Republican Election 2016 - Donald Trump Megathread [OFFICIAL]

[Venant]

I can't argue with that. I agree it is VERY VERY disturbing that Donald Trump managed to get this far. My only hope is that this fiasco of an election, which by all rights was the Republicans to win, will be such a blow to the Republican party, they will feel compelled to clean their house, bite the bullet and push out the radical racist and bigoted elements of their party, and really rebrand themselves as a party worth voting for. That means being a minority party for years... maybe decades... just to drive the point home that racism and bigotry is no longer welcome in their ranks. That the votes of racists and bigots don't matter to them. Once the racists and bigots don't have one of the two major political parties representing them, they will scatter their votes to the wind, breaking any notable voting power they held. Only then can the Republican party hope to draw voters away from the Democrats, focus on actual policy that makes the country better for ALL, and become a party worth voting for.

If you really believe that racism is as strong and dangerous as you say, then racism isn't going to go anywhere. How far are you personally willing to go to end racism?

[Todd Duval]

Oh I dunno, maybe the fact Donald Trump is the republic nominee after saying mexicans were drug lords and rapists?????

Cop shooting stats and targetted raids on black men? I could go on

This just goes hand in hand with the type of people alt-rightists are, which are a portion of Trumps supporters.

For them it's not being racist, but rather it's being opposed to multiculturalism and being anti-immigration. They don't care about being politically correct.

Just think of the birthers; some of these people really do live in their own reality, where whatever Trump says is true.

[Captain N]

You say that this way of thinking is 'not OK', I'm curious what you personally want to do with all the people who think like this?

I don't believe in Thought Crimes if that's where you're trying to take this. It's OK to have thoughts about something but when you start acting on them or promoting a narrative where it's OK to chastise someone due to their skin color, place of origin, or gender as Trump as done deserves to be called out as exactly what it is.

While I understand Trump and his base will hand-wave the accusations of racism, xenophobia, and sexism it says more about them than it does those calling out Trump for these comments.

[Shalcker]

While I understand Trump and his base will hand-wave the accusations of racism, xenophobia, and sexism it says more about them than it does those calling out Trump for these comments.

But there is nothing inherently wrong with xenophobia (unlike racism, which carries bigger stigma).

[Captain N]

But there is nothing inherently wrong with xenophobia (unlike racism, which carries bigger stigma).

Neither are right. Both carry a stigma and for a country that has founded it's entire base on immigrants it's absurd to even take a stance to promote keeping them out.

[May90]

Oh I dunno, maybe the fact Donald Trump is the republic nominee after saying mexicans were drug lords and rapists?????

Cop shooting stats and targetted raids on black men? I could go on

Trump just relies on a certain demographic, that isn't very, let's say, enlightened anywhere in the world. It doesn't mean that racism is somehow becoming mainstream in America, it just means that Trump has managed to take it out of its closet and reveal it to the whole world. People who normally were "silenced racists", who didn't express their beliefs publicly, because it was (and is) unpopular - finally found someone who isn't afraid of doing that, and they simply follow his footsteps, expressing their crazy opinions and supporting him. It will pass. When the guy finally bails out of the race or loses it, they will be back to their closets!

But there is nothing inherently wrong with xenophobia (unlike racism, which carries bigger stigma).

It is really scary that someone actually believes this...

[Venant]

I don't believe in Thought Crimes if that's where you're trying to take this. It's OK to have thoughts about something but when you start acting on them or promoting a narrative where it's OK to chastise someone due to their skin color, place of origin, or gender as Trump as done deserves to be called out as exactly what it is.

While I understand Trump and his base will hand-wave the accusations of racism, xenophobia, and sexism it says more about them than it does those calling out Trump for these comments.

The problem is, you are talking about thought crimes when you declare statements are invalid because of 'racism'. If a statement is invalid, then why not just produce a reasoned argument that can counter it? You are using the concepts of racism/xenophobia/sexism the same way people used to claim heresy against the ruling religion.

[BrerBear]

If you do know someone who talks like that, would you even dare think about voting him for president....or for that matter leaving him alone with your daughter or wife?

Trump says he can do what he wants because he's a star.
I'm sure he wouldn't abuse the power of the Presidency in any way.

[matt4pack]

Please the left has a significant amount of real racists in their ranks unless you're stupid and believe you can't be racist to whites. Of course this type of racism gets sweep under the rug and ignored mostly.

Most trump supporters aren't even real racists they are just angry about losing jobs and their livelihood thanks to mass immigration and globalization.

[Captain N]

The problem is, you are talking about thought crimes when you declare statements are invalid because of 'racism'. If a statement is invalid, then why not just produce a reasoned argument that can counter it? You are using the concepts of racism/xenophobia/sexism the same way people used to claim heresy against the ruling religion.

When you come out and tell a population that Mexicans are rapists and criminals -- That's an action not a thought.

When you make comments that black men are thugs and deserve to die because they didn't listen -- That's an action not a thought.

When you say it's OK to sexually assault women because of your celebrity status -- That's an action not a thought.


If you think all brown people are bad...all women are whores who want to be touched by creepy old men....or that all black men are thugs who deserve to be gunned down and you keep that in your head that's a thought. You don't get punished for thinking...You suffer the consequences of your actions. Which is what Trump and his base are doing for acting on those thoughts.

