Amy's Baking Company closed

[Stop Pretending]

It's been explained numerous times, my job is not making sure you comprehend what you've read.

[Thage]

Wish I had a more reliable source, but seeing how there is nothing on the web saying they are going to jail over pocketing tips and how high profile they are I assume they where legally in the right.

Not being prosecuted doesn't mean they didn't commit a crime.

https://www.dol.gov/whd/regs/compliance/whdfs15.htm

http://www.calaborlaw.com/tip-poolin...ips-and-how-2/

https://www.workplacefairness.org/tipped-employees

Three sources, all of them confirming that the employer cannot take an employee's tips. How much the employee makes hourly does not affect their status as tipped employees.

[Garnier Fructis]

One thing I learned from all of this is that when you tip by credit card they can take out the CC fee out of your tip, I didn't know that, ill have to remember to tip with cash from now on...

Yup. I always feel bad when I forget to bring a cash tip for this exact reason.

[Tyrianth]

http://radaronline.com/exclusives/20...say-dishonest/

According to an insider close to the Bouzaglos, this proves that Miranda intentionally stole money from them, despite signing the agreement.

“Samy and Amy did nothing wrong, because while they took the servers tips, they also paid them a much higher hourly wage than most other servers. And Miranda signed that agreement, so the Bouzaglos just want everyone to know how dishonest she is,” the source told Radar.

“Legally they have the option to prosecute her, but they’ve chosen not to.”

The source continued to defend the Bouzaglos, stating that a higher hourly wage gave the employees a secure income when business was slow.

Wish I had a more reliable source, but seeing how there is nothing on the web saying they are going to jail over pocketing tips and how high profile they are I assume they where legally in the right.

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Please explain it to me then.

I'm still going to assume it's illegal. I don't know who radaronline is or if they are a reliable source and their source is simple "the source".

Contract law states that any contract that goes against public police (which the FLSA is) is unenforceable. They would only go to jail if they were ever prosecuted for al l we know they could've settled out of court.

[Stop Pretending]

Not being prosecuted doesn't mean they didn't commit a crime.

https://www.dol.gov/whd/regs/compliance/whdfs15.htm

http://www.calaborlaw.com/tip-poolin...ips-and-how-2/

https://www.workplacefairness.org/tipped-employees

Three sources, all of them confirming that the employer cannot take an employee's tips. How much the employee makes hourly does not affect their status as tipped employees.

But but, he can't find anything that says it isnt illegal, and they weren't prosecuted. So it must be legit. Right?

[zenkai]

Not being prosecuted doesn't mean they didn't commit a crime.

https://www.dol.gov/whd/regs/compliance/whdfs15.htm

http://www.calaborlaw.com/tip-poolin...ips-and-how-2/

https://www.workplacefairness.org/tipped-employees

Three sources, all of them confirming that the employer cannot take an employee's tips. How much the employee makes hourly does not affect their status as tipped employees.

This pertains to people getting paid a tipping minimum wage, not someone making above minimum wage, and they signed a contract. They are in legal trouble over other reasons since they were brought to a spotlight it's only logical to assume if they did something illegal with taking the wages they would be prosecuted as well.

[Endus]

http://radaronline.com/exclusives/20...say-dishonest/

According to an insider close to the Bouzaglos, this proves that Miranda intentionally stole money from them, despite signing the agreement.

“Samy and Amy did nothing wrong, because while they took the servers tips, they also paid them a much higher hourly wage than most other servers. And Miranda signed that agreement, so the Bouzaglos just want everyone to know how dishonest she is,” the source told Radar.

“Legally they have the option to prosecute her, but they’ve chosen not to.”

The source continued to defend the Bouzaglos, stating that a higher hourly wage gave the employees a secure income when business was slow.

Wish I had a more reliable source, but seeing how there is nothing on the web saying they are going to jail over pocketing tips and how high profile they are I assume they where legally in the right.

Your own source contradicts that. If they have the legal option to file charges, then what they did was criminal. Choosing to not file charges is not a demonstration of innocence; as I said in my earlier post, it could simply be that they believe Amy is so utterly disconnected from reality that demonstrating intent would be impossible.

