Will you regrind 5man dungeons after titanforged cap is raised?

[stevenho]

I can imagine grinding 5mans daily for gear pre raids. However, after raids are released and titanforged cap is raised, the chance of getting a high ilvl roll will drop by a tenfold or more. Can't see many people still doing that content for a sub 1% chance of rolling high.

Unless they plan to up the individual roll % to keep max titanforged gear equally hard to obtain with every new tier. That would actually be a godsend for gearing alts as well.

Assuming that won't happen, will you commit to a new grind of the same content for higher titanforged ilvls on the gear you already have?

[Jellospally]

I will grind it for AP you get from the bosses and dungeon clears but otherwise no not really. My time will be in Mythic+ since its better ilvl with higher chance to titanforge based on level you are doing.

[Raiju]

If you're at all gear conscious you'll be doing mythic+ around that time to get your key up to the new gear cap. This is a possible source of titanforged procs and past that people wont bother much. Remember mythic dungeons dropped up to 725 in WoD and many 'serious' players who could get upgrades from it didn't try.

[Twistedelmo]

Going for the highscore on Mythic+ so yes.

[Maudib]

Titanforge is not a motivational factor at all. Just like lotteries are "Tax on the Stupid"... Titanforged is "Motivation for the Morons".

[Hexxidecimal]

I can imagine grinding 5mans daily for gear pre raids. However, after raids are released and titanforged cap is raised, the chance of getting a high ilvl roll will drop by a tenfold or more. Can't see many people still doing that content for a sub 1% chance of rolling high.

Unless they plan to up the individual roll % to keep max titanforged gear equally hard to obtain with every new tier. That would actually be a godsend for gearing alts as well.

Assuming that won't happen, will you commit to a new grind of the same content for higher titanforged ilvls on the gear you already have?

Not for that reason no. I think a lot of people are viewing this system as such, when I just think it's a way to make going back to those dungeons for whatever reason not completely without benefit to you.

I have a lot of alts. My friends, whom I play with have a lot of alts, Our Main Tanks and healers will get run through these dungeons multiple multiple times in order to help out my friends. It's pretty cool that now I can help them AND maybe get a sweet pierce of gear. Just an example of why might run the dungeons over and over. I also used to do it because it was a good way of getting cloth, not so much any more and I don't know how it will work in Legion. There are a number of reasons, now every trip I can be just a little excited as opposed to numb inside lol.

[SoulSoBreezy]

I can imagine grinding 5mans daily for gear pre raids. However, after raids are released and titanforged cap is raised, the chance of getting a high ilvl roll will drop by a tenfold or more. Can't see many people still doing that content for a sub 1% chance of rolling high.

Unless they plan to up the individual roll % to keep max titanforged gear equally hard to obtain with every new tier. That would actually be a godsend for gearing alts as well.

Assuming that won't happen, will you commit to a new grind of the same content for higher titanforged ilvls on the gear you already have?

Grind? Probably not.
But unlike previous expansions, I'll be a lot more inclined to run dungeons overall since there's a chance of an upgrade.

[Hexxidecimal]

Titanforge is not a motivational factor at all. Just like lotteries are "Tax on the Stupid"... Titanforged is "Motivation for the Morons".

If you mean that it's not a motivational factor to run these dungeon in and of itself, I would agree. At least for me. The chance is super tiny. So tiny that it's rather silly to grind for it. Though it is a little extra motivation in situations where I would do it anyway.

[Mad_Murdock]

Not me, I like gear upgrades, but not for random proc chances of the same thing I already have. It is why I never got into Diablo 3. I'm not going to run the same thing over 100 times in hopes of getting the perfect item drop, unless it's really easy, fun and doesn't melt my brain doing it. (like running ICC for Invincible does me now)

Should have made this a poll

[RedGamer030]

Mythic and Mythic+ have better chances for Titanforged, so unless there is another daily bonus for random Legion dungeons then no.

[Maudib]

If you mean that it's not a motivational factor to run these dungeon in and of itself, I would agree. At least for me. The chance is super tiny. So tiny that it's rather silly to grind for it. Though it is a little extra motivation in situations where I would do it anyway.

Exactly... I need gas, so I go to a gas station. If they give me free lottery tickets, yeah I'll scratch them off. But I'm not going to the gas station if my tank is full and buying lottery tickets.


I will do whatever content rewards the MOST AP. Getting the first 34 points in the weapon (not maxing the 20/20 yet) is likely more power than a VERY rare titanforged item would give.

[Deleted]

Assuming that won't happen, will you commit to a new grind of the same content for higher titanforged ilvls on the gear you already have?

No, and I doubt anyone else will either, once they realize a few things. The whole 'grind for titanforged gear' is a misunderstanding on part of the community IMO, as the drop chance of actually getting an item level of 15+ over the expected for the content to drop will be low, tiny even. You won't be able to do, say, 50 or 100 dungeon runs, and then you will have a good selection of titanforged items at whichever iLevel is the current cap.

