Havoc in Legion: 7.2.5 Guide

[FobManX]

I am curious to see how people approach what abilities to cast during a momentum window. Since the window is short, i have been switching back and forth in terms of abilities to prioritize. For example, FR > TG > 2x CS and maybe a 3rd CS but most the time this never happens. Another example is FR > 2x CS > TG. Since i have high crit and using DB, i have noticed if i prioritize CS during the window i can squeeze out that 3rd CS more often and get my TG at the very end of the momo buff. Does anyone do this or notice this also? I was going to test momo effect against Bloodlet to see if the damage drops back to normal after momo falls. If Bloodlet maintains the 20% buff even after momo, then when you cast TG during momo shouldn't matter as long as you do...in theory

Typically I'll TG first after FR-ing since it puts me out of melee range anyway. Then when I'm back in melee I CS twice. By then the duration is up unless the boss's hit box is really small or I'm in Hero/Meta.

[Unspunreality]

So a few questions. First. addon's dropped for me, how do I change my playstyle if any? I have Anguish unlocked already. Just use it on cooldown?

Second. I have 850 Nature's Call, 855 Terrorbound and 870 Bloodthirsty. I believe Terrorbound is above Nature's Call? Ive never used Terrorbound cause I thought it was bad according to friends but reading around shows it's better than Nature's Call atleast?

Third. Im guessing this is a just sim it question, but does a 20 ilevel upgrade matter over secondary? Im sitting at 38% crit, 8% haste, 22% mastery, 6% vers, 860 ilevel. But I have an 850 necklace that is Main crit/off mastery and an 870 neck that is Main mastery/off haste. I obviously want more crit tho so Im just thinking this necklace is junk.

[Rehok]

Typically I'll TG first after FR-ing since it puts me out of melee range anyway. Then when I'm back in melee I CS twice. By then the duration is up unless the boss's hit box is really small or I'm in Hero/Meta.

its rare you should be VRing out of a boss, Especially in EN when their hit boxes are pretty damn big

[Restitution]

its rare you should be VRing out of a boss, Especially in EN when their hit boxes are pretty damn big

He was talking about FR but i would agree with you in regards to VR. Another thing i do with VR is i cast CS immediately which allows me to hit the boss as i am flying backwards..not sure if blizz intended this but it works lol. I then TG and try to get 1 or 2 more CS before momo duration runs out. Anyone else do this sneaky CS at start of VR animation?

Also, is it safe to say that during a momo window, we can expect to get 1 TG and 2x CS? Obviously some windows will allow 3xCS but the average would be 2. This is outside Meta.

[Scyth]

Might be a bit of a daft question, but has anyone tried using the trinket from Timewalking? 4000 agility looks good on paper, gives me a 1000 more than the HoV one I have, though the crit on it is quite low.

[the boar]

Calculated on hit.

ah fuck i thought leaving hunter behind i was done with having to calculate travel times on the fly

i should have known better. same for fel broccoli i guess? also anyone happen to have a travel time per yard infographic handy?

[jijuiji]

Noob Q - do you spam the **** out of annihilation during meta or do you still FR/VR for momentum? Currently im making sure when im at 75+ fury im popping FR/VR to then spam my annihilates

[jayinjersey]

Kind of both...


Spam the hell out of it, but try doing that while you have the Momo buff up so you'll keep FR/VR and TG

[FobManX]

Noob Q - do you spam the **** out of annihilation during meta or do you still FR/VR for momentum? Currently im making sure when im at 75+ fury im popping FR/VR to then spam my annihilates

You're doing it right. You want to spam Annihilation but with the Momentum buff up for maximum damage. You still want to use Throw Glaive too though, the bleed is still quite good. Don't bother Eye Beaming during Meta.

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Also, is it safe to say that during a momo window, we can expect to get 1 TG and 2x CS? Obviously some windows will allow 3xCS but the average would be 2. This is outside Meta.

I'd say that's about right. In my opener I use two TG since I'm Fel Rushing in on pull with no Fury. After that its typically 1 TG 2 CS(3 if I get a crit).

[Otora]

So a few questions. First. addon's dropped for me, how do I change my playstyle if any? I have Anguish unlocked already. Just use it on cooldown?

Second. I have 850 Nature's Call, 855 Terrorbound and 870 Bloodthirsty. I believe Terrorbound is above Nature's Call? Ive never used Terrorbound cause I thought it was bad according to friends but reading around shows it's better than Nature's Call atleast?

