Bye masterloot, farewell alot of pugs?

[darklady]

Man, it's always something every expansion.

When they changed the loot system for LFR in Cata, I wondered why they didn't make the loot system like that across the Board? From LFR to Mythic, you either get personal loot that's BOP or you get a sack of gold. Same for mounts. No need to link who got what in chat. Ninja loot issue solved. Asshole reserved loot issue, solved. It's not going to affect raiding. People will raid for the level for the level of gear they want. If anything it will make more control freaks leave the game, which would result in a Better wow community, what's left of it anyway.

[Socialhealer]

its amazing how anyone but top guilds can complain about this...The only thing it hurts is guilds abilities to make millions of gold by selling carries

no it doesn't personal loot can be traded if it's not an upgrade, so if you buy a boost as a plate wearer, chances are you got another couple of plate wearers in the raid who can trade anything they get unless they roll an upgrade, guilds can still sell end boss mounts and the usual boosts, if they are loot saved before you get less loot to master loot, and now if you're loot saved you won't get personal loot to trade to buyers, doesn't change a damn thing.

[Thorgarth]

snip

I disagree with everything you said.
To turn it on you, why don't you take the time to make your own guild/guild group to use the Master Loot options?
It's actually that simple.

[judgementofantonidas]

This is a blow to the loot systems of multi guild/cross server raids that use anything other then need/greed. So now many progression raids will close it's doors to anybody not in the guild. Want to raid with us join the guild 1st. So because Blizzard ignored ninja looters we now have a broken fix that skirts the issue and creates many others.

this is it exactly you get it

[ItsTiddles]

its amazing how anyone but top guilds can complain about this...The only thing it hurts is guilds abilities to make millions of gold by selling carries

They will still be able to sell carries. As long as it's registered as a guild group, like for achievements, they still get to do master loot. Just a certain amount of people are required to be guildies, not all of them.

[Perkunas]

Another complete non issue that for some reason has been discussed for a whole 19 pages...

This will hurt no one except those who sell carries and ninja looters for who it is basically impossible to grief people now (boo fucking hoo). OP thinks this will HURT PuGs ? LOL. The complete opposite is true - many people who have been burned by ninjas before and have sworn off pugging will now return, knowing that they have a fair shot at the loot they want and not having to worry that some mouth-breathing troll will steal everything.

But how am I supposed to lead runs and ninja artifact power from you plebs if I can't master loot it? This is an outrage!

[nekobaka]

This is a blow to the loot systems of multi guild/cross server raids that use anything other then need/greed. So now many progression raids will close it's doors to anybody not in the guild. Want to raid with us join the guild 1st. So because Blizzard ignored ninja looters we now have a broken fix that skirts the issue and creates many others.

Agreed. Loot scamming was a small minority in my experience. Blizzards blind eye to enforcing their policies is the biggest issue. If players think they will get away with such behavior than they will continue to do such along with drawing in other players thinking it is acceptable behavior under the eyes of Blizzard. If players believe there will be consequences for their toxic behavior then such behavior will be squashed. Seems like Blizzard prior hope to get the PuG community to jump ship to personal loot has failed.

In regards to cross realm coop groups it seems Blizzard really wants players to spend money on realm transfers and further lead to dead raiding realms.

Also as noted by Watcher in the follow up post, the rest of the loot options including FFA is still an option in cross realm groups. If someone wanted to loot and scoot they still could and with current moderator history have no action taken.

[Deleted]

And why do we need to do pugs if it will not allow us to distribute loot our way? )
Easier to expand roster and guild friends list than run pugs in that case.

So basically you treat pugs as loot boost for your team, funneling all gear to your players while puggers get nothing. I stand by my point of only assholes crying about master looter change.

[Onikaroshi]

So basically you treat pugs as loot boost for your team, funneling all gear to your players while puggers get nothing. I stand by my point of only assholes crying about master looter change.

It's not only asshole's. I only pug as a raider, never lead a pug, but I will not be pugging now with the change for the following reasons:

1) I never seem to receive anything but the same pair of shitty boots for the 10th time on PL (Major Reason I Stopped ever joining groups using it)
2) It comes with the caveat that sometimes no one in the raid will receive tier (not really that big of a deal in pugs but still silly since tier is so important)
3) Call me old fashioned but I want to see loot on the boss when bend down and I want to roll on said loot, I have no desire to have the game hand me an item randomly and say "here you go champ! well done!"

and before anyone says it, I have a guild. I raid lead for said guild, we run 2 groups 2 days a week each. If I want to play a random alt I have no choice but to pug because there's no way I'm getting enough people together on an off day.