Please explain it to me then.

This isn't complicated.

Tips belong to the employees, not the employer, not under any circumstances. The employer seizing those tips is not in any way different from your employer grabbing your wallet and taking all your cash. It's exactly the same thing. It's theft.

[Tyrianth]

Your own source contradicts that. If they have the legal option to file charges, then what they did was criminal. Choosing to not file charges is not a demonstration of innocence; as I said in my earlier post, it could simply be that they believe Amy is so utterly disconnected from reality that demonstrating intent would be impossible.


This isn't complicated.

Tips belong to the employees, not the employer, not under any circumstances. The employer seizing those tips is not in any way different from your employer grabbing your wallet and taking all your cash. It's exactly the same thing. It's theft.

I think the article is saying Amy had the option prosecuting the server taking tips.

[Endus]

This pertains to people getting paid a tipping minimum wage, not someone making above minimum wage, and they signed a contract. They are in legal trouble over other reasons since they were brought to a spotlight it's only logical to assume if they did something illegal with taking the wages they would be prosecuted as well.

None of those three sources apply to minimum-wage jobs exclusively. I doubt you even bothered to read them, or you'd have seen that.

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I think the article is saying Amy had the option prosecuting the server taking tips.

Then the "source" is "an insider close to the Bouzaglos", and I can just confidently state that they're just as wrong as the Bouzagos, or deliberately lying to cover for their friend. Because what they've stated is categorically false.

[zenkai]

Your own source contradicts that. If they have the legal option to file charges, then what they did was criminal. Choosing to not file charges is not a demonstration of innocence; as I said in my earlier post, it could simply be that they believe Amy is so utterly disconnected from reality that demonstrating intent would be impossible.


This isn't complicated.

Tips belong to the employees, not the employer, not under any circumstances. The employer seizing those tips is not in any way different from your employer grabbing your wallet and taking all your cash. It's exactly the same thing. It's theft.

Um you might want to read that again, they had the option to prosecute the waitress that pocket the tips.

[Thage]

This pertains to people getting paid a tipping minimum wage, not someone making above minimum wage, and they signed a contract. They are in legal trouble over other reasons since they were brought to a spotlight it's only logical to assume if they did something illegal with taking the wages they would be prosecuted as well.

Choosing not to prosecute is not an expression of innocence. You aren't given the option to prosecute in the first place if no crimes were committed.

Also, tipped employees are classified as employees who make more than $30 a month in tips on a regular basis. What you make aside from tips is not a matter of consideration in regards to whether or not your employer can legally pocket your tips. He cannot. The tips are exclusively for the employee the tips were meant for, and in pooled tips, employers cannot be part of the tip pool (which is why you'll rarely see the general manager of a Starbucks store working as a barista except in the absolute worst-case scenarios, because they're working for the employees to get their share of the tips).

edit: Also, a contract like the one signed by Amy's employees is unenforceable on every level. The size of the town they're in would have left former employees unable to find any jobs in food service after being fired by a mercurial psychopath if they were legally enforceable. Contracts that obviously one-sided don't hold water, so it's a non-consideration versus the legal protections in place for tipped employees.

[Endus]

Um you might want to read that again, they had the option to prosecute the waitress that pocket the tips.

See above.

No. They don't. Your source is either wrong or lying. They aren't even named; they're just some random person who knows the people who run the bakery. Not a legal professional, who'd actually know the law.

You don't get to cite that kind of non-source to contradict links to the actual laws, and expect it to get taken seriously.

Tips belong to the employee. Federal and state laws are clear on this. It's just not possible for an employer to prosecute anyone for keeping their own money. I seriously do not understand how you don't get this.

It doesn't matter what the contract says. If it contradicts the law, that means it's an illegal contract and its terms have no weight or relevance, and must be ignored. If I signed a contract signing over my first-born child, that doesn't mean the person holding that contract can legally enslave my kid; slavery's still illegal, meaning that contract cannot be enforced and isn't worth anything.

[Darsithis]

Um you might want to read that again, they had the option to prosecute the waitress that pocket the tips.