Instances, which usually gives iLevel 835 loot (LFR), won't suddenly sprinkle players with iLevel 895 items, once the cap is raised that high.

Example math: Chance to have a +5 iLevel on a loot drop (totally fictitious, as an example): 20%.
So to get an iLevel 895 upgrade, you need to have 12 successful bonus loot rolls in a row, each with an 80% chance of failure. The chance of getting an 895 item is then 0.2^12 = 4.1 x 10-9 = 0.0000000041 = virtually zero.

The chance of getting a basic titanforged item upgrade of 15 iLevels, thus getting a Normal mode piece of gear from LFR, will - with these made up numbers - be 0.2^3 = 0.8%. Meaning 8 times out of 1000, and that is just on a single item. Remember there is no loot roll protection on normal armor items, unlike Legendaries, so you can get duplicates.

Even if the chance of getting a single +5 upgrade is the 50% as used in Blizzard's examples (which Blizzard clearly stated it isn't), the chance of getting an 895 item from a 835 instance is still just 0.02%, or two times out of 10'000 (ten thousand). Remember, this is still just to get a single, random armor item.

Even in the last situation you would be better off just throwing yourself and your 9-29 best friends at the mythic difficulty instance/raid until you 'get gud', or you down the bosses by pure chance.

These numbers will of course need to be recalculated, depending on exactly what is the usual iLevel dropped by an instance, and what the current cap is. But people won't be grinding out a full set of gear, or anything like it. They may try, of course, but it is exceedingly unlikely this will be a productive activity.

[gallamann]

Mythic and Mythic+ have better chances for Titanforged, so unless there is another daily bonus for random Legion dungeons then no.

Can you point us to a blue post stating that?

[ComputerNerd]

Titanforge is not a motivational factor at all. Just like lotteries are "Tax on the Stupid"... Titanforged is "Motivation for the Morons".

I agree it shouldn't be the reason, but more a bonus.
Really I think that is the wrong motivation if blizzard are trying to push that as one.

Titanforged has been clarified as a good roll on the item, so a better base item is what you should be going into the content for.

[Deleted]

Can you point us to a blue post stating that?

http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/4...raids-as-well/

tl;dr: higher baseline item level means less rolls required to get to a given item level, thus a better chance

[Fabinas]

Can you point us to a blue post stating that?

Read the first page of this site. THE WHOLE BLUE POST.

[Deleted]

http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/4...raids-as-well/

tl;dr: higher baseline item level means less rolls required to get to a given item level, thus a better chance

That was not the original question.

The chance of getting a single +5 upgrade is the same for all content, so getting +15 (titanforged) over what you would expect for the difficulty, will be the same regardless of where you get an item.

For realistic probabilities of lucky +5 drops, +30 iLevel drops (6 times lucky rolls) will be quite unusual.

[Darkwind]

I'll end up running them for the AP, and if anyone needs an alt running through some content to bring them up to speed that might be another cause for it.

The question will become when the next couple of raid tiers have been and gone, will there still be a point in running them.

Mythic+ will give raid appropriate gear, but jumping into them newly dinged in 8 months time, who knows

[judgementofantonidas]

I can imagine grinding 5mans daily for gear pre raids. However, after raids are released and titanforged cap is raised, the chance of getting a high ilvl roll will drop by a tenfold or more. Can't see many people still doing that content for a sub 1% chance of rolling high.

Unless they plan to up the individual roll % to keep max titanforged gear equally hard to obtain with every new tier. That would actually be a godsend for gearing alts as well.

Assuming that won't happen, will you commit to a new grind of the same content for higher titanforged ilvls on the gear you already have?

I doubt that the chance of upgrade will be worth the time. As already stated by Blue raiders will outgear the one or two pieces they are likely to get to drop. The titanforged gear from dungeons is merely a thinly disguised placebo for the "but we should have gear as good as raiders without equivalent effort invested" crowd.

[Maudib]

That was not the original question.

The chance of getting a single +5 upgrade is the same for all content, so getting +15 (titanforged) over what you would expect for the difficulty, will be the same regardless of where you get an item.

For realistic probabilities of lucky +5 drops, +30 iLevel drops (6 times lucky rolls) will be quite unusual.

Exactly... some people think there is a HIGHER % chance for each +5 iLevel... but it's not.

To make it crystal clear...

An iLevel 850 item would need 8 consecutive successful rolls to hit the cap. To put this in perspective, roll a 6 sided die.

If the first roll is a 6, then roll again. (Loot is now iLevel 855)
If the next roll is a 6, then roll again. (Loot is now iLevel 860)
If the first roll is a 6, then roll again. (Loot is now iLevel 865)
and so forth until either the item is iLevel 890 OR you do NOT roll a 6.

In real like try and roll 8 6's in a row and see how hard that is... and this is a high chance of 16.66% per roll.


Now if you START at iLevel 880... you only need TWO consecutive rolls of six

Do that in real life and see how much faster you are able to do that. Mythic gear has a higher chance to max out because you have lesser rolls consecutively to "win".