I like to raid, it's what I enjoy doing in this game, but unfortunately, aside from my 2 toons I'm raiding on in the guild, I don't see myself playing any of my alts during this expansion over this situation and that saddens me.

[Incredibale]

"Aswell" is not a fucking word. STOP IT.

[Onikaroshi]

"Aswell" is not a fucking word. STOP IT.

Neither was ain't until someone added it to the dictionary. Hard to fault people for what they think is a word nowadays with all the shit they add to the dictionary... Hell before we know it selfie will be in there... god I feel old.

[miffy23]

There is no conceivable reason for demanding ML in pugs unless you want to ensure person X gets drop Y to a higher degree of reliability. And for that, guess what you can trade PL drops now among the group (if it wasn't an ilvl upgrade).

It's quite the opposite of what OP is arguing - there is no reason to force puggers into the mercy of potential ML abuse, when PL awards the same results with no drama. This will revitalize pugging quite a bit I would imagine by eliminating this age-old issue.

[kamuimac]

There is no conceivable reason for demanding ML in pugs unless you want to ensure person X gets drop Y to a higher degree of reliability. And for that, guess what you can trade PL drops now among the group (if it wasn't an ilvl upgrade).

you missing the point - there is no reason to even make a group in first place if we cant even similngly ensure to get that trinket/tier for us - instead making loot more "fair" blizzard removed reason for people to even make those groups in first place

instead complaining about items being on reserve idiots will now complain about groups not being there now at all for them to join - and what they will hear in repsonse - the same old "MAKE YOUR OWN GROUP" if you want to raid - nothing at all will change besides huge degrease in numbers of groups created.

[Not A Cat]

I love this change because I never joined ML pugs anyway.

So many more options!

[Perkunas]

you missing the point - there is no reason to even make a group in first place if we cant even similngly ensure to get that trinket/tier for us - instead making loot more "fair" blizzard removed reason for people to even make those groups in first place

instead complaining about items being on reserve idiots will now complain about groups not being there now at all for them to join - and what they will hear in repsonse - the same old "MAKE YOUR OWN GROUP" if you want to raid - nothing at all will change besides huge degrease in numbers of groups created.

This is kind of a "the sky is falling" moment. The reserve runs have gotten out of control to be fair. People are currently either too lazy to host their own run or they don't care enough to boycott the shitty system to begin with. It sucks that Blizzard had to nanny this in and that the masses didn't just up and reject these runs but such is life.

[Thorgarth]

you missing the point - there is no reason to even make a group in first place if we cant even similngly ensure to get that trinket/tier for us - instead making loot more "fair" blizzard removed reason for people to even make those groups in first place

instead complaining about items being on reserve idiots will now complain about groups not being there now at all for them to join - and what they will hear in repsonse - the same old "MAKE YOUR OWN GROUP" if you want to raid - nothing at all will change besides huge degrease in numbers of groups created.

Where's the evidence that the number of groups will decrease because of this?

[Beet]

The problem was that 90%+ of groups were ML, which is bullshit. The ninja'ing that was going on was out of hand, and it has now been addressed. So yes, having ML as an option in Pugs was indeed "broken".

If it lasted for over a decade it's hard to say it was broken. Personally I couldn't give a shit about this change, but I see the pros and cons to it from both sides.

[threads]

master loot has been shit in pugs forever. especially in wod where every run had reserves in pf.

[deadman1]

Apparently the problem was widespread enough that Blizzard felt this was an appropriate solution to it.

By that logic being able to toggle combat text was a "widespread problem" too. Because you can't toggle that anymore.

[bufferunderrun]

Man, it's always something every expansion.

When they changed the loot system for LFR in Cata, I wondered why they didn't make the loot system like that across the Board? From LFR to Mythic, you either get personal loot that's BOP or you get a sack of gold. Same for mounts. No need to link who got what in chat. Ninja loot issue solved. Asshole reserved loot issue, solved. It's not going to affect raiding. People will raid for the level for the level of gear they want. If anything it will make more control freaks leave the game, which would result in a Better wow community, what's left of it anyway.

i think that blizzard tend to ignore problems when they don't effect them to much, in this case they intervened probably because the number of tickets about loot skyrocket with the new lfg system in the same way they originally intervened with dungon finder first then lfr.
-More people doing lfr = more loot issue back in cata = more tickets = blizzard pissed = PL;
-More peoples doing pugs = more loot issue in wod = more tickets = blizzard pissed = PL;
Imho this change only effect guilds selling runs, even thought it's avoidable by letting the guy you need to carry join the guild.