[runique]

Please the left has a significant amount of real racists in their ranks unless you're stupid and believe you can't be racist to whites. Of course this type of racism gets sweep under the rug and ignored mostly.

Most trump supporters aren't even real racists they are just angry about losing jobs and their livelihood thanks to mass immigration.

What is really odd about that is that net immigration is down under Obama. And almost no one is actually losing their job because of immigration, it is just a scapegoat.

[Kyriani]

If you really believe that racism is as strong and dangerous as you say, then racism isn't going to go anywhere. How far are you personally willing to go to end racism?

I'm not sure what kind of answer you expect but please take everything that follows as my personal opinion.

Racism and bigotry are divisive and cater to a very negative aspect of humanity. You can't force people not to be racist or bigoted. What you can do is educate and expose people to a wide variety of cultures so they can actually see for themselves, in real life situations, that people are not defined by the color of their skin, their religion, or who they fall in love with. Its easy to be prejudiced when you have no one in your life who isn't just like you.

But when you have a friend or family member, someone close to you, who is that "other" it becomes much harder to be prejudiced. It's one of the reasons why homosexuality is much more accepted today. More gay people are out of the closet today than ever before in the United States. That means more people have friends and family they are aware are gay and now they have a stake in how gay people are treated. It's also why conservatives hate the idea of kids ever being exposed to positive representations of homosexuality. They don't fear kids being converted into homosexuals, what they actually fear is kids being converted into adults who don't hold prejudice against homosexuals.

I look at the areas where racism against blacks is at its strongest and most open and I see that those are areas that are predominantly white where people grow up with less positive exposure to other cultures. On the flip side, black communities are in the same boat. They grow up in environments with little exposure to people who aren't black, are often brought up with a negative opinion on white people, and then become adults who often don't mix with anyone else who isn't black to any significant degree. Its easy to hate that which is different from yourself when you have little to no positive interaction with that "other", when you don't have any reason to care about that "other". It becomes much harder to hate that "other" when your best friend falls into that category.

That's my case. I'm a white male gamer geek and my best friend, the person I can confide anything and everything to, who doesn't judge me no matter what, is a black female with no interest in games and a much more responsible attitude than I possess. She's someone I would die for without question. How could I ever feel prejudice towards an ethnic group that this person i care for is a part of? I can't. I'd like to think it would be just as hard for others if they had similar relationships with a wide variety of people. I have friends from all walks of life. I can't "hate" any particular race or religion or orientation because that would be hating people I care about. I believe we need to increase the opportunity for people to develop relationships like that to truly bring racism to its knees.

But as I said in the beginning, that's all just my opinion.

[RobertoCarlos]

snip

Hopefully some good comes of this mess :/

[matt4pack]

Is this satire?

What's not true about it? Do you deny their are quite a few racists on the other side as well.

I'm by no means a trump supporter but I can at least see where his support comes from instead of just taking the easy route of calling everyone a racist which is a no thought kneejerk reaction.

[RobertoCarlos]

Trump just relies on a certain demographic, that isn't very, let's say, enlightened anywhere in the world. It doesn't mean that racism is somehow becoming mainstream in America, it just means that Trump has managed to take it out of its closet and reveal it to the whole world. People who normally were "silenced racists", who didn't express their beliefs publicly, because it was (and is) unpopular - finally found someone who isn't afraid of doing that, and they simply follow his footsteps, expressing their crazy opinions and supporting him. It will pass. When the guy finally bails out of the race or loses it, they will be back to their closets!

Yeah I can see that. Hes like the orange alpha male douche leader. And it gives strength to all the racists to speak up, then they can get truly buck wild at one of his stadium filled hate rallies and get that hive mind epic douche levels going.

[Spectral]

I look at the areas where racism against blacks is at its strongest and most open and I see that those are areas that are predominantly white where people grow up with less positive exposure to other cultures.

Can you be more specific about which areas these are? My experience is the opposite, with anti-black racism seeming strongest in Southern states such as Mississippi where people have the most experience with blacks. People from super-duper white communities, in my personal experience, often pride themselves on being non-racist or even anti-racist.

I'm sure we could find some data one way or the other. Just speaking on personal experience though.

[matt4pack]

What? Yes, there are racist on both sides, that really was a small part of what you said. Everything else was complete bullshit.

So mass immigration and globalization don't have any effect on the lower classes then? I'm not one of these people but it's pretty easy to go to rural America and see the effects first hand which is where his support comes from.

[Shalcker]

Neither are right. Both carry a stigma and for a country that has founded it's entire base on immigrants it's absurd to even take a stance to promote keeping them out.

Xenophobia can be absolutely justified. Some communities, cultures, and economic situations can be quite fragile to "outsiders".

And it can be less costly (and more humane) to keep outsiders out then making community rugged enough to break any outsider into right mold.

[runique]

So mass immigration and globalization don't have any effect on the lower classes then? I'm not one of those people but it's pretty easy to go to rural America and see the effects first hand.

It's also really easy to engage in statistical analysis, and realize the whole "mass immigration" thing is bullshit, but I already addressed that and you'll most likely ignore it. The whole "go see for yourself" crap based solely on anecdotal evidence has no place in policy making or political thinking.

[GennGreymane]