Class Hall gold generation - WoD passive gold all over again?

[miffy23]

So I've been out of the loop of Beta for a few weeks now, I played Alpha for a while and at that point, the Follower missions did not award any significant amount of gold. Certainly not worth building up 12 Class Halls and collecting each day, as was the case in WoD.

Now I find that we suddenly have missions that award 1-2k, even more than epic World Quests (!), and I'm deathly afraid of them not putting them on accountwide cooldowns.

To clarify: in WoD you could farm insane gold "passively" simply by having the right garrison setups on multiple characters. It was nerfed later thanks to changing the internal mission respawn timers to accountwide from character-by-character, but it was still a decent source of passive income.

IF gold missions in Legion are back to char-by-char basis we will be back to square one. People like me with too much time and 12 characters will gain a massive, massive cashflow advantage and inflation will skyrocket - again.

Can anyone running multiple characters in Beta confirm whether we have shared or individual internal respawn timers for gold missions?

UPDATE:

After dabbling a bit more myself and asking around a lot in Beta it seems that the fears were unfounded.
Apparently the high yield gold missions are very rare, sometimes one doesn't even get any gold missions at all on one day, and most are low yield around 150-200 gold.

It seems gold value will be safe in Legion.

[Schizoide]

What a disaster. How could they make that mistake again?

Any missions rewarding gold that don't require you to leave the class hall and do something should have different rewards. Change the reward to artifact power or garrison resources^H^H^H^Horder hall supplies instead.

If you want gold, do something. Passive income is terrible, not only for its substantial impact on the economy but also gameplay. It incentivizes players to do stuff that simply isn't fun-- the facebook games they insisted on retaining for this expansion. And unlike expansion-specific currency like artifact power, it never ends. You always want more gold.

[Kubaal]

So I've been out of the loop of Beta for a few weeks now, I played Alpha for a while and at that point, the Follower missions did not award any significant amount of gold. Certainly not worth building up 12 Class Halls and collecting each day, as was the case in WoD.

Now I find that we suddenly have missions that award 1-2k, even more than epic World Quests (!), and I'm deathly afraid of them not putting them on accountwide cooldowns.

To clarify: in WoD you could farm insane gold "passively" simply by having the right garrison setups on multiple characters. It was nerfed later thanks to changing the internal mission respawn timers to accountwide from character-by-character, but it was still a decent source of passive income.

IF gold missions in Legion are back to char-by-char basis we will be back to square one. People like me with too much time and 12 characters will gain a massive, massive cashflow advantage and inflation will skyrocket - again.

Can anyone running multiple characters in Beta confirm whether we have shared or individual internal respawn timers for gold missions?

Why does it matter? Gold in this game has long been a joke (even prior to garrisons), the only people it effects are those shopping the BMAH. Who cares if people are buying BoEs on the AH. Does that effect your game play?

[Schizoide]

Kubaal, the economy was inflated beyond belief in WoD due to free gold from follower missions. This has all kinds of major repercussions for new and returning players who didn't run follower missions with multiple treasure hunters on 11 characters for the past 2 years. Everything is crazy expensive-- toys and pets cost thousands of gold now where before WoD they might have cost hundreds. New and returning players are priced out of the economy-- even green weapons without cool xmog appearances regularly cost hundreds of gold. The BMAH regularly sold items for the previous gold cap of 1 million gold, which was a crazy unattainable amount of money for the vast majority of the playerbase before garrison inflation.

Like I said earlier, it also incentivizes players to do stuff that isn't fun. I refreshed follower missions on 11 characters 2-3 times per day for months and months, and I hated every millisecond of it, but I couldn't help myself because it was just way too much money. That isn't a problem with my brain specifically. Lots of people did it. Many MMO players are achievers, and will do whatever it takes to get an advantage. It's a fundamental design problem, and one that previously to this thread, it seemed like Blizzard understood and was trying to correct.

[orgonutil]

you dont generate passively order resources to do missions every day in every alt without go outside and world quests

[Schizoide]

That's true, but if you only do gold missions on alts a stockpile of order resources could last weeks. If it's an easy way to make money, people will do it.

[Kubaal]

Kubaal, the economy was inflated beyond belief in WoD due to free gold from follower missions. This has all kinds of major repercussions for new and returning players who didn't run follower missions with multiple treasure hunters on 11 characters for the past 2 years. Everything is crazy expensive-- toys and pets cost thousands of gold now where before WoD they might have cost hundreds. New and returning players are priced out of the economy-- even green weapons without cool xmog appearances regularly cost hundreds of gold. The BMAH regularly sold items for the previous gold cap of 1 million gold, which was a crazy unattainable amount of money for the vast majority of the playerbase before garrison inflation.

Like I said earlier, it also incentivizes players to do stuff that isn't fun. I refreshed follower missions on 11 characters 2-3 times per day for months and months, and I hated every millisecond of it, but I couldn't help myself because it was just way too much money. That isn't a problem with my brain specifically. Lots of people did it. Many MMO players are achievers, and will do whatever it takes to get an advantage. It's a fundamental design problem, and one that previously to this thread, it seemed like Blizzard understood and was trying to correct.