No they didn't. Ever. The source is wrong.

It is illegal in America to take tips from your servers and keep them. That contract is nonenforceable. The servers had the right to prosecute, not the other way around.

[zenkai]

Choosing not to prosecute is not an expression of innocence. You aren't given the option to prosecute in the first place if no crimes were committed.

Also, tipped employees are classified as employees who make more than $30 a month in tips on a regular basis. What you make aside from tips is not a matter of consideration in regards to whether or not your employer can legally pocket your tips. He cannot. The tips are exclusively for the employee the tips were meant for, and in pooled tips, employers cannot be part of the tip pool (which is why you'll rarely see the general manager of a Starbucks store working as a barista except in the absolute worst-case scenarios, because they're working for the employees to get their share of the tips).

edit: Also, a contract like the one signed by Amy's employees is unenforceable on every level. The size of the town they're in would have left former employees unable to find any jobs in food service after being fired by a mercurial psychopath if they were legally enforceable. Contracts that obviously one-sided don't hold water, so it's a non-consideration versus the legal protections in place for tipped employees.

You keep repeating and I have acknowledge but you fail to understand my point of view. They did sign a contract that they would not take tips, I have been trying to find anyone saying that contract is illegal and all the news sites slamming Amy's baking company never said anything in the contract was illegal.

I am in no ways saying every thing in the contract is legal but until I find proof the contract was illegal I will hold my opinion they did nothing illegal.

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See above.

No. They don't. Your source is either wrong or lying. They aren't even named; they're just some random person who knows the people who run the bakery. Not a legal professional, who'd actually know the law.

You don't get to cite that kind of non-source to contradict links to the actual laws, and expect it to get taken seriously.

Tips belong to the employee. Federal and state laws are clear on this. It's just not possible for an employer to prosecute anyone for keeping their own money. I seriously do not understand how you don't get this.

It doesn't matter what the contract says. If it contradicts the law, that means it's an illegal contract and its terms have no weight or relevance, and must be ignored.

You sure took them serious when you miss read that they said Amy's could be prosecuted.

Edit. Does it still belong to the employee if a contract was signed that they wouldn't accept tips?

[Deleted]

ABC.

Neverforget.

[Kathandira]

The intention of tipping is to show gratitude for the service you were provided. Not how well the manager did. Not how well the food was cooked. Which is why Managers and Cooks don't get tip share. The service team does. Servers, Hosts, Bar Tenders, and Bussers.

In each place I worked, the service team splits tips. I've seen upwards of 5% tip out from each server. That 5% is split between the rest of the service staff.

[zenkai]

I would love to find a source that says ABC violated the law with their contract then we all could put this whole thing to rest.

[Darsithis]

You keep repeating and I have acknowledge but you fail to understand my point of view. They did sign a contract that they would not take tips, I have been trying to find anyone saying that contract is illegal and all the news sites slamming Amy's baking company never said anything in the contract was illegal.

I am in no ways saying every thing in the contract is legal but until I find proof the contract was illegal I will hold my opinion they did nothing illegal.

The contract is unenforceable. I wouldn't say it is actively illegal since it would be the actions, not the contract, that determine if a crime has been committed.

[Endus]

You keep repeating and I have acknowledge but you fail to understand my point of view. They did sign a contract that they would not take tips, I have been trying to find anyone saying that contract is illegal and all the news sites slamming Amy's baking company never said anything in the contract was illegal.

Because it's blatantly obvious.

Federal and state law says tips belong to employees, and employers cannot have any part of them. A contractual agreement cannot change this. The contract is irrelevant, because the terms it tried to set out regarding this were themselves against the law.

[Kathandira]

You keep repeating and I have acknowledge but you fail to understand my point of view. They did sign a contract that they would not take tips, I have been trying to find anyone saying that contract is illegal and all the news sites slamming Amy's baking company never said anything in the contract was illegal.

I am in no ways saying every thing in the contract is legal but until I find proof the contract was illegal I will hold my opinion they did nothing illegal.

I can't say you are wrong about that. If you sign an agreement which wavers your rights, then you have signed away your rights.