2016 GOP Convention - Cleveland, Ohio - July 18-21

[Vanyali]

I do not disagree, but I think we all, including you, have our suspicions here.

Not particularly, considering the last shooter was "OMG BLM DID IT" and it turns out.. nope, he was actually a piece of shit that endorsed the NBP more than anything else, but wasn't affiliated with them either.

[Zarc]

I assume this is meant as sarcasm - so I will just go onto say that I'm sorry to see that you feel the need to mock my concern for America potentially turning into a billionare-owned imperialist dictatorship overruled by fear and intimidation.

I have the same concern, and I'm not even American! But would be a shame if we lost what have been the Leader of the Free World since WWII. Sure you made some bad shit, like overthrowing the democratically elected government of Iran resulting in a theocracy and messing up Iraq. But you did some great things too, like liberating Western Europe, help rebuild Japan and Germany instead of punishing them so that today they are free, prosperous and among your greatest allies in the world. Combating communism in various places, like Korea and Vietnam, which has made South Korea free and prosperous and also a great ally. Would be unfortunate if after all this time you suddenly go off and elect a fascist. Oh... My... God... I just realized.. whoever wins the Presidential election for the first time in the modern era a woman will become the Leader of the Free world! If Hillary wins, it will be Hillary, and if Trump wins it will be Angela Merkel! Amazing!

[RickJamesLich]

Not particularly, considering the last shooter was "OMG BLM DID IT" and it turns out.. nope, he was actually a piece of shit that endorsed the NBP more than anything else, but wasn't affiliated with them either.

I wouldn't quite dismiss the notion that BLM influenced this guy quite yet. If he was equally angry at BLM as he was at the police, as was suggested, why did he only fire at police officers?

[Vanyali]

I wouldn't quite dismiss the notion that BLM influenced this guy quite yet. If he was equally angry at BLM as he was at the police, as was suggested, why did he only fire at police officers?

Dude, you're really reaching with "he wasn't ASSOCIATED with them but he might have been influenced with them so it was BLM 100%!". Especially since nowhere in that post did I say he was angry at BLM, just that he explicitly said he was not associated with them (or any group), and his social media showed he was pretty much showing the truth about BLM, given his "party of choice" in that matter was NBPP.

[RickJamesLich]

Dude, you're really reaching with "he wasn't ASSOCIATED with them but he might have been influenced with them so it was BLM 100%!". Especially since nowhere in that post did I say he was angry at BLM, just that he explicitly said he was not associated with them (or any group), and his social media showed he was pretty much showing the truth about BLM, given his "party of choice" in that matter was NBPP.

You really don't think BLM has had any sort of influence on violence that has broken out? lol. That being said, BLM is a group anyone can say they are a part of, so how are you so sure he hasn't said in the past that he was a part of them? The bigger picture is their influence, not a membership that could be real or imaginary.

[Vanyali]

You really don't think BLM has had any sort of influence on violence that has broken out? lol. That being said, BLM is a group anyone can say they are a part of, so how are you so sure he hasn't said in the past that he was a part of them? The bigger picture is their influence, not a membership that could be real or imaginary.

Yeah.

You just want it to BLM really bad for some reason. The stretch here is goddamn amazing. "Prove he wasn't, despite him saying he wasn't!".. how about you prove he was, if you want "proof" past him saying he wasn't part of BLM, it wasn't for BLM, and being a supporter of a completely different party on social media.

The fact that you don't blink at the NBPP is shocking, though, considering they're just about everything you think BLM is.

[RickJamesLich]

Yeah.

You just want it to BLM really bad for some reason. The stretch here is goddamn amazing. "Prove he wasn't, despite him saying he wasn't!".. how about you prove he was, if you want "proof" past him saying he wasn't part of BLM, it wasn't for BLM, and being a supporter of a completely different party on social media.

The fact that you don't blink at the NBPP is shocking, though, considering they're just about everything you think BLM is.

The only stretch is coming from you lol. Vanyali, do you feel the KKK has incited people to violence in the past? Or is that somehow a "massive stretch" to you as well?