Being someone who has played the AH for years, there has always been away for people to make boat loads of gold. For instance, in Cata I started a new toon on a new server to play with friends. 2 months after hitting max level I had over 250k gold. There has been a small percentage of players that have utilized this and have made a huge profit cornering the market. Its been going on for years. In WoD they made it easier for the rest of the player base.. I look at it as they finally made the player base equal again (gold wise).

[Schizoide]

Being someone who has played the AH for years, there has always been away for people to make boat loads of gold

When you make money on the AH you're simply moving it from another player. You aren't adding that money to the economy, so it does not cause inflation. In fact due to auction fees, you're helping to deflate gold.

[Kubaal]

When you make money on the AH you're simply moving it from another player. You aren't adding that money to the economy, so it does not cause inflation. In fact due to auction fees, you're helping to deflate gold.

When Im buying out complete stocks on the AH and relisting them for much higher prices it is inflating the economy.

[Emode]

When Im buying out complete stocks on the AH and relisting them for much higher prices it is inflating the economy.

You are actually taking more gold out of the economy with higher AH cuts?

[Cien]

When Im buying out complete stocks on the AH and relisting them for much higher prices it is inflating the economy.

krazy kris and perfect pete are on every server though, flooding the markets with 1 unit items x 500 for a 1/3 of the price, and people undercut spam under them, it never truly lasts

[Justpassing]

1-2k per mission...welp.

[Schizoide]

When Im buying out complete stocks on the AH and relisting them for much higher prices it is inflating the economy.

No. You aren't adding money to the economy, you're moving it around from other players. The auction fees deflate the economy.

- - - Updated - - -

However what Blizzard rather correctly managed and I applaud them for that is they actually managed to keep gold irrelevant to game progress overall. A poor player can still do exactly the same things as a rich player albeit with a bit more effort and probably much less vanity transmogs.

Your argument can be distilled down to "the in-game economy is irrelevant". I strongly disagree. Money should have value.

The vast majority of items are bind on pickup, so we can't even barter-- with gold inflated Zimbabwe-style and items not tradeable, most people can't participate in the economy at all. In a multiplayer environment, that is not a good thing. Getting free tradeskill mats from garrisons isn't an excuse for entirely destroying free trade for everybody that didn't borderline-exploit follower missions for the past 2 years.

[Deleted]

Afaik you need to earn class order resources from doing world quests and such, so it's not exactly passive. Also whats the cool down on these gold missions? If it's like once per week it's nothing like WoD.

[Dahij]

When Im buying out complete stocks on the AH and relisting them for much higher prices it is inflating the economy.

No, it's not, it's simply you having monopoly on an item and can choose your own price for it.

[Schizoide]

Afaik you need to earn class order resources from doing world quests and such, so it's not exactly passive. Also whats the cool down on these gold missions? If it's like once per week it's nothing like WoD.

For the first point, if you only do gold missions order resources will last a good long while. Don't know the cooldown, but I also don't want to log-in 11 characters every tuesday after work (if it's weekly). It's just poor gameplay and I don't see why they want to subject players to it.

They seemed to understand their mistakes in WoD, so why in the world would they be playing with fire again?

[miffy23]

Afaik you need to earn class order resources from doing world quests and such, so it's not exactly passive. Also whats the cool down on these gold missions? If it's like once per week it's nothing like WoD.

The problem is that tehre will be very easy ways of stocking up on order resources, like in WoD, for a while.
It will simply be the fastest and most efficient way to get gold, and the most counter-intuitive one for this game.

[Schizoide]

New and returning players were harmed. If you haven't played since MoP and you come into Legion with 50k gold to your name, you won't be able to buy a dang thing you actually want from other players.

It won't stop you from playing the game, certainly. But it will completely exclude you from the economy for quite a long time.

The moment gold gets more relevant is the moment that wow will turn completely p2p due to tokens and the such.

I agree that allowing players to buy gold with real money was a terrible thing. However, excluding most people from the player economy is even worse.

[miffy23]

The moment gold gets more relevant is the moment that wow will turn completely p2p due to tokens and the such.

Absolutely nothing stops a returning player from getting his hands dirty and gaining gold. Even now you can easily make 10k a day (90k/month) for next to no effort. There are even video guides showing what to do. Theres a sea of gold out there I really don't understand why you complain. As for "borderline exploit" thats not quite right. Playing garrisons to the max isn't "exploiting". If at any moment blizzard didn't want players to make so much gold all they had to do was change some settings.

And remember: Crafting in WoD (and general AH trading) were more or less ruined by garrisons and everyone making everything. So there had to be a way to compensate the gold lost from not trading so efficiently.

Overall though, noone was harmed. Give it couple of months and the rich will spend it all in BMAH/spiders/tokens.

It's not about anyone being harmed.
Obviously this does not affect raiding, pvp or anything.

It DOES affect the casual player that sees the value of the little gold he manages to obtain dwindle thanks to easily abusable mechanics for more active players.

[Kharum]

I hope so.