Third. Im guessing this is a just sim it question, but does a 20 ilevel upgrade matter over secondary? Im sitting at 38% crit, 8% haste, 22% mastery, 6% vers, 860 ilevel. But I have an 850 necklace that is Main crit/off mastery and an 870 neck that is Main mastery/off haste. I obviously want more crit tho so Im just thinking this necklace is junk.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure that iLvl doesn't matter for jewelry since it doesn't have mainstat. You want the piece with the best stats for you regardless of the iLvl.

[deathbydots]

Is it still worth going with all TG relics or at what breakpoint does CS overtake it as i know prenerf TG was worth alot of ilvl

[the boar]

Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure that iLvl doesn't matter for jewelry since it doesn't have mainstat. You want the piece with the best stats for you regardless of the iLvl.

within reason, an addon like pawn with your own sim'd stat weights is useful here. but yeah the lack of agility makes it much more forgiving.

[Guuggel]

Which trinket I should use?
E: I also have 850ilvl Bloodthirsty Instinct. Any good?

[squirtlesquad]

He was talking about FR but i would agree with you in regards to VR. Another thing i do with VR is i cast CS immediately which allows me to hit the boss as i am flying backwards..not sure if blizz intended this but it works lol. I then TG and try to get 1 or 2 more CS before momo duration runs out. Anyone else do this sneaky CS at start of VR animation?

Also, is it safe to say that during a momo window, we can expect to get 1 TG and 2x CS? Obviously some windows will allow 3xCS but the average would be 2. This is outside Meta.

VR is off the global cooldown. That's why you can CS while you VR.

This is the macro i picked up somewhere so i CS as i VR.

#showtooltips Vengeful Retreat
/cast Vengeful Retreat
/cast Chaos Strike
/run UIErrorsFrame:Clear ()

[Restitution]

VR is off the global cooldown. That's why you can CS while you VR.

This is the macro i picked up somewhere so i CS as i VR.

You da man

[aGit]

You're doing it right. You want to spam Annihilation but with the Momentum buff up for maximum damage. You still want to use Throw Glaive too though, the bleed is still quite good. Don't bother Eye Beaming during Meta.

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I'd say that's about right. In my opener I use two TG since I'm Fel Rushing in on pull with no Fury. After that its typically 1 TG 2 CS(3 if I get a crit).

i was under the impression, that during meta, one should only use TG when for a reason or another you're not in melee range. otherwise it's only annihilation or building up fury. obviously with demon blades you have the globals to use TG while meta is up, but not with prepared. or am i totally wrong?

[Otora]

i was under the impression, that during meta, one should only use TG when for a reason or another you're not in melee range. otherwise it's only annihilation or building up fury. obviously with demon blades you have the globals to use TG while meta is up, but not with prepared. or am i totally wrong?

Even with prepared you want to be using TG. If you have MotG just make sure you are never at 2 charges even in meta. This is assuming you are using Bloodlet of course.

[neck deep]

So how come we don't know the 2nd best trinket for havoc dh's in nighthold yet? We know one of them is "Convergance of Fates" but what about the 2nd trinket?

stats on trinkets are constantly changing. convergence seems to have agility rather than mastery now which makes it even better but other trinkets were changed to agility too so previously shit tier trinkets could be okay now.

[terpthree]

So the max ilvl I can equip is 863, and I've generally heard the higher ilvl is the better piece 99% of the time, but sim and askmrrobot best in bags has me using 7 pieces of gear that are all a lower ilvl than my highest, nothing crazy just 5-10 ilvl for each piece. I understand the trinket bc my higher ilvl is trash. Should I basically just trust simcraft and AMR and stop questioning it myself?

[Kxero]

So the max ilvl I can equip is 863, and I've generally heard the higher ilvl is the better piece 99% of the time, but sim and askmrrobot best in bags has me using 7 pieces of gear that are all a lower ilvl than my highest, nothing crazy just 5-10 ilvl for each piece. I understand the trinket bc my higher ilvl is trash. Should I basically just trust simcraft and AMR and stop questioning it myself?

Yes in Legion secondary stats are so important that optimized lower iLvl gear will outclss higher iLvl

840 crit+versa could very well be better that 860 mastery+haste for example, usually you want to sim your gear and upgrades to see if the extra agility is worth the non-optimized pieces (I'm carrying 880 haste+mastery boots for example)