If you want a simple explanation of how they could've influenced him, look at the outcry from the recent shootings with Alton Sterling and Philando Castile. People cry "the cops are killing innocent people for no reason", ignore all the evidence in the cases, and ultimately some people actually feel they are at war with the cops. Not saying NBPP is any better either lol, but we are seeing most of this nonsense coming from BLM.

[Vanyali]

The only stretch is coming from you lol. Vanyali, do you feel the KKK has incited people to violence in the past? Or is that somehow a "massive stretch" to you as well?

If you want a simple explanation of how they could've influenced him, look at the outcry from the recent shootings with Alton Sterling and Philando Castile. People cry "the cops are killing innocent people for no reason", ignore all the evidence in the cases, and ultimately some people actually feel they are at war with the cops. Not saying NBPP is any better either lol, but we are seeing most of this nonsense coming from BLM.

Dude, I feel the KKK is responsible for people inside the KKK.

You, apparently, feel the KKK is responsible for every shooting by anyone that might have seen them ever. Which is honestly the stupidest position I've ever heard in my life.

A guy supporting a black supremacist group (seriously, you want your "black KKK"? that's the NBPP) wants to shoot white cops, but somehow that's not the black supremacist group he supports, but a group he disavowed because he saw them on TV.

As I said, you're transparent as shit, and it's absolutely disgusting.

[RickJamesLich]

Dude, I feel the KKK is responsible for people inside the KKK.

You, apparently, feel the KKK is responsible for every shooting by anyone that might have seen them ever. Which is honestly the stupidest position I've ever heard in my life.

A guy supporting a black supremacist group (seriously, you want your "black KKK"? that's the NBPP) wants to shoot white cops, but somehow that's not the black supremacist group he supports, but a group he disavowed because he saw them on TV.

As I said, you're transparent as shit, and it's absolutely disgusting.

Now you're just making dumb stretches lol. I never said the KKK is responsible for all shootings, but it seems pretty clear they have motivated racial violence in the past. Likewise, BLM is known for having members with an anti-cop stance, it seems pretty clear that someone that killed 5 police officers may be motivated by them.

People like you don't know how to argue and just resort to insults, please don't respond unless you put some thought into your posts.

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The KKK openly carried out explicitly violent acts, including murder, as a normal part of their existence.

BLM has carried out violent acts as well, just go to a Trump rally if you want to see some. Murder may be the next step for them?

[Vanyali]

Now you're just making dumb stretches lol. I never said the KKK is responsible for all shootings, but it seems pretty clear they have motivated racial violence in the past. Likewise, BLM is known for having members with an anti-cop stance, it seems pretty clear that someone that killed 5 police officers may be motivated by them.

People like you don't know how to argue and just resort to insults, please don't respond unless you put some thought into your posts.

Again: you're saying that he, despite saying he was not for BLM, is for BLM because they advocate something.

Not because he supports the group that wants black supremacy and isn't fond of cops, especially white cops, in general, but the one he disavowed.

But somehow it's me stretching to say "yeah, he was probably a fan of the group he supported".

Rock on fella, Trump 2016.

[RickJamesLich]

Again: you're saying that he, despite saying he was not for BLM, is for BLM because they advocate something.

Not because he supports the group that wants black supremacy and isn't fond of cops, especially white cops, in general, but the one he disavowed.

But somehow it's me stretching to say "yeah, he was probably a fan of the group he supported".

Rock on fella, Trump 2016.

I'm saying that he was influenced by BLM. lol, I don't know if he felt he was part of the group or not. The group has often stated anti-cop rhetoric, and considering the guy assassinated 5 cops, that doesn't seem like a stretch. What part of this is complicated to you? Do you think the shooting happening closely after Alton Sterling and Philando Castile was merely a coincidence? Be honest.

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Where I can watch protestors get physically assaulted to the cheers of the other rally-goers as they're escorted out of the building?

No disagreeing some Trump supporters have done dumb things too, one group goes to Trump rallies though because they support Trump. Another goes to cause racial tension and sometimes incite violence. Not all BLM supporters are bad either, but some are pretty awful folks.

