New research suggests that the American dream isn’t alive in Scandinavia

[Elegiac]

In 2013, a typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320 for public health care insurance. For the average family of two parents with one child that bill will be $10,989, and for the average family of two adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381.

I have health insurance through work, I pay about $45 a month for it, my employer covering the rest.

Even if I didn't have health care, $11,320 will cover a lot of doctor visits. You'd have to be pretty unlucky to benefit from insurance rates that high.

Are you seriously suggesting that Canadians pay eleven thousand dollars in healthcare taxation for a family of four.

[PC2]

You haven't explained anything. You just made absurd claims like you could eat on $200 a month and that is just not happening period,

Are people talking about families?

I typically spend $180 a month on groceries and I never look at prices when I'm at the store, I just get food I like. Most of it is healthy, a couple sugary exceptions.

[Xeones]

Are people talking about families?

I typically spend $180 a month on groceries and I never look at prices when I'm at the store, I just get food I like. Most of it is healthy, a couple sugary exceptions.

Wait... are you two talking about groceries and not counting total food expense, like fast food?

[Elegiac]

Wait... are you two talking about groceries and not counting total food expense, like fast food?

New research from the Gen-OT institute suggests people in a first world nation should be living off a diet of skinless chicken breast, steamed carrots and broccoli, and white rice.

[Spectral]

Once again, I'm not inclined to respect your opinion since it seems to be based on the idea that spending less than $100 a week on food is remotely viable let alone healthy.

I'm not sure how $14/day for food at home even sounds frugal. If you're cooking for yourself, you can cook really well for that price. What are you eating?

[May90]

You haven't explained anything. You just made absurd claims like you could eat on $200 a month and that is just not happening period,

I could move out on near minimum wage, but I would have to work over 40 hours a week in order to break even and that would not leave me any cash for anything beyond survival. Why would I move out of my moms house in order to lose all enjoyment from my life?

Last Sunday's grocery trip. Spent $36. Still have some food left from then. Bought mostly fruits, vegetables, potatoes, milk and a bit of chicken. Had near-free rice stored at home. Can't imagine how anyone who doesn't eat like elephant would need more food than that...

So, first you complain that people can't move out of their parents' homes, and now you say that if you moved out, you would lose all enjoyment from your life. So which one is it? And you definitely can work 40 hours a week and move out, that's not even a question. Especially since you live with your parents; it means you would generate like $1,500 extra income monthly.

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I moved to the US from freaking Russia, with $50/m income, lol. Cry me a river about hard-hard life of American people.

[Elegiac]

I'm not sure how $14/day for food at home even sounds frugal. If you're cooking for yourself, you can cook really well for that price. What are you eating?

Two thousand calories a day in a state with a very high sales tax.

[Spectral]

New research from the Gen-OT institute suggests people in a first world nation should be living off a diet of skinless chicken breast, steamed carrots and broccoli, and white rice.

If we switch it over to whole chickens, stews, beef, pasta, various veggies, curries, rice, and so on, that'd be a mixed, healthy diet, for way less than $14/person/day.

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Two thousand calories a day in a state with a very high sales tax.

I still have no idea what you're eating that costs this. I eat more like 3K calories per day and when I'm cooking at home it doesn't cost anywhere near that much. It's not like I'm frugal, it's just not hard to buy some beef, pasta (or rice), and vegetables and toss together a pretty good meal. Fruit or ice cream for dessert as desired.

[PC2]

Wait... are you two talking about groceries and not counting total food expense, like fast food?

I said groceries because that is all I typically eat. Fast food maybe once a month, I'll get a bacon crunchwrap.

[Spectral]

Why would I move out of my moms house in order to lose all enjoyment from my life?

This is one of the more depressing sentences of the day

I guess you'd learn how to budget though.

[Nihilist74]

I'm all for having a strong safety net like Denmark has but there is no reason why there welfare department cannot make requirements that their people are seeking employment, seeking some kind of trade training or getting an education. In America, if you are on food assistance, you must attend classes that help you find a job. Classes on resume writing, interviewing, and computer skills classes. I see no reason why Denmark cant apply this as well while still providing the same amount of benefits. If you don't attend the required meetings for American food assistance, they take your benefits away. I didn't go to college. I always had to work full time. I'm not very good at going to work and school at the same time. I would love to have been a Danish citizen, receive social services and attended college so that I could have a real career. Not really for the money but it would be nice to make more money. I would want it more so that I was doing closer to what I really wanted to do for a living.

[Xeones]

This is one of the more depressing sentences of the day

I guess you'd learn how to budget though.

That is what it's like. The one job I've held in my life where I would earn money to comfortably live on my own (excessively so really) required I work six days a week 12 hours a day. It wasn't a job I held long because I had absolutely no life while I was working there. It was actually depressing to work there and not be able to do anything.

[JohnBrown1917]

Groceries for a week is at least 100 dollars. Unless you're eating white rice and nothing else.

Is America that expansive? I spend 40 to 50 euro(45 to 55 dollar) per week here. That is for food(meat, vegetables, potatoes and spices), snacks, small things for my cat, drinks etc..

[Independent voter]

Is America that expansive? I spend 40 to 50 euro(45 to 55 dollar) per week here. That is for food(meat, vegetables, potatoes and spices), snacks, small things for my cat, drinks etc..

It depends were you are at, prices vary widely and remember even my state is roughly the same size as Germany and it's one of 50 states.

