster wasn't providing any content, they merely hosted the illegal activities. Look how that worked out for them. Similarly the guy who created the Silk Road was sentenced to prison for life. If you create an enterprise that encourages and supports illegal activities you're not in the clear.

Yeah but look all these totally not biased people in this thread say they aren't responsible. It couldn't be that they're also getting benefit from illegally obtained codes driving prices down for them

[caervek]

Everyone shitted on ebay until they was forced to protect both buyers and sellers.

eBay only protect buyers, to an extent that makes scamming rife. This is why most private sellers stopped using it and moved onto services like Gumtree or Craigslist.

[Aleksej89]

G2A is shady, nasty and borderline illegal.

EA, Activision and most other companies severely inflate prices for half-finished games AND demand more money for shallow DLCs.

Honestly both types of companies are bad business, but we need one to make the games and the other to actually sell the games for affordable prices (3rd world especially).

[unholytestament]

Of course you are not 100% protected for 9999999 years. You are moving goal posts.

Pointing out a claim you made is fallacious is not moving the goal posts. You made the claim of 100% protection and failed to define what that means.

Also no once again go read the TOS on G2A sells. Unless you buy the protection you are 100%+100% fucked.

11.4 Every User has the right to return the product they bought provided it has not been retrieved from the Site, (or any other website where it can be retrieved). The Sellers and Selling Users accept this fact.
https://www.g2a.com/terms-and-conditions

How many times are you going to threaten to throw a ToS at me before you actually do it?

Replying to you is pointless so I won't be doing it anymore. You keep moving that goal post and ignoring basic facts. Gamestop protects there sells and G2A doesn't unless you pay for it.

My stance has remained the same since the start. The developer believes correlation equals causation and had to lie about their potential losses to get attention.

Whereas you make bold vague claims to defend your stance and then demand specifics of others. When you can lower yourself to give specifics you split hairs and then throw out these stupid accusations.

[Raiju]

eBay only protect buyers, to an extent that makes scamming rife. This is why most private sellers stopped using it and moved onto services like Gumtree or Craigslist.

While correct, this includes penalizing sellers selling stolen goods.

[Jtbrig7390]

-snip--

I love how you ignored this part

product they bought provided it has not been retrieved from the Site

How do you think you find out of the key is bad or not?

So this story and what happen with Ubisoft is just stupid accusations....

[unholytestament]

I love how you ignored this part


How do you think you find out of the key is bad or not?

I like how you ignored the part how I said "If you don't redeem it at all you can return it for a full refund."

Which is exactly what the portion of the ToS says.

You wanted to split hairs, so I'm splitting hairs.

[Tech614]

And people wonder why a lot 3rd parties give jack shit about quality control over their PC ports?

Just look at this thread and PC gamers defending thieves to get their games for cheaper.

- - - Updated - - -

Any site where you have to buy, buyer protection in itself should raise a million red flags with anyone with common sense.

Do you have to buy that shit on ebay or the amazon marketplace? Hell no, if a seller scams you they protect you from it free of charge.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

All the more reason to not go over there. Devs may have lied about lost sales and such. Doesn't change how shady G2A is.

[corebit]

I used G2A to buy Rome2 and DLCs since on Steam CA/SEGA had the bright idea of blocking my region from buying their games.

[Woogs]

One indie developer claims a popular PC key-reselling website sold nearly half a million dollars' worth of its games - and didn't receive a penny in return.

The keys weren't stolen from them, they were compensated at the beginning of the distribution chain. They are crying about potential losses. The distribution chain allowed people to capitalize on it.

In tinyBuild's case, it attempted to sell its games from its own online shop, but it was crippled by chargebacks associated with fraudulent credit card purchases.

"I'd start seeing thousands of transactions, and our payment provider would shut us down within days," Nichiporchik said. "Moments later you'd see G2A being populated by cheap keys of games we had just sold on our shop."

If you can't revoke fraudulent key purchases on your own store, that is a you problem.

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Pitchforks are aimed at the wrong culprit. G2A is just a marketplace. If they want to stop this, then they need to reinvent distribution of software licenses. If people can make money w/o legal consequences, people are going to do it 100% of the time.