[Vanyali]

I'm saying that he was influenced by BLM. lol, I don't know if he felt he was part of the group or not. The group has often stated anti-cop rhetoric, and considering the guy assassinated 5 cops, that doesn't seem like a stretch. What part of this is complicated to you? Do you think the shooting happening closely after Alton Sterling and Philando Castile was merely a coincidence? Be honest.

Dude.

I suggest you look up NBPP.

Here's an excerpt from SPL:

"The New Black Panther Party (NBPP) is a black separatist group that believes black Americans should have their own nation. In the NBPP's "10 Point Platform," which is a takeoff on the 10-point platform of the original Black Panther Party, the NBPP demands that blacks be given a country or state of their own, within which they can make their own laws. They demand that all black prisoners in the United States be released to "the lawful authorities of the Black Nation." They claim to be entitled to reparations for slavery from the United States, all European countries and "the Jews."

The NBPP is notable for its anti-white and anti-Semitic hatred. Its leaders have blamed Jews for the 9/11 terrorist attacks and for the slave trade. The late former party chairman Khalid Abdul Muhammad has said, "There are no good crackers, and if you find one, kill him before he changes." A document on the NBPP website entitled "The Nationalist Manifesto" claims that white men have a secret plan to commit genocide against the non-white races. It also refers to black people who condone mixed-race relationships as the "modern day Custodians [sic] of Uncle Tom's Cabin.""

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-h...-panther-party


You think that a dude that thinks white law enforcement has no power over black people and should all be killed, that believes they are the superior race, that believes they are the true jews and jews are all fake.. was influenced by BLM because BLM is your trigger group? Please. NBPP is a anti-white, kill them all kind of group and he was in support of that. BLM didn't matter fuckall.


TL;DR NBPP is actually what you think BLM is. They're dangerous nutballs that like killing white people because they're black supremacists, and really don't need outside help to want to shoot cops.

[Vanyali]

Now this...this is what a hate group sounds like.

The fact that people shriek about BLM but not NBPP disturbs me greatly. Because NBPP actually advocates going out and killing any white person they see.

[Adam Jensen]

The Republican Party was a joke and a disgrace even before the coronation of The Donald. How is this one of your two main political parties?

That's been my question since Bush.

[RickJamesLich]

No, it's not a coincidence. The shootings directly resulted in the protest, which provided an opportunity for him to strike. That doesn't mean he has anything to do with BLM any more than it would if someone else had used the rally as an opportunity for terrorism in the name of some other agenda.

I'm not even saying he was in BLM though, I'm saying he was influenced/a supporter of their views. In the case of Alton Sterling for example, we are seeing many BLM state that the cops are killing the guy for no reason and that the police aren't doing naything about it for example. The reality is that there is different evidence in the case, a lot of which is still being discovered, for example the allegations that Sterling threatened a homeless person with his gun and that's the reason the cops were called. BLM doesn't acknowledge stuff like this though. Is it possible foul play was still involved here on the end of the police? Of course, but at least let the facts get out there before resorting to sweeping generalizations.

What they do is speak on inflamatory issues in a way that can be very dishonest, and some resort to violence based off of the information they are given. IMO at least, it seems pretty clear that this type of issue could definitely be a motivator for the shooter.

But as you correctly pointed out earlier, anyone can associate themselves with BLM, so why let the existence of some stupid people be used to smear all of them?

The problem here is that BLM isn't stopping people from poisoning the well. On an issue like police brutality, I think most Americans could agree they want less of it. BLM's actions have actually made this a debatable issue though. Actions like still accusing cops who have been declared innocent of in fact being guilty, for example. Not all of their members are bad, far from it, but they are not doing enough to filter out the assholes who resort to violence or use their group for their own agendas (like rioting).

[RickJamesLich]

Dude.

I suggest you look up NBPP.

Here's an excerpt from SPL:

"The New Black Panther Party (NBPP) is a black separatist group that believes black Americans should have their own nation. In the NBPP's "10 Point Platform," which is a takeoff on the 10-point platform of the original Black Panther Party, the NBPP demands that blacks be given a country or state of their own, within which they can make their own laws. They demand that all black prisoners in the United States be released to "the lawful authorities of the Black Nation." They claim to be entitled to reparations for slavery from the United States, all European countries and "the Jews."