We pay less than $200 a month on groceries for the two of us but we do a lot of our own cooking. What's bad is when you eat at restaurants a lot, very expensive.

[Gsara]

Last Sunday's grocery trip. Spent $36. Still have some food left from then. Bought mostly fruits, vegetables, potatoes, milk and a bit of chicken. Had near-free rice stored at home. Can't imagine how anyone who doesn't eat like elephant would need more food than that...

So, first you complain that people can't move out of their parents' homes, and now you say that if you moved out, you would lose all enjoyment from your life. So which one is it? And you definitely can work 40 hours a week and move out, that's not even a question. Especially since you live with your parents; it means you would generate like $1,500 extra income monthly.

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I moved to the US from freaking Russia, with $50/m income, lol. Cry me a river about hard-hard life of American people.

Youre arguing with people still living off mom and dad so its useless to try and reason with them. Ive never in my life spent $400 a month on food for just me and my family of five spends roughly $500 a month total for food.

[May90]

That is what it's like. The one job I've held in my life where I would earn money to comfortably live on my own (excessively so really) required I work six days a week 12 hours a day. It wasn't a job I held long because I had absolutely no life while I was working there. It was actually depressing to work there and not be able to do anything.

Let me draw a picture of how cheap I used to live here, when I just came. This place is far from the worst in the US:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Bend,_Indiana

So, leggo. Monthly fees:
$285 - apartment
~$200 - food
$35 - phone
NET: $520/m.
(insurance is provided by the employer)

Apartment - found an offer for craigslist; folks were looking for a roommate.
Food - like I said before, $200 goes a long way here. If I really-really tried, I could probably cut food expenses to $100, while still eating somewhat healthy, but whatever.
Phone - basically it: I just need it to phone, nothing more.

Now, minimum wage in Indiana is $7.25/h. Suppose I work 40h-weeks, so roughly 160h/m. That gives us $1,256.67 monthly, over twice what we need.

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Sure, the life won't be fancy initially. But it is supposed to be hard. You have no career, you move out of your parents' place with no experience, no property, nothing. It will be hard everywhere, in any country. No one will give you everything on a silver spoon just because you exist. You have to put in some effort, to make some investments in your life, for it to kick in.

Like I said, I moved from Russia to the US, while making $50/m. Are you saying you can't move from your city to another, while making $1250/m? Come on, buddy...

Youre arguing with people still living off mom and dad so its useless to try and reason with them. Ive never in my life spent $400 a month on food for just me and my family of five spends roughly $500 a month total for food.

Well, I suppose I can see how one could spend over $400 on themselves alone... It would require a very-very inefficient budget spending though. Like buying lunch boxes, expensive seafood, etc.

[Deleted]

I'm all for having a strong safety net like Denmark has but there is no reason why there welfare department cannot make requirements that their people are seeking employment, seeking some kind of trade training or getting an education. In America, if you are on food assistance, you must attend classes that help you find a job. Classes on resume writing, interviewing, and computer skills classes. I see no reason why Denmark cant apply this as well while still providing the same amount of benefits. If you don't attend the required meetings for American food assistance, they take your benefits away. I didn't go to college. I always had to work full time. I'm not very good at going to work and school at the same time. I would love to have been a Danish citizen, receive social services and attended college so that I could have a real career. Not really for the money but it would be nice to make more money. I would want it more so that I was doing closer to what I really wanted to do for a living.

Yeah they have those requirements. Everywhere Ive been to in Europe you have to follow some sort of reeducational process. It;s not like they hand you the money KTHXBYE

[Masark]

Let me draw a picture of how cheap I used to live here, when I just came. This place is far from the worst in the US:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Bend,_Indiana

So, leggo. Monthly fees:
$285 - apartment
~$200 - food
$35 - phone
NET: $520/m.
(insurance is provided by the employer)

So you have zero transportation costs and are financially incapable of living independently.

http://livingwage.mit.edu/counties/18141

[May90]

So you have zero transportation costs and are financially incapable of living independently.

http://livingwage.mit.edu/counties/18141

Hmm? I had a bike, which is more than enough, given that I lived quite close to the campus, and there were lots of all kinds of shops nearby.

I spend more now; like I said, my total monthly spendings are around $1,100 or so. I live quite luxuriously by my standards, though, and I can't imagine what could make me spend more. Until I start needing the car badly (unlikely in the next 4 years), or get some really expensive hobby, or move to a much more expensive city, or get engaged with my partner moving in with me and not having any income - I can't see why I would ever spend more than that.

[Zafire]

Hmm? I had a bike, which is more than enough, given that I lived quite close to the campus, and there were lots of all kinds of shops nearby.

I spend more now; like I said, my total monthly spendings are around $1,100 or so. I live quite luxuriously by my standards, though, and I can't imagine what could make me spend more. Until I start needing the car badly (unlikely in the next 4 years), or get some really expensive hobby, or move to a much more expensive city, or get engaged with my partner moving in with me and not having any income - I can't see why I would ever spend more than that.

I only make $1460/mo and I have about $600 extra PER MONTH that I can spend on anything I want, and a lot of people here say that since my yearly income is so low (25,000-30,000~ yearly, depending on overtime) that I make shit money. I pay $425/mo for rent, water is paid for, and gas and electric are under $100/mo combined. Why on earth am I poor? People in certain parts of CA making three times as much as me have less money per month than I do.

Is wealth determined by how much you make, or how much wealth you can accumulate? I always assumed it was the latter.