The NBPP is notable for its anti-white and anti-Semitic hatred. Its leaders have blamed Jews for the 9/11 terrorist attacks and for the slave trade. The late former party chairman Khalid Abdul Muhammad has said, "There are no good crackers, and if you find one, kill him before he changes." A document on the NBPP website entitled "The Nationalist Manifesto" claims that white men have a secret plan to commit genocide against the non-white races. It also refers to black people who condone mixed-race relationships as the "modern day Custodians [sic] of Uncle Tom's Cabin.""

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-h...-panther-party


You think that a dude that thinks white law enforcement has no power over black people and should all be killed, that believes they are the superior race, that believes they are the true jews and jews are all fake.. was influenced by BLM because BLM is your trigger group? Please. NBPP is a anti-white, kill them all kind of group and he was in support of that. BLM didn't matter fuckall.


TL;DR NBPP is actually what you think BLM is. They're dangerous nutballs that like killing white people because they're black supremacists, and really don't need outside help to want to shoot cops.

I'm not disagreeing about the NBPP stuff, besides the part about BLM being NBPP lol. I don't think that, but I do think that BLM has caused an irrational anger towards police. How can you disagree with that? They've even done stuff like chanted they want dead cops.

I'd like to state too I'm not saying every view point from BLM is "irrational anger" but clearly a lot of the members do engage in this type of stuff.

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I haven't kept up with this, but if he's really associated with the group that Vanyali says he is, it is extremely likely he thinks the BLM are a bunch of capitulating sellouts, just like actual white supremacist groups tend to call anyone who tries to get along with non-whites "race traitors" and blame them for the genocide of the white race (not unlike what some posters on this forum have accused me of).

I think the posters of MMO-C are in and of themselves a perfect example of the futility of trying to stop people from poisoning the well. There are a good chunk of them who, once they've made up their minds, will not be dissuaded from bashing a group for any reason, under any circumstances. I'm not going to say there probably aren't things that BLM protestors do that don't help them, but it's very easy to look past the specifics of their chants or whatever to address the issue. I am by no means arguing they are saints, nor do I even especially care about the movement in and of itself, but the fact that anytime something like this exists a bunch of people crawl out of the woodwork to smear them at every opportunity is highly suspect.

I'll admit I haven't read up on the guy a whole lot but he was a part of a variety of black groups on social media. I don't think you can contribute his sentiments entirely to one group, but at the same time it seems pretty clear at least one, or some of them probably offered motivations. Plus the recent police shootings are popularized in the media in large part due to BLM, NBPP isn't the reason why these stories gain so much coverage. BLM in particular has lead a variety of people to riot and commit assault, so I don't think it's a strange jump to believe that it has also influenced murders. Vester Lee Flanagan (the news anchor that killed a camera man and a reporter) specifically mentioned issues that BLM regularly discuss as one of his motivations for his murders, for example.

I can understand this whole "poisoning the well" thing happens on both sides, but there are people in BLM that are literally making careers off of it lol... some that have done it long before, like Al Sharpton. That would be a good place to start I guess? I think there's this bizarre thing where people think you either have to accept *all* of BLM's beliefs or only some of them, part of the reason this is the case is because BLM appears to treat people that don't believe in all of their beliefs as the enemy.

[Vynestra]

Well considering every Trump does he somehow turns into an absolute disaster, this will be interesting.

If he doesn't get a post convention bump in polls then he's toast.

Even if he does, it has to be bigger than what hillary gets at the end of the month. But inb4 doom and gloom of trump beating hillary in the next 2 weeks in polls.

I can't wait til he says something super racist on the stage.

[Crissi]

This is not a thread about BLM or the Police shootings. This is about the convention. Keep it on topic.

[Svad]

Hey, is there anyone who can tell me if there is a stream showing the convetion for none US residens?

Thanks in advance ;-)

[alexw]

Hey, is there anyone who can tell me if there is a stream showing the convetion for none US residens?

Thanks in advance ;-)

It doesn't start until tomorrow, but I'm sure it will be live streamed for all those hoping to watch a reality